I don't get how it's so inconceivable to some people that climate change can be a scam.
It snowed in the Sahara desert yesterday. First time in ages.>warming.
>>108334962climate changes all the time the scam is thinking we can do anything about it
>cold wave in europe>warming
>>108334962What human invention melted the last dozen mass glaciations? What brought on global warming to reverse the last ice age?
That line of best fit is assAlso >35 fucking years>in life's millions of years on earth>statistically relevant AT ALL
>>108334962nigger, expand it over a longer period of time and use time series analysis, use the ARIMA modeling in R and you will find your OLS line is shit faggot .....TIME SERIES ANALYSIS FAGGOThttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMGZtkMS3sQ
Let me know when theres a new Little Ice Age like there was starting in 1300 until 1800
>>108334962Is it possible that the scientific community is wrong about something? Absolutely. It happened multiple times in the past. Global warming could not be happening and/or could not be caused by humans.Is it likely that they are intentionally lying about global warming? Like in a big conspiracy involving most climatologists? With only politicians (who, being pooliticians, don't know shit about anything math related that requires more than two brain cells) speaking out against it? Pls don't be retarded and take off that tinfoil hat.
>>108335709consider rewatching al gore's documentary, many of his predictions were for a 10 year span, it aired in 2006, some laughts to be had
>>108336085>>108336172do these graphs include the time periods where practically all land animals fucking died?
>>108336441>pooliticians>pajeet pun out of nowherei swear that was an honest typing error.
>>108334962
>>108335258Climate change
>>108334962muh 97% scientific consensus.
The Arctic ice is below any standard band. See you in summer, with more heat days than before. Also idiots writing about the Antarctic, you don't fucking live in the Southern hemisphere, do you?
>>108337765It's called GLOBAL warming. The globe includes both emispheres.
>>108336955What is different models and measurements>/pol/ being so illiterate they can't understand climate scienceYou may as well deny evolution, herd immunity or any other science. But, I wouldn't expect less from you.
>>108337945ok, fine you coal industry cock sucking faggot.
>>108337945
>>108338189HOLY SHIT IS 2017 THE YEAR WE ALL DIE?!?!?!?!
>>108334962Now show it over 500 years
>>108338189>coal industry cock sucking faggot.Okay lets fuck our limping economy even more by forcing energy sources on people that cost twice as much but are 50% as efficient than conventional methods.
>>108338158yeah, muh christian board
>>108334962Your graph is proof that the climate is changing. You mean man-made climate change?
>>108338189Looks like its been lower before to me.What is your point?
>>108338474no it's the year faggots using argumentum ad absurdum are called stupid faggots.
>>108334962Zoom the graph out with a range of a couple thousand years and then we'll talk
>>108338515Did instruments to measure the ice caps even exist 500 years ago?
>>108338189Have you considered the fact that if global warming happens, the sea level rises, and the desert expands a lot of degenerates will drown and starve and die? I say let it happen, let God cleanse the world.
>>108338189Aight man. I'm too ignant to understand this.This chart is showing that:1) There a clear reduction in total ice concentration2)It's getting worse.3)the gap between 2016 and 2015 is the biggest in 50 years?Amiright?
>>108338158t. Underfunded climatologist
>>108334962it's really not just that the evidence is tenuous. because of course, as they're so fond of telling us, we're not scientists! who are we to question them, ever?so that aside, the real question is, who GIVES a fuck about global warming? WORST case scenario actually only improves things for america. it's not the end of the fucking world. not by a long shot. it could be 4 times worse than the worst they say it could be, which they're always wrong about, and still, who gives a fuck.
>>108334962Because the MSM told them it's real. You know, the same MSM that told them Hillary had the election in the bag.
>>108334962Because just about every anthropomorphic global warming model failed to account for no increases in average yearly temperature for the last 15 years.http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/global-warming-temperature-very-close-zero-over-15-years>“We're facing a puzzle,” Storch said. “Recent CO2 emissions have actually risen even more steeply than we feared.>“As a result, according to most climate models, we should have seen temperatures rise by around 0.25 degrees Celsius (0.45 degrees Fahrenheit) over the past 10 years,” he added.>“That hasn't happened,” Storch said. “In fact, the increase over the last 15 years was just 0.06 degrees Celsius (0.11 degrees Fahrenheit) -- a value very close to zero.>Storch said the United Nation’s Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) would have to address these facts in its next climate assessment report due out late next year.
>>1083385911. PV is at grid parity, it's competitive as installed by the end user. 2. I've checked the numbers and taxes and distribution costs make up more of the end price than generation costs.
>>108334962Nobody is saying Climate Change is a scam.It's Anthropogenic Climate Change that scammers would have you believe is a proven fact when the most anyone can say is that it may or may not be happening.We do not know if CO2 causes global warming, or is a result of global warming, or if past causes of global warming both caused global warming and CO2, the two being un causally related.
>>108339058Too much Civ II for you.
>>108334962Nice job, you found that climate change is real.Nobody is denying that.However, what people are denying is that climate change is man-made. You libfags can't prove it at all beyond your pathetic "Correlation implies causation" statistics malpractice
>>108334962I don't get what the scam is, I don't belive in climate change or global warming, but I do care about the environment and would rather not see it destroyed
>>1083384742017 will be interesting. Arctic sea ice is in bad-bad condition. No thick ice and extent is down. All depends on summer weather pattens how much it will be left in summer. My guess is not much and losng summer ice cover changes climate patterns and is an strong albedo feedback. So more change is expected.Shilling does not make issues go away.
>>108339424It that some sort of computerized tabletop game?
>>108338591Renewable energy programs can be pretty good.Denmark has made a multibillion dollar industry from their investment into it and can generate 140% of their electricity demands from it.In Scotland, they have produced enough power to power more than every home in the country.Unfortunately Westminster is fucking them by dropping support for renewables because they can't let Scotland replace their oil industry even though investors are keen in gaining Scotland's expertise on wind power.The other day a tory minister was criticizing wind power because the grid wasn't able to support exporting the amount of energy being produced.
Because we've had ice ages and temperatures more warm than todayAlso atmosphere had 5 times the co2 density than what we have today at one point, you just end up with really big trees that point.Worst thing we can do however, is allow 3rd expand too much and kill the land by draining the water
>>108338642Man is contributing to change. How much is the subject to study further.
>>108334962i think we are having an effect, but not enough. We should be exploiting this planet for everything it has, else we will never escape. We are a single celled organism fighting across an ocean.
>>108336441You dont understand how things like this work, there does not need to be some specific vast conspiracy for there to be vast trending towards a narative.Its the same thing as new agencies not reporting bad things about their sponsors, they might not be intentionally doing it, but rather just subconciously avoiding it. Likewise scientists who are dependent on funding for their livelihood might just decide contrary evidence is inconclusive and things that reinforce the narrative can be released with a little less scrutiny. And those who are legitimately convinced its happening (for whatever reason)? They are going to be biased around reaffirming that, its just human nature.Much of what a mob does is not calculated.
>>108334962>36 years, most of which before extreme EPA regulations>1 degree>2002?
>>108334962>Falling for the Overton window>Building the Space ElevatorPick only oneWhy bother debating whether it is real when it is an objective fact that it is easy to deal with it (if it were real) - all we have to do is build a space elevator.Is it possible to build a space elevator today?Yes:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qezLhypA0YThe key idea is the Orbital Ring version of the space elevator, not the geosynchronous tether concept you are familiar with.See, for example, Paul Birch's writings:http://www.orionsarm.com/fm_store/OrbitalRings-I.pdfThe orbital ring only requires tethers about 300 kilometers long which is technically feasible with common material like steel, but ridiculously straightforward with better and already available material like kevlar.
>>108340043There are some important questions. First, how much would it cost to do something like this?We need to send about 160 million kilograms of material into space (See Birch's boot strap estimates in part 2: http://www.orionsarm.com/fm_store/OrbitalRings-II.pdf)We have rockets available at $2000/kg costs to LEO today in "mass production" mode, which is only about 10-20 launches per year. Compared with the couple thousand launches necessary for a space elevator, $2000 is an unreasonably high upper bound for launch costs.We also need to include the cost of materials. A space elevator is about 98% steel and aluminum, 1% kevlar, and 1% other such as superconducting magnets. Most of the mass (98%) cost around $1/kg, with an average cost per kilogram of no more than about $10 per kilogram.Summing the above up, we get about $430 billion in launch costs plus another $1-2 billion in material costs.In other words, we can have a space elevator for less than $450 billion - significantly less than one year worth of DoD spending, one bank bailout, many times less than a variety of pointless wars, etc. This is well within our reach financially in other words.
>>108339961OP explicitly said "scam". That word implies an intent behind it.
>>108338158>modelWhy would a graph of existing temperature records require modeling?
>>108339058based mexico for suddenly having reason
>>108339283> Not caring about your habitat.How american from you.
The Antarctic is frozen because of ocean currents. The North Pole is not a land mass which makes it more sensitive to climate change.We have 50 record hot days for every record cold, the planet is getting hotter, oceans are becoming acidified and are rising and it is all because octane turns into upto 8 CO2 molecules when burned in oxygen.It took 300 million years to build our carbon fuel reserves, you can't dump it all out in 300 years and not expect consiquences, especially considering the atmosphere is only 60 miles thick.I don't understand how people can deny climate change, it makes perfect sense and it's measurable.
>>108338158All three graphs are by the Goddard Institute for Space Studies, a division of NASA, or it's longtime director, James Hansen. Why would the same group of people continuously adjust historical temperatures downward?Keep in mind these are the exact same people you are likely quoting when you make claims of long-term global warming since ~1880.
>>108339438This, consider the following.>We destroy our economy for the sake of muh mother nature>Santorini Caldera goes fucking nuclear>Dumps a ton of fucking shit into the atmosphere>Environment is completely fucked worldwide>Ice Age 2.0>BUT MUH MOTHER NATURE GUYS!!!!>IT WAS TOTALLY WORTH RUINING LIVES AND COUNTRIES FOR THIS OUTCOME!!!>WE TOTALLY DIDN'T WASTE ANY TIME OR MONEY, EVEN THOUGH IT MADE ZERO FUCKING DIFFERENCE IN THE ENDThis is exactly why these green faggots can all eat shit. Shortsighted tree hugging shits cant even be around children alone, why would you trust them with something like the entire planet's environment.
>>108339961There's enough money going around to fund climate change denialism, plenty of folks to benefit from it. Only there's no credible scientists who are actually publishing papers on this. Why???
>>108339771I mean, i just farted. Thats effecting the climate in some small way, sure. But is it significant? Is it more significant than the species that would be alive today if man never existed would be changing the climate?We have plenty of pressing enviornmental issues getting overlooked because you cant sell carbon credits or funnel money to your friends through their climate GMOs.Im not convinced this is anything more than a doomsday cult picked up by western 'intellectuals' to fill the void left by their tendency to atheism.
>>108340105How much material is required for a sun shade that blocks 2% of the solar intensity (enough to completely reverse any hypothetical global warming)?Only about 20 million tonnes.With a space elevator in hand, our cost to deliver payloads to space drops to about $1/kg.We can construct the sunshade out of thin wire mesh of pretty much any material, aluminum for example, which costs about $1/kg.In other words, a sunshade would only run us about $100B inclusive of material, construction, and launch costs.A one time tax of $15 per person in the world is enough to undo global warming if you have a space elevator.A one time tax of $100 per person is enough to build a space elevator and then build a sunshade.And most importantly, all of this is cold, hard objective fact. Nothing to dispute. So next time global warming comes up, pick wisely between the two:(1) circle jerk in the Overton window(2) talk about how can solve it all for a one time fee of $100/person, rendering permanently obsolete this political wedge
>>108340157The scam is the people who encourage and profit from it, not the larger body that supports it.>>108340874Because if you publish a paper questioning it you instantly lose scientific credibility.
>>108340601You restructure your economy.Science advancing has always restuctured economy. Being ultraconservative - do you drive horse carts?
>>108340250That's the italian flag. I'm no dirty mexican, we moved booze and drugs with class, back in the time before "gangster" was turned into "gangsta" by jewery trying to make blacks look cool.
>>108334962>1979-2014>1979It really makes me think.
>>108341050Shilling should have removed from science, I agree. Shills have hijacked the issue and leftist fucks tainted it to channel profits.But climate change is real.
>>108341281COuld we solve CA drought by putting mirrors in orbit to heat the ocean just off the coast?
>>108341322>You restructure your economy.If green energy sources are so scientifically advanced then why are they ALL so fucking inefficient? Because you say so? No.If they were so "advanced" then they should easily out compete burning fucking dinosaurs for energy.
>>108334962Of course you won't post the temperature curve in Antartica because a warmer ice has a lower viscosity and thus speards more easily over the sea.>>108335258>>108335524>Monthly-scaled and punctal events taken out of context are relevant in a decade/century trend.Stop being retards pl0x.>>108338158>>108338189>>108338358>>108337765Glad to see not everybody is a complete retard on this board.Geez, I get we have the left and shit but do we seriously need to ignore facts like they do when we find it inconvenient ? Also, why the fuck should climate change be a lefty issue when now climate change could be a good reason to criticize non-whites since they are now te main cause of it.
>>108334962>I don't get how it's so inconceivable to some people that climate change can be a scam.>For a century, the scientists of the world have conspired in the shadows to deceive the public about global warming in order to bring about...something>Fortunately, a few brave souls financed by the fossil fuel industry managed to pierce the veil of liesDoes this sound like something a rational person can take seriously?
>>108341322but if something is in your interest you will do it yourself, you don't need an horde of liberal bureaucrats to force you to do it and pay them to tell you to
>>108341773Because this field is still developing.Make science great again and remove shilling trom it, otherwise we get some version of our "islamic science"
>>108339058Deserts shrink when there's warming idiot. It's even starting to happen now. It's part of why CO2 correlates with but lags temperature
>>108342055>to bring about... somethingwhat are research grants?
>>108342383reasearch grants are totally worth more than oil industry money
>>108340601We will destroy the economy by investing in oil industry assets that are all over valued because we can't use them without destroying the planet.Coal is dead because of natural gas, China is spending 60 billion in 4 years on renewables and solar and wind are the fastest growing energy sources in the us. In 4 years solar employment has doubled to 200,000 people, and it has nowhere to go but up.Fossil fuels are Africa tier, read a fucking book and come up with something better, red states are shit holes for a reason: wells dry up and billionaires can go we're ever they want, trashing your natural resources and leaving you with the clean up bill from the popped bubble.
>>108342188There is economic interest conflict. Many of our problems come from retarded disconnected (((economic))) model(s).
>>108342500no, but he was implying there is no reason for scientists to make up shit, when actually there is a yuge problem with fake data on academia
>>108342041I have yet to see anyone post proof that HUMANS are responsible for climate change.Call yourself the retard, retard.>>108342249That sounds like your problem then, deliver a product that can compete or gtfo. >>108342516>China is spending 60 billion in 4 yearsThat is pathetic, is that supposed to mean something?>Fossil fuels are Africa tierOh yea? Then why can't your hippies shit compete?
>>108342383Hah, you'd think that people who can pull of a scam like that would aim a little higher than you average scientist's salary.
>>108341733That is one approach, but perhaps not the best.By building a space elevator, you immediately give mankind access to many orders of magnitude higher energy throughput than we currently possess. Solar power becomes immediately profitable and not just profitable but viable as base power.One issue solar power has today is that it is intermittent. By placing your generating capacity in space, you can get constant, predictable, reliable power generation.Among the many consequences of such a shift in the developmental potential of mankind is that we can operate essentially unlimited desalination plants. California can retain its desirable sunny weather, while also having as much water as anyone could possibly want. Essentially every problem facing humanity is of this sort - easy solvable by the building of a space elevator and deployment of already existing technology.
>>108334962I don't understand why people are so up in arms about it, anyway; the market will come up with some way to stop it or its effects at some point. People are trying so hard to prevent climate change, that they are actually shooting themselves (and their country, by way of regulations) in the foot. Sad!
>>108342670k, but in this case shilling would be a lot more profitable for the other side. as i said before, the scientific consensus might be WRONG on something, but believing in a conspiracy for GW is tinfoil hat level of stupidity.
>>108343010>muh invisible hand
>>108342757Again, you use (((economic))) to explain everything, This is excelmonkey tier.
>>108342820if global warming was a scam, it would not be perpetrated by the average scientist, but by the leading scientists, which do not have an average salarythe average scientist falls in line because questioning published articles is high treason>>108343076of course it is more profitable to shill on the other side, but there is only a number of shilling jobs to be filled, and some will be forced to shill for the least paying offers
>>108343182Go hug a tree hippie.You think oil, coal and NG got where it is by subsidies and grants? No, it was private investor fueled innovation, The American people owe you NOTHING. Go pay for your own crackpipe technology and maybe we'll buy it off of you if you can prove it isn't complete bullshit.
>>108343500"some" being, like, 99% of climatologists?
>>108342757We're definitely forcing a little bit of warming, CO2 is a greenhouse gas and we've gone from 250 to 400 ppm in the last 100 years. That said, CO2 doesn't warm nearly as much as they want you to believe nor is the climate as sensitive as they claim. Solar activity will always be the primary driver of climate
>>108343010Invisible hand works bad in nature conservation. You will run into problems when there is already a lot of damage done and then start spending your resources to deal with damage. If you listen to other scientists too besides economists you get better results.
>>108343500>the average scientist falls in line because questioning published articles is high treasonYou do realize that if that were the case, there would be no progress in any field of science whatsoever?
>>108334962Even if it was, literally everything that comes from trying to reverse it is positive for society.Obama's green energy subsidies were one of the few things he did that I agree with. Hopefully those businesses have found enough of a market to continue growing even though the subsidies themselves will likely end.
>>108343525I am not treehugger, I am right wing.But you not listening to scientists is nigger muslim tier retarded approach.Muh civilization.
>>108341682>But climate change is real.No one but the kikes lying about what others have said have ever claimed it isn't. The data doesn't support that it's manmade.None of the CO2 projections have ever correlated with anything when viewed on a timeline larger than the last fifty fucking years. In the 70s these lying kikes were projecting a damn ice age. Now it's a warming phase. Now it's neither so they picked a nebulous no-name that covers both directions because they're making this shit up. We have millions of years of records that support the temperature of the planet shifts dramatically. The kikes argue that their numbers over the last few years (using methods that have changed multiple times) is somehow statistically relevant.How accurate were thermometers in the 1880s btw? The kikes argue that they must control all the world's manufacturing because of a1.5°F variance vs the years where they still burned whale oil for light?It's fucking bullshit, and it isn't "science."
>>108343653yes, that's how a democracy works, private money to deny global warming is scarce/more valuable, paying the ones who came up with the best shit for debunking GW, public money instead, being 'free', as in, it's not your fucking money, you just buy more and more scientists to agree with your stance, there you have a 99% majority (totaly hypothetical scenario, so not what's happening, but for the sake of argument) :^)>>108343769hehe but that's the case, at least in molecular biology, some experiment contradicts something published? scrap it!
>>108343653except thats a number obama pulled out of his ass based on a study of studies that wasnt even surveying everything about climatology but only looking at papers which already started under the assumption man made global warming was real, and were just trying to quantify it. Of those that set out to do that, 3% of them actually found out "whoops we were wrong about the whole thing" and so thats where the 97% came from, which has steadily increased to 98 and then 99% in his NON FACT CHECKED bullshit speaches and the left just parrots it all and echo chambers it into 'truth'. Its fake news.
>>108334962>It's cooling>Wait! it's warming!>Wait no..>Fuck it, it's changing!Make up your mind faggots.
>>108343684>We're definitely forcing a little bit of warmingAll I'm asking for is unquestionable, undeniable proof. Are WE doing it, and DOES IT MATTER.. Is that so terrible? Apparently so because the nightmare pushing shills act like I just told all the niggers to go back to Africa.>>108344035I'll listen to whoever I want faggot. I'm not obligated to listen to your (((Scientists))).Would you like to know why its called climate change and not global warming now?http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/environment/globalwarming/11395516/The-fiddling-with-temperature-data-is-the-biggest-science-scandal-ever.html
>>108334962its probably the largest propaganda project ever conceivedidk, people are already caring less, how much was MUH CARBON an issue in the us election?
>>108343688Checked. I'm not saying the market will conserve nature, just that (as soon as it is profitable), it will find some way to reverse some (or all) of the effects of climate change.
>>108344338that's why i used the word "like". it's some number close to 100%, i didn't give a shit about the precise figure. and made i t clear i didn't by writing like some dumb valley girl talks.
>>108334962Because you're cherry picking data, and ignoring the fact that global temperatures are steadily rising due to identifiable, man-made causes.
>>108344260>hehe >but that's the case,In other words, there has been no progress in science since the beginning of science? Are we living in a simulation then?
>>108344486>how much was MUH CARBON an issue in the us election?Trump won, so no one cares.He directly appealed to coal miners based on the promise that he would put them back to work.
>>108344417The warming effect of CO2 and our manmade CO2 emissions drastically raising the levels in the atmosphere is not disputed by even scientists that dispute global warming, it's pretty undeniable. The problem is that most of the warming from the (((models))) is from (((climate sensitivity))) which is a totally unproven concept. They're basically just guessing at the effect. that various factors will have. You can expect around a 1 C increase every time CO2 levels double, which isn't that much and there are diminishing returns involved so basically man-made warming is nothing to worry about.
>>108335377We need a broad CO2 tax. A government issued carbon tax is the only solution. Every person, each pet, livestock, and all devices should have a carbon detector so everyone can be taxed accordingly. Developing nations like China can be taxed at a much lower rate as they are the world's manufacturers.
>>108334962Because it's trivial.No one will argue that the climate changes, but you mays well tell us that the sun is hot and water is wet.
>>108345351Isn't there a radiation saturation point for Co2? There is only so much solar radiation that can be absorbed and re-emitted as heat and C02 doesn't even absorb the entire spectrum thought the ceiling may still be above safe levels.On top of that, who's to say that something like a sudden oceanic algae bloom wouldn't negate the problem entirely in a few years, it's not like all of our air comes from trees.Also, it's been hotter on earth before, much hotter than it is now. Do people forget how green land got it's name?
>>108344244Let me explain you the non-trivial issue of climate change.Earth climate is complex system, it is in constant change but more or less stable in short 100 year periods (there are volcanoes and meteorites wrecking it from time to time and then you get some jumps, too).We are affecting it changing the albedo of planet, changing the atmosphere content and changing the biosphere.All those systems have effect on Earth climate. And there are feedbacks in Earth systems that add to climate change or start to stabilize it.Also Earth is currently coming out of the last ice age so there is natural change too, The point is that ourcontributions add to the rate of this change and fuck with Earth systems evolved to deal with it to balance out change. Now we need science to figure out where this new altered system balances out and what should be done if it fucks with our habitat too much.Sometimes the rate of change being too fast can kill you, anon.
>>108346092>Isn't there a radiation saturation point for Co2?The effect is logarithmic. You will get to a point when adding more will not make any real difference. But technically, even Venus isn't saturated.
>>108346092That's why it increases per doubling rather than linearly afaik. See pic kek, tiny bit of forcing but then (((feedbacks))) are supposed to cause way more warming.Yeah the temperature has differed by about 10C over the past 500k years and during that time CO2 didn't cause any real forcing, it always lagged temperature changes created by solar activity or things like supervolcano eruptions.
>>108346767>But technically, even Venus isn't saturated.But venus is much closer to the sun so it's radiation absorbtion rate would be much higher. I get your point though.>>108346827>but then (((feedbacks))) are supposed to cause way more warming.Sounds like a bunch of fearmongeing shit to me, would make a great sales pitch.>things like supervolcano eruptionsGlad you brought that up, I did earlier as well. If we listen to the OTHER nightmare shills they say a caldera will fuck us too, but that will fix global warming as well no? So basically we can do nothing to control this unpredictable piece of shit flying through space we call home.>temperature changes created by solar activityAgreed, I remember that unusually stable phase we had a few years back, had a drought through the whole thing, atmospheric stability is terrible for crops.
>>108344929https://phys.org/news/2013-09-science-crisis.html
>>108347721Dude, you can "reproduce" global warming in a lab. This is a century old concept.
One more thing to consider with climate change is that if we fuck with Earth too much we can trigger runaway warming - the situation when Earth balancing systems can no more deal with rising temperatures. The positive feedbacks kick in and we destroyed negative feedbacks to deal with it.Ice is there to add some stabilization. When ice is melt we get sudden jump in temperature rise because it has such physical property thatmelting 0 degree C into 0 degree C water takes as much energy as takes rising temperature of water 22 degrees C.Look it up and think about implications if we lose Arctic sea ice.There sure is more in the field of climate science. Let scientists do their work and stop shilling in science because of muh economic profit to some friend or damage to some foe.
>>108348317You can reproduce the principal mechanic behind it but their are far too many varibles on a global scale for actual lab reproduction.You can prove that Co2 is heated by radiation a la the atmosphere but Co2 isn't a static variable in the atmosphere, neither are a lot of other things.
>>108348364* ... melting 0 degree C ice to ...
>>108347349Pretty much. The last time a supervolcano erupted humans almost went extinct, there was only 10000 of us left or some shit, and there have been a few events in history where all life on earth almost ended. Hence why a few scientists have suggested the way to ensure human survival isn't to worry about CO2 levels but to keep industrializing and teching up until we can colonize other planets. Life ending from man-made causes is a possibility but if we "go back to nature" like the hippies want then life ending is a certainty. The core could run out of fuel and cool, the sun could supernova, we could get hit by an asteroid, etc.
>>108348547Well the point is, if man-made global warming is real than in can't be a scam, right?
>>108348317My point was showing the existence of a recent integrity issue in modern scientific research. Its actually a pretty well known issue in the scientific community but it does not get as much mainstream attention as it should. Mostly because it doesn't net clicks.
>>108348799>the way to ensure human survival isn't to worry about CO2 levels but to keep industrializing and teching up until we can colonize other planets.Yeah, I can't wait to go to Mars on my coal-powered spaceship.
>>108339084We're almost there, you're missing one thing: what causes ice to reduce?
>>108348364First things first, legalize marijuana so we can begin to industrialize hemp. Hemp will save us all; prove me otherwise.
>>108348799>there was only 10000 of us left or some shitMy god....that would be perfect.Imagine, Africa, India, and China all taken care of in one go.>keep industrializing and teching up until we can colonize other planetsFuckin aGood luck getting tree hugging jews to understand that.>>108348886>>108349010You seriously underestimate the jew dude.Also...>What is nuclearWe sure as hell aren't getting there with wind power and solar panels, use your brain.
>108339283 (You)it doesn't matter if the habitat gets a bit hotter, you moron. we'll just grow oranges in alaska.
>>108341733>>108341281could we put solar lenses in place to scorch california into a glass wasteland?
>>108349282We aren't getting there at all as long as there's any kind of deficiency with energy, production, or anything stopping maximum comfort in the short term. Its too easy to cancel a space program as a symbolic measure of cutting costs, and that's true for both parties.We'll never have a truly engaged space program again unless we've hit a post scarcity society.
>>108349553Why can't we just use our old nuclear stock on them, you know, clean house. Out with the old, in with the new.
>>108349010Kek. Well if they start earmarking all carbon tax revenue for fusion research I might be ok with it but like the american said solar and wind aren't the answer either.
>>108349162maybe we should burn some fat of americans for some time in order to not fuck up our planet before we have means to fix our damage...I am all for technological progress but the non-trivial issues can not be adressed in trivial ways.As for hemp - are you hemp merchant?
>>108349686>unless we've hit a post scarcity societyHaha no dude. You just wait, when ONE person figures out a viable way to mine asteroids it will literally be gold rush 2 electric boogaloo.Theres gold in them there belts brother, and diamond, and iron and titanium and water and everything else.
>>108334962Climate is always in a constant state of change.Man has little impact on this.
>>108349429Bit...If this bit is too much then you survive outside only in freezer.Rate of change matters.
>>108349931can we get refugees from those asteroids? we need more engineers, and astronauts, and scientists...
>>108345420Human increase or decrease in CO2 doesn't do shit. Temperatures are purely dictated by solar output.
>>108349282>We sure as hell aren't getting there with wind power and solar panels, use your brain.Ha, you sure?>>108349722It's worth pointing out that Fusion power research has already consumed billions of dollars of tax money without much to show for it.
>>108350137BUILD PLANETARY FORCEFIELD
>>108350345>Ha, you sure?Yes, it's too inefficient in its current state for manned flight. It could power computers but it could never power engines.
>>108349931We can already synthesize perfect diamonds in a lab. I doubt gold is too far behind.The only thing that would legitimize an asteroid mining operation is a net gain in energy from a constant system of launches into orbit and landings to bring back whatever energy source we're mining. Maybe the fabled space elevator will solve the problem, but first there has to be a readily available energy source in the asteroids and then there has to be a way to cheaply turn it into electricity.
>>108350214>Temperatures are purely dictated by solar output.Why aren't they going down then?
>>108342055>WHAT ARE CARBON TAXES???dummy
>>108350544>I doubt gold is too far behind.as if the jews would allow that.Its not really to bring anything back, I'm talking about expansion. Why go to earth for stuff? just get it from the local rock floating around. It would solve a major resource problem and open up a huge avenue for expansion and profit.Literally everyone would want a monopoly on space.
>>108339771If trying hard, the average person can only reduce their carbon footprint by 20% best case.I'd recommend collecting rainwater, farming potatoes and sewing your own clothes.
>>108334962The Earth has been in an ice age for the last several thousand years and we're just now coming out of it. The climate is heating up, but humans have absolutely nothing to do with it. Short of mounting a couple of massive fucking thrusters on the earth to move it a few dozen miles further from the sun, there's nothing we can do to prevent, slow or speed up the earth's natural heating and cooling cycles.
>>108350925t. professor Hubert J. Farnsworth
>>108350789You mean the scientists get a cut or something? How much?
>>108350214That anon was clearly joking...>>108350345The potential benefit is ridiculously huge, we'd be stupid not to keep investing in it for the foreseeable future.
>>108350214Not true.Earth can trap or reflect this input. And store it as in coal or oil or tree. And release stored energy as in forest fire or power station.And use water - ice, ice - water transition to manage the input.There is more.
>>108351033>The potential benefit is ridiculously hugeI know, but it's still "big gubberment" isn't it?
The scam with global warming is about destroying nations and rich people who built their wealth on oil. The globalists (bad ones), are useing stock marked for their gains. The war is on the rich people of sovereign nations because they are the only ones that can fight back. Reason for proparty tax for example being added here. Poor people dont own land or building. Rich people do. The scam is about destroying rich people. They ruin countries with welfare programs that rich people support with taxes. Then they ruin rich people. Then everybody is equaly broke. Slavery 101.
>>108350797>Literally everyone would want a monopoly on space.Yes, after the EXXXTREME initial investment to make going up there affordable for the average business. That's why all government funded R&Ds exist, because no executive is going to make the decision to put in place a project that won't see profit for GENERATIONS down the line and thats only if a) they get to it first and b) nothing goes wrong in the meantime and those high investment costs need to be used more immediately.There's too much profit still to be made on the planet's surface to invest in cheap space travel, but until cheap space travel exists, the profit for going to space won't be there.
https://xkcd.com/1732/
>>108351527>The scam with global warming is about destroying nations and rich people who built their wealth on oil.That's retarded, anon. The green energy companies are just as privately owned as the oil companies.
>>108351535>EXXXTREME initial investment to make going up there affordable for the average business.They are already working on it, they started like 5 years ago or something. Some absurdly rich dudes started it up.
>>108351799I hope you're right anon, because all I'm seeing in the modern space program is empty promises and a 50/50 success/failure launch ratio from SpaceX.
>>108350925>just coming out of itAnon...>>108351516I'm not a capitalist ideologue
too late to even bother replying and reading the responses, but every time this is posted you need to remind the faggots that climate change deniers don't actually existwhen this cult sees their models failing to predict anything, the evidence failing to show up year after year, they have to invent something to keep the grant money and fear goingso we end up with "climate change deniers"i will take a 20-year bet with anyone here so long as we can both verify every requisite detail.
>>108351762The profit is nowhere near. And when everybody has the sun, who will you export sun to?
>>108334962i think that antarctica just has to struggle with warming of their climate because theyre underneath the equator. i dont think theres global warming. in addition south africas growing use of factories for automobiles have increased pollution in the surrounding areas. so i think south africas factories could be affecting antarcticas weather. but other than that, being that antarctica is pretty isolated, it's just something have to deal with living under the equator.
>>108352394>when this cult sees their models failing to predict anythingFun fact, global warming was predicted before computers even existed.>i will take a 20-year betI wouldn't recommend, people betting against global warming lose almost every time.
>>108352537No one, but what makes you think a government will suddenly take control of a private market? There's still profit to be made there, and when everyone knows energy is basically free, minus upkeep costs, anything less that universal cheap energy won't be stood for, assuming we still have our second amendment rights.
>>108338189also you have to keep in mind that animals dig through ice to get fish or to get on land from the water and etc.
>>108342500Actually they are. Government funded climate change research grants alone are $10 billion a year. The fossil fuel industry spends $100 million a year on climate change research. With $10 billion a year up for grabs, plus academic suicide to consider, you might think that there is an incentive to fall on the side of cataclysmic climate change.
>>108338826you dont need thousands of years to analyze it
>>108352724anthropogenic global warming? in any capacity that matters or any capacity that demands drastic behavioral, industrial, and governmental shifts to address? and in any capacity that realistically can be addressed by the aforementioned? never.again, i don't want to use the word "strawman" and didn't in the first post because it's obnoxious. but you realize what you're doing, right?
>>108351715>xkcd>comparing trends in year by year measurements over the last 100 years to inferred estimates of temperature across millennia tens of thousands of years ago.
energy production levels will ONLY DECREASE as time goes by. THEREFORE temperature will ONLY DECREASE as well. according to the LAWS OF PHYSICS.
>>108353043Do you have a source for the $10 billion a year?I can tell you right off the bat that the fossil fuel industry spends zero money of climate change research. They don't launch satellites, they don't do arctic expeditions, they don't create models etc. People are paid by the industry primarily to go on TV and say what the industry wants them to say.
>>108352906As an addendum, it honestly could go either way, even if it stays in the private sector.Just look at health care or education. A constant cycle of vendors raising prices, forcing people to borrow more money, incentivizing vendors to raise prices, and so on. On the other hand, it could be like the internet, a patchwork of privately owned services people use on a constant basis constantly being encroached upon by the government trying to expand regulation upon it.Its a scary future, but more energy at a cheaper price is a good thing for society. It was a good thing for automation, food, construction, medicine, travel, trade, firearms, and everything other market that has been exponentially expanded by new discoveries.
>>108353413Not if we are past of the point where natural feedbacks kick in and climate will stabilize out at much higher temperature level.Leave it to scientists, you have no glue.
>>108353816He actually seems to think that global warming is caused by waste heat, lel.
>>108353413You should study more physics
>>108353998I saw it too.We are fucked.
>>108352906Gov wont take control over private market. This isnt the goal. They want private market there. They just dont want anybody doing really really well. They want to give to people just enough so they dont stand up for injustice and just little enough so they dont die. The goal is slavery. Working slaves that only care about their basic needs, are preoccupied with work and meaningless activities, slaves that do not realise they are slaves. The best kind of slaves. Global warming is just one of many things they use to accomplish this.
>>108353413As a man grows older he will find himself fapping more to CHRISTMAS CAKES instead of LOLIS according to the LAWS OF HENTAI.
>>108334962You mean to say we can't get Africa to go green?
>>108354683Africa should grow fucking forest right now to absorb CO2. Instead it Africa grows negroes eating forest.
>>108354443Again, retarded.As long as a private sector exists, companies will have the liberty to fulfill the demand of free citizens. The companies who do better can pay people more to pioneer the next method of lowering costs, expanding production, manage better, etc. These higher wages mean more demand, and so on. The only way governments can stop this is through the elimination of the free market, either through price or production ceilings, favoritism, or some other kind of stopgap to the basic laws of supply and demand.Unless your definition of "slave" is choosing to work a nine to five to come home to a house full of shit you chose to bought and the people you chose to surround yourself with, I don't see how energy being just the next big thing to be made cheap and mass produced helps the government to create dependence on the state and curtail individualism. If anything, its way easier to do that with limited resources, because then you have a semi-legitimate reason to ration and implement those regulations on the free market we talked about earlier.
>>108339107 >>108342326 >>108343684 >>108344486 >>108345351 >>108346827 >>108348799 >>108349722 >>108351033 >>108352214 >>108353337 >>108354550 >leaf
>>108334962Because environmentalism got fucked by bipartisan bullshit.Environmentalism is an apolitical concept of preservation that was actually invented by republicans (I.E Teddy Roosevelt). We need the environment to be healthy so that we are healthy, we need biodiversity so we can enhance our understanding of biology and have access to the countless unique and useful chemicals species produce. The problem is the shittiest elements of human nature are very resistant to environmentalism because it has long term effects and requires some level of sacrifice. If there is anything humanity hates doing, it's planning beyond it's own lifespan.At a crucial point in American history some really stupid shit backed by just terrible circumstances split the issue. This cuck Al Gore comes out of nowhere and decides to make the left "the environmentalist" party. His idea? Nothing but taxes and more taxes. At the same time neo-con retards dominated the right. This was the period when religious fundamentalism was saturating the right for some bizarre reason. The problem with christfaggotry of this caliber is that there is that every generation is duped into believing rapture will happen in their life time (Specifically looking at you, mormons). They believe the world is just a god's test and all is there to rape and destroy because it doesn't matter.This probably the main reason why the right, instead of answering Al Gore with a more attractive solution, chose to just shit on environmentalism.But there is a reason why neither the left or right offer any real solutions is because as I mentioned, it requires sacrifice. There is no money in environmentalism, no direct beneficial results. It's preparedness for preparation and preventing problems before they arise.It conflicts with both capitalism and communism and affects the freedom of industry. So it's essentially a fucked idea and we're all doomed because people are too retarded to think long term.
any oldfags here remember back in 2016 how it was a _SCENTIFIC CONSENSUS_ that donald j trump _HAD NO CHANCE_ at winning the presidency and he was going to get BTFO by hillary in a_HISTORIC LANDSLIDE_? remember all the _CHARTS_ and _GRAPHS_ just totally_PROVING_ trump was going to lose?
>>108355641You summed the issue nicely.
>>108335524>. A study published in Nature Climate Change found that as sea ice off Iceland and Greenland retreats, the flow of cold, dense water to the bottom of the North Atlantic ocean could be reduced, and therefore weaken the warming effects of the Gulf Stream. The great submarine current − sometimes called the Atlantic Conveyor − flows south to surface in the tropics as the Gulf Stream, which then flows north again to deliver tropic warmth to European coasts. However, a slowdown in the natural overturning of the ocean could weaken the Gulf Stream, which in turn could cool the atmosphere over the British Isles and western Europe. “A warm western Europe requires a cold North Atlantic, and the warming that the North Atlantic is now experiencing has the potential to result in a cooling over Western Europe,” http://climatenewsnetwork.net/global-warming-threatens-colder-climate-for-europe/Hmmm
>>108355641You had me at "apolitical concept" anon. Well said.
>>108356962Ice age when?
