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>watch Evangelion because people tell me it's sophisticated or something
>get to the ending
>"b-but... I hate myself..."
>'Until you learn to love yourself... you cannot truly trust others'
>"Yes, I want to love myself! My life is worth living hooray!"
BRAVO 10/10 SUPER SOPHISTICATED NUANCED WRITING HERE THANK YOU BASED JAPAN
>>
>>102215631
"The End of Evangelion" movie ending is better. The TV series ending is just for dummies.
>>
>>102215864
wait there's a movie called the end of evangelion?
>>
>>102215864

It's the same ending you doofus. EoE is just what happens in the outside world while TV is what happens in his head while he's in 01.
>>
>>102215631

Does /a/ have one of these?
>>
>>102216021
if so I want to see it
>>
That amateur psychoanalysis really is some of the most sophisticated writing in this medium, OP. And you wonder why /a/ only talks about moeshit
>>
>>102216045
>>102216021

We do. Google it, dipshits.
>>
Now watch EoE
>>
>>102215631
The average anime isn't particularly highbrow.
Evangelion just happens to be really good.

There's a movie that's less blunt and more normal, despite also having quite the amount of psychological mindtripping.

"End of Evangelion" - it's a must-watch.

If you want the stuff of nightmares, visit a shithole like evageeks and see the insanity.
Right now it's like they're a cult worshiping a madman in a country far away and the dead rotten corpse that is Evangelion.
>>
>>102216182
I think I am done with anime for the time being, this was apparently among the best
>>
>>102216206
>Right now it's like they're a cult worshiping a madman in a country far away and the dead rotten corpse that is Evangelion.
I see nothing wrong in doing that. In fact, I like reading and knowing about those people's doings.
>>
>>102216085
>That amateur psychoanalysis really is some of the most sophisticated writing in all mediums, OP. And you wonder why /a/ only talks about moeshit

fixed
>>
>>102216021
Not for directors but there's one with anime accessibility. Something like Naruto, SAO being on the top and some really unknown shows being at the bottom.
>>
>>102216292
but you haven't finished the series
>>
>>102216292

I hope that also means that you're leaving /a/ and never coming back.
>>
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>>102216312
Forgot I had it.
>>
>>102216295
You mean, watching retards over at evageeks being retarded, or being one of them?
The first one is.... well OK if that drivel is entertaining to you, but you have no excuse for the latter.
>>
>>102216292

So you are stopping a series before watching the movie that Ends the first series?
>>
>>102216362
Your preconceived notions will not be challenged, anon, don't worry :^)
>>
I bet you enjoy films of Wes Anderson.
>>
>>102216365
>Eva anywhere but the very top
Please
>>
>>102216365
>Inferno Cop
Those were the days
>>
>>102216365
/a/ knows about Belladonna? Surprising.
>>
>>102216372
I like reading their delusions and posts, which most are wrong. I've never joined one of those discussions since /a/ is well more informed than those guys, but the only thing they have in favor is that those claims stay in a single page.
>>
>>102216433
Even Wes Anderson has more to say than Anno
>>
>>102216433
some are good, stop being a faggot about it
>>
>>102216091
What the fuck are we supposed to google? If you know it, just drop a hint, you cunt.
>>
>>102216594
He is even more quirky.
>>
>>102216206
obviously Eva is too deep for you.
>>
>>102216365
>Inferno Cop

This chart does not disappoint.

Also, I feel like putting all the gundams in one spot is a little unfair. Sure, everyone saw Wing and G as a kid, but the same doesn't go for stuff like 0080 and Turn A.
>>
>>102215631

Sorry, we'll be sure to recommend you some animu about hegelian dialectics and a priori categories of mind next time.
>>
>>102216365
I will never understand why /a/ likes Paranoia Agent so much, let alone why they consider it to be so deep. It is literally just the scraps left over from Satoshi films mashed together, nothing else.
>>
>>102216685
>butthurt evageek
You guys are the absolute cancer
>>
How can you not know about End of Evangelion?
>>
>>102215631
Who the fuck told you that it was sophisticated?
>>
>>102216365
>Inferno Cop

It's a homage to zero budget Williams Street animations like ATHF and The Brak Show. Jesus Christ, I liked it, too, but how the hell is that deep?
>>
>>102216801
>le plebeian response
The idea that a sophisticated work needs to have overt arcane "themes" is ridiculous. That has very little to do with it. Watch La Belle Noiseuse, it's probably a level 4-5 film. It doesn't have any pretentious "themes" like you mentioned.
>>
>>102216365
Only thing I think it's missing is Princess Tutu.
>>
>>102216819
They have similar elements but Paranoia agent is it's own thing

All about everyone in Tokyo blaming their troubles on an imaginary assaulter to get out of their shit.

different from series like Perfect Blue which was all about nostalgia and Paprika which was all about escapism
>>
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>>102216365
>this is an objetively measure
>>
>>102216845
You are an idiot.
>>
>>102216365
I just realised it says animes.
>>
>>102216662
>being a fucking retarded newshit namefag
Fuck off you entitled cocksucker
>>
>>102216365
I like it. Will edit it to clear out bullshit then give to plebs.
>>
>>102216957
True. Depth isn't about some great, complicated philosophic themes. It's about subtlety. The ending of Evangelion is about as subtle as the ending of Metropolis.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61snFdFVNcw
>>
>>102216662
HAHA DISREGARD THAT I SUCK COCKS
>>
>>102217200
Did SHAFT make this?
>>
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>>102217160

This is the only thing you should be giving to the plebs.
>>
>>102216365
What if I made the jump to SoL skipping the first half? Am I already dead.
>>
>>102217310
>jump to SoL
Then you are among the few here with the best taste.
>>
>>102217255
I'm about to throw up
>>
>>102217200
>literally has the main character tell you what the show was about
>"subtlety"
>>
>>102217255

At least it's right about the /a/ part.
>>
>>102217310
That's what I did. My first anime were recommended to me by internet girls with great taste in moe shows and from there I found /a/ pretty fast.
>>
>>102217457
Exactly.
>>
>>102217310

I was just thinking that, because that's exactly what I did.
>>
>>102217512
I was pretending to be that namefag and forgot to turn it off. My bad.
>>
>>102215631
But that's not how you're supposed to interpret it. Shinjis problems were not solved at the end of the TV series. He just decided to try to solve them instead of running away, that's all.
>>
>>102217512
I was pretending to be that namefag and forgot to turn it off. My bad.
>>
Yeah man, they had some time constraints and as such the ending is a bit sudden and a bit cliched. However I think it's somewhat appropriate and justified given that the answer to Shinji's woes (and indeed, many of life's woes) are as simple as that and come as quickly. It could have used a bit of build up, a bit more argument on Shinji's part, but as it is I like it.
>>
>>102216365
where is Eiken on this list?
>>
>>102216365
What's Haibane Renmei's place in this?
>>
>>102216365
But Dead Leaves is one of the first anime I ever watched.
>>
>>102217831
There's always exceptions, anon. Somebody might even start with Inferno Cop and end with DBZ.
>>
>>102217927
Never mind actually, that's impossible.
>>
>Inferno Cop is the deepest anime has to offer
>>
>>102217927
I've never watched anything Dragon Ball and have no desire to
>>
>>102217103
butthurt evageek
>>
>>102216365
Funny.
I started with Madoka, went BACKWARDS to SnK, then went to Nichijou, backwards AGAIN to Evangelion (although I question its placement on the chart) and now I'm somewhere in the elitist tier.
I'm not even going to say how I found Madoka. It's an embarrassing story.
>>
>>102218098
Less blogging = good.
>>
>>102216365
>madoka
>not deep

It's pretty much one of the deepest shows in recent years.
>>
>>102217373

Then maybe you should follow the advice given on the image, and get the fuck out.
>>
>>102215631
>expecting anything from anime
the only good stuff is in manga.
>>
>>102218082
stay pleb nigga
>>
>>102216365
Eve no jikan is in my top 3 and even I think placing it there is pretentious, that whole list is pretty garbage with random inserts where they shouldn't be.
You can act like anything above the shounen genre is instantly above it, but it's not.
Shit that's made for a 'smarter' crowd, yet fails miserable, is worse than shounen that reaches their own audience.
>>
>>102218224
different /tv/-fag here, what exactly makes a deep anime deep? I am having a really hard time imagining it. I know there are very sophisticated Japanese films, but anime...
>>
>>102215631
Level 3 and level 4 are the best. There are some good directors from later levels, but most of them are just experimental filmmakers making weird, experimental crap for shit and giggles (they like to call it 'exploring film').
>>
>>102218150
>>102218098

Why the hell not? If it's an interesting story, why not "waste" a post telling it instead of leaving us hanging here.

One of my friend's first anime was fucking Strike Witches.
>>
>>102218224
The pic is about accessibility not if it's deep.
Though you will find some of the deeper ones are on the bottom.
>>
>>102218295
>fails miserably*
Don't know what happened there.
>>
>>102218337
I don't need to know how someone got into anime.
>>
>>102218319
LoGH is the anime equivalent of The Wire
>>
>>102218251
butt
hurt
retarded
evageek
>>
>>102216942
le funny joek
>>
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>>102218337
>>
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>>102216365
Inferno Cop is best tier
>>
>>102218319
What makes a deep film deep?
>>
>>102218414
I don't know
You seem like the butthurt one in this thread
>>
>>102218001
Inferno Cop exists on a plane of understanding which we can only access by the crude intimations it casts upon our minds.
>>
>>102218478
Abstract visuals, either a lot of talking or no talking at all, imagery, orchestral music.
>>
>>102218319
Eva has a very childish sense of character but it's aesthetically sophisticated.

A lot of Oshii's work is "deep"
>>
>>102218541
So why is it so hard to imagine an anime doing the same thing?
>>
>>102218385
The most damning indictment of this medium imaginable. It's not even as good as American television
>>
>>102218481
butt
hurt
>>
>>102218590
Animation still has the stigma of being for children.
>>
>>102218616
Not all of American television is HBO dear anon.
>>
>>102218478
eschewing the continuity method of filming
lack of expository dialogue and monologues in general
lack of intended "Themes" and "symbolism"
transferring emotions and values to the audience instead of transferring a story
Filming in a way that causes viewers to question or feel things in a different way
Using cinematographic techniques to create the narrative
Experimentation and lack of adherence to what is accepted
Narratives that are not readily understandble or lack of one all together

Some of these listed overlap with what makes a movie "good"
>>
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2deep4u
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>>102217803
Slightly below Texhnolyze.
>>
>>102218649
you should get some cream for that
>>
>>102218676
I don't know why SoL is considered entry level when entry level watchers can't stand it.
>>
>>102218481
How does it feel to be part of something as massively disgusting as evageeks?
>>
>>102218541
>anime
>not having abstract visuals
>>
>>102218653
To be fair, a majority of anime is really childish despite its intended or actual audience.
>>
>>102218812
could be worse
I could be a plebeian like you
>>
>>102218794
That anons chart clearly mixes up "deep" as in "difficult to understand" and deep as in "you need to be deep into the matter to enjoy this anime".
>>
>>102218837
don't listen to that guy
>>
>>102217803
>implying Haibane was deep
It was just a fantasy SOL. All the characters were extraordinarily flat except Reki.
>>
how can there be 3 active eva threads on page 1

what the fuck
>>
>>102218845
>childish despite its intended or actual audience.

then how does one even prove anything is mature? I can say right now that all entertainment mediums are immature and there's no way to prove me wrong.
>>
>>102218890
>Evangelion
>anime in general
>not plebeian
>>
>>102218945
>not using catalog
>2014
Let me guess, you think KLK is AOTY.
>>
>>102218001
>>102218224
It's an accessibility chart you retards.
>>
>>102218945
This your first time on /a/?
>>
>Implying you understood what "deep" referes to in that chart.
Why do you think is SoL rather low?
>>
>>102218945
I forgot this was an EVA thread, I came for the chart.
>>
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>Get to the ending of LoGH
>"A constitutional monarchy is best"
>I get two messages from this
>Everyone is terrible when it comes to politics
>Things would be better if Kircheis were here

BRAVO 10/10 SUPER SOPHISTICATED NUANCED WRITING HERE THANK YOU BASED JAPAN
>>
>>102218967
These definition games are the last resort of anyone losing any argument ever. You can't prove anything, you can't prove 1+1=2 outside of that being the property of real numbers (and prove that)

So, only people that are losing an argument say "HURRRR NOTHING EXISTS DURRR PROVE IT" and make a continuum fallacy.
>>
>>102218970
such a greentext is typical of plebeians.

You ask for intelligence and sophistication when you possess neither. I pity you.
>>
Well the main thing is that anime hasn't developed its own version of auteur theory yet, it just piggybacks off of the film auteur theory for credibility as a medium. So it inherits all the same issues that film auteur theory has as a reliable standard of artistic merit in addition to being in different industry.

The main problem with film auteur theory is that it puts the director at the center of the production and judges a film's artistic merit by how much influence and control the director has. Auteur theory doesn't really credit editors or cinematographers for their input unless they work closely with the director/were involved in directing the film. For some cases, like the Coens, the editing and directing are done by the same people anyway, so it becomes easier to assign all credit to the director.

To put it shortly: auteur theory is about interpreting the film as the director's project, his "vision."

Anime tries to do this too, but it's a lot trickier because each episode has its own director, and the person who pitched the show and originally wrote it may not even be involved in the actual production of the individual episodes, or may have only personally directed a couple of them. So you have to look at it on an episode by episode basis, then figure out if it can still be counted as a cohesive single "vision" for the acclaimed director.

And this is all presuming that you buy into the auteur theory laid down by Truffaut and the rest.
>>
>>102219014
Shit, forgot to quote.
>>102218939
>>
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There's only ever been 1 of these that was any good, the rest are all cluttered shit that miss the point of the joke completely.
>>
>>102219042
>a constitutional monarchy is best for war
>like World War I Germany or World War II Japan
LOGH, such sophisticated political themes
>>
>>102219014
I assume you're quoting me but Haibane isn't anything special. I don't think it'd be any less accessible than like Ano Hana or whatever.
>>
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>>102219076
>Anime tries to do this too, but it's a lot trickier because each episode has its own director,
You what?
>>
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>>102219058
I do see that you are indeed my kindred when it comes to your gentlemanly ways and your scholarly persuasion. I am inclined to offer you a tip of the fedora as we pity these lesser minds.
*raises chalice of mountain dew code red*
>>
>>102219056
That's because you keep leading the argument to that result

>majority of the audience are mature adult
>that doesn't make it mature
>the series focus on psychology, philosophy, STEM, morality, etc
>that doesn't make it mature
>the series is outright targetted to mature audiences
>that doesn't make it mature

At that point you just have to raise your hands and say "then what does make your shit mature?"
>>
>>102219042

LoGH is very pro-democracy what are you talking about
>>
>>102219106
>thinking it's a joke
>>
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>>102219058
>>102219190
What the fuck is wrong with both of you?
>>
>>102219042
Actually the moral is "a government is only as good as the people behind it"
>>
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>>102219042

Works for me. At the very least, with Kircheis alive, it would've put less of a strain on Reinhard which would've delayed the progression of his space aids or whatever.
>>
>>102219209
see
>>102218663

Also a general lack of things like stylized violence, superpowers, wish fulfillment...
>>
I find it funny how people get their jimmies rustled about whether others consider their hobbies "sophisticated" or not, or even what others think about it at all.
Media is made entirely for your enjoyment. How exactly you enjoy it doesn't matter. Even if there is an "intended" way to enjoy it, you don't have to care about it at all. Others' opinion doesn't matter.
Just watch it. Or don't. The choice is entirely yours.
>>
>>102219298
It's "don't have butt sex with Kircheis because you'll die of space AIDS".
>>
>>102219298
whooooooaaaaah deeeeeeeep
>>
>>102219166
You mean you didn't know each episode is its own production with its own staff? Using Bakemonogatari as an example, episode 1 had two directors, Tatsuya Oishi and Yukihiro Miyamoto. Episode 2 had only one director, Tomoyuki Itamura. And those were even part of the same story arc.
>>
>>102219190
Where are you reddit faggots coming from? You keep getting banned and told that this tips fedora shit is a reddit meme yet you keep using it.
>>
>>102219405

It's called discussion you dumb fuck.
>>
>>102219379
>>102218663
most films do not have these qualities, not even many of the "good" one's of course that depends on who calls them good
some films do but about the same percentage as anime that do
>>
>>102219190
Jesus, they come in different colors
>>
>>102219405
The choice to talk about it is yours too.
>>
>>102219298
That's a shitty moral. Political actors work within a system, their individual moral qualities have very little to do with it. LOGH author needs to read up on some political theory that wasn't thought up by some dumb Chink
>>
>>102218890
Going to evageeks makes you the plebbiest of plebs.
>>
>>102219190
Why do I keep seeing this reddit/tumblr maymay here?
>>
>>102219510
>some films do but about the same percentage as anime that do
You're delusional
>>
>>102219482
>constant name-calling, pretentiousness, and fallacies
>discussions

As expected of 4chan
>>
>>102219578
It's a shitposting tactic.
>>
>>102219528
Well, true, that's why I usually don't talk about it, unless I want to entertain my mind.
>>102219482
>actual discussion
>4chan - /a/
10/10 joke.
>>
>>102219119
While I don't agree with you, this argument is still missing the point. Why do you think EoE is much deeper than NGE? And why are SoL, Spice and Wolf and NHK all rather low, even though they're all easily accessible? It's beacuse the whole chart is not about accessibility. It's about what kind of viewer you typically are and respectively how "deep" you are into the material if you watch a certain show.
>>
>>102219530
The series is called "Legend of Galactic Heroes" pretty much is all about the "Great man theory of history"
>>
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>>102216365
top lel
>>
>>102218890
>gets called out for being part of one of the most retarded communities in all of anime
>gets butthurt

Delicious. Never stop being a mindless moron, get the fuck back to evageeks where you can go discuss how deep Mari is as a character and how deep Asuka's twat is
>>
>>102218663
I can think of anime that use a few of those.
>>
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>>102219673
>now think of every way you can make a storyline "deep" and you have Evangelion.
>>
>>102219530
Oh boy, did I hear "the system is flawed by default".
Let's not turn this into a lolbertarian vs statetard shit flinging.
>>
>>102219690
>some random guy gets butthurt that you called him out on his stupidity
>says you are part of some "bad community" as a desperate attempt to argue

sure showed me
>>
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>>102219824
Free markets working is logical fact and if you disagree with it you are basically a creationist
>>
So what's so bad about evageeks?
>>
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>>102219906
Good job at almost making me bite.
>>
>>102219591
You're delusional if you think films are mostly that.
>>
>>102220047
Mostly? Not even close. Certainly more than anime though
>>
>>102218663
>lack of intended "Themes" and "symbolism"
which kinda contradicts
>Using cinematographic techniques to create the narrative

feels like you are just speaking out of your ass
>>
>>102219957

I do not think they are too bad personally, but a lot of them there read into things way too much.
>>
Anno is the greatest director to ever fucking live.
>>
>>102219906
>actually thinking for a second that markets or private property are not created by the state
Typical lolbertarian pleb
>>
>>102220128
Those two concepts have nothing to go with each other. Do you know what those words mean or what?
>>
Thing about Eva on /a/ is that not too many people think it's deep but they do insult people who claim it's not deep mostly for shits and giggles as well as annoyance towards those people who make threads everyday complaining how "not deep" eva is.

like this guy >>102215631
>>
>>102219906
>>102220202
You're not making anyone bite here, mate.
>>
>>102220202
property is enforced by the state (Just like rights such as not being murdered you fucking idiot) and property being enforced leads to optimal economic results. It's funny because all the other STEM people I know accept this as fact and retarded "philosophee X-PERTZ" are the only ones that subscribe to psychotic utopianism where government monopolies lead to magic.
>>
>>102216365
I think I don't belong in this place anymore. I've seen almost everything here. Maybe it's time to become a normal human.
>>
>>102220124
Not him, but I honestly think that's wrong. Actually it's probably the other way around, simply because films are much more mainstream then anime and thus there are so many more films aimed at your average hollywood film fan than anime, that the percentage of sophisticated films should be extremely low. Of course it's low for anime too, but since there are so few anime, the mere existence of 10 anime that qualify as "deep" would probably be enough to outperform the numbers for films.
>>
>>102220339
Congratulations.
>>
>>102220339
Can a feral human become human? Feral as in /a/ and human as in normalfag?
>>
>>102220339
Innocence, once lost, can never be regained
>>
>>102220389
name 10 deep anime.
if it has monologues, stylized violence or superpowers in it, it doesn't count
>>
>>102217200
So he's the middle class?
>>
>>102220339
Or you could start watching something even less mainstream. Maybe becoming a hardcore fan of armenian cartoons?
>>
>>102220325
Property is not a "right." Property is a creation of law.
>>
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm10745506

Why is this scene so good? Is this the best scene in Japanese animation history? So much more subtle, striking and powerful than this "Congratulations!" crap.
While I love Miyazaki I really think that this scene is better than his whole body of work. Even my favorite Totoro.
>>
>>102220507
>if it has monologues it doesn't count

not him but
So Shakespeare plays aren't deep?
>>
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>>102217255
This is right.

Sasuga, /a/. The levels of meta here are beyond any one persons comprehension.
>>
>>102220339
>>
>>102220557
If you believe in rights you believe in property. Property is an extension and combination of your body, mind and actions. If you don't believe in property, why is rape a bad thing? Are you an evil capitalist that thinks a person owns their own body and can *gasp* -EXCLUDE- someone else from having sex with -a- body (not their body of course, nobody can own things!)
>>
What goes on in evageeks to justify such hate?
When I watched Eva for the first time I went looking for opinions and I remember reading an old topic there which was very constructive.
>>
>>102220633
Plays are a different beast because there is very very few ways they can express things
>>
>>102220676
Calm down, child, and read what was posted.
>>
>>102220799
I read it, I am saying laws are an enforcement of rights that already exist. Murder isn't wrong because the government says so
>>
>>102220507
Your definition of deep is rather shitty, though.
Nothing of what you wrote should really be a criterium for "deepness".
However, if you want me to go with that:
Kanashimi no Belladonna
Ein Landarzt
Iblard Jikan
Tori no Uta
Tenshi no Tamago
Are the five that instantly come to my mind and it's not like I regularly search anime like these so there are probably much more.
>>
>>102220889
No, but not being murdered is a legal right because the government says so. "Nature" obviously could care less
>>
>>102219658
That's literally what I just said. People who like Haibane Renmei, like Texhnolyze and Kino fans, like to pretend their material is more obscure or less accessible than it actually is. While Texhnolyze is actually fairly inaccessible since most people seem to drop it hard after the first episode or two, Haibane isn't exactly hard to watch (nor is it really deep on any great philosophical level). I'm not really sure what you're arguing. The chart is about accessibility. Like I said, I'd put it around Ano Hana or seasonal anime-tier on this chart. It's not exactly veiled like some of the shit near the bottom nor does it make for difficult watching. The SOL that are near the top are fairly well-known, but a good number of SOL are close to the elitist tier since they fall under seasonal anime; the better selling/received ones just float near the top since they're better known.
>>
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>>102220408
Thank you.
>>102220411
>>102220461
>>102220548
>>102220672
No, I really think I'm done. I hate everything on that list now. I've come full circle. I'm back where I started. Maybe it's time to make a change.
>>
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>>102216365
>zettai shougeki not being in the deconstruction of the evangelion of the anime genre tier
It's like you ain't seen nothing.
>>
If you want to make an anime accessibility chart, Aku no Hana should be around the bottom. Hipsters flock around it, but it is pretty inaccessible.
>>
>>102221004
I don't believe you, but you will be one of the rare ones to leave /a/.
>>
>>102220985
There aren't anime that are hard to watch. Except harems and ecchi if you have taste.
>>
Accessibility Levels
0 - Ghibli, Toonami, Akira
1 - Entry-level anime (One Piece, Attack on Titan, K-On, Elfen Lied, LOGH, Madoka, Eva, etc.)
2 - Seasonal shows
3- Shows that are older than 2004 or so but are pretty well-known by anime fans in the West (Boogiepop Phantom, Genocyber, Harlock, Rose of Versailles)
4 - Shows that are popular in Japan, unknown in the West, but still subbed (Future Boy Conan, Ideon)
5 - Unsubbed shows (Raiyantsuuri no Uta, Kanpeki no Kantai, Minky Momo)
>>
>Kurosawa and Teshigahara that deep
>even Fukui is too deep
>Terayama isn't even mentioned
Pleb as fuck.
>>
>>102220955
for every one of those you name I could name 10 films. Face it, we enjoy anime, but it's pretty much kid stuff.
>>
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>>102221127
I've been doing thing shit since 1996. I think I'm ready. I'm going to destroy my computer and try to go outside.

Goodbye, /a/. It's been fun.
>>
>>102221353
Okay, sure, Rose of Versailles is less accessible than Eva or Madoka, fucking incredible
>>
>>102221353
nice try, TVtropes.
>>
>>102221423
I tried. It won't work. You are here with us forever.
>>
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I got to be honest with you. I don't care too much about anime anymore, I'm not a NEET, and I do have friends, family, and a future.

But I don't buy the whole "films is an artform while games and anime are not" Live Action movies are dominated by Hollywood, the largest artistic cancer on Earth. I just can't take a medium seriously under that and no one should either it sickens me. Either art is so vague that all mediums are art in some form or another or live action films are just as vapid and artless.

You can list your "good film" but that'd be just as fruitless as an /a/non listing his "good anime"
>>
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>>102215631
>wanting Eva to have the same impact after all those years
Pleb, you'll never watch Eva in the 90s.
>>
>>102221395
This chart is a clusterfuck. No one on /tv/ takes it seriously.
>>
>>102221423
It doesn't work like that, but it's always fun to try.
>>
>>102221423
You don't need to destroy your computer to be normal.

In fact in this day and age you'll be considered less normal if you don't have some sort of digital device.
>>
>>102220633
>funny, outdated words
>deep
>>
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>>102216365
>Inferno Cop where he belongs
We'll always remember you, INFERNO COPU!
>>
>>102221319
Eh Texhnolyze takes a long time to really get moving because of its subject material, and some stuff with heavy semiotic density like lain or Komm susser Tod sequence can turn people off, thus making the material in question less accessible. Accessibility seems to rely on both how obscure the material is and how disconnected it is from reality or logic; the higher these values the less accessible it is to the average viewer; that said if a viewer has either a sufficient power level and/or is well versed in psychology/sociology/esthetics/philosophy the barrier is obviously less of a hurdle.
>>
>>102221476
Because you don't know much about film and film history. TV anime have very little artistry. Artistic, experimental and meaningful animation flourish in films (usually shorts).
>>
>>102220985
You are mixing up two different things:
>The chart is about accessibility.
>but a good number of SOL are close to the elitist tier since they fall under seasonal anime
The second statement is correct, but it has absolutely nothing to do with accessibility, like you used it in the case of Haibane Renmei.
You argued that HR shouldn't be low because it's easy to interpret (has no philosophical depth) but on the other hand you argue with sells and something being a seasonal anime or not.

The important question is, what kind of people watch Haibane Renmei. And personally I have never heard of anyone who doesn't see himself at least on the level called "elitist tier" in that chart.
>>
>>102221633
>watch more films

That excuse didn't work on you when /a/nons tell you that you didn't watch enough anime. What makes you think that excuse will work on me?

>experimental and meaningful animation flourish in films
funny joke
>>
>>102221426
Far fewer people in the West have seen it. Most Western self-proclaimed otaku would never watch anything that old
>>
>>102221412
I refuted that argument literally 3 posts above in the post chain. Your attention span isn't very long, is it?
>>
>>102221856
>shallow chinese cartoons
nice
>>
>>102221583
>>
>>102221796
>excuse
I'm interested in both animation and film. Like I said, watch more films.
>funny joke
It's true. Of course most /a/nons limit themselves to childish TV otaku anime and don't even want to explore French or Russian animation, let alone stop-motion or that horrible 3D.
Shit, many people here didn't watch everything (or most) of "experimental and artsy" chart.
>>
>>102221423
>tfw 4chan will never be this creative again
>>
>>102222171
I have watched films and their history

It only made me more certain
>>
>>102222851
You have watched film history. Okay.
>>
>>102222937
You know what I mean.

read novels
>>
>>102222293
>tfw nothing will ever be creative again
SA-esque silliness and OC is dead in favor of seriousness and shitty jokes based on real life
>>
>>102223006
Watch films. Because it's quite obvious that you don't know what you're talking about. And I do read novels.
>>
>>102223101
>Because it's quite obvious that you don't know what you're talking about.

Another excuse common on /a/ when you insult anime. Are you sure you are not just like those "childish otaku?"
>>
>>102222171
>>102223101
You sound pretentious as fuck, why are you on /a/ if you mainly watch movies and read novels?
>>
>>102223176
It's easy to insult anime. Especially TV anime. It has very little to offer. In fact it's so disconnected from reality that most characters don't even act like human beings.
>>
>>102223188
Because I like anime.
>>
>>102223188
To shit on tasteless retards like you.

FACT: Anime faggots take their steaks well done and with ketchup.
>>102223271
>most characters don't even act like human beings.
This is a big issue in particular I have. Characters are more one dimensional mary sue wish fulfillment, like Sonic the Hedgehog fanfics.
>>
>>102223271
That's because you don't know much about anime or its history.

Watch more anime.
>>
>>102223271
>disconnected from reality
Sounds like the reason I watch anime. If I wanted reality I'd watch film.
>>
>>102223391
>Anime faggots take their steaks well done and with ketchup.
Who the hell can eat a steak with ketchup? That's for the fries
>>
>>102223422
>If I wanted reality I'd go outside

fixed
film is not a good substitute for reality
>>
>>102223422
so shallow escapism is all you want? Art imitates life
>>
>>102223391
I like my steak medium rare and without any sauce because I don't want to ruin my perfect steak. Faggot.
>>
>>102223616
Life is boring, so why not?
>>
>>102223592
>Not knowing that art is a representation of reality
While anime IS aimed at manchildren or whathever nickname you want to call it, it's still reality on a blender.
>>
>>102223271
>most characters don't even act like human beings.
This is so true it's weird. The sad thing is that people think that "tsundere" is a real way that human beings interact.
>>
ITT: /tv/
>>
>>102223654
Life isn't boring. Life is fascinating.
>>
>>102223665
>Not knowing that art is a representation of reality

If you think that's the case you have a poor perception of reality
>>
>>102223654
Anime confirmed for sad boring faggots
>>
>>102223729
>Life is fascinating.
No it's not. It's really dull.
>>
>>102223690
That tsundere thread today was awful, wasn't it.
>>
>>102223754
Sounds like a personal problem. This explains your shit taste while not exactly justifying
>>
>>102223729
Not as fascinating as anime

I could have the same life as Teddy Roosevelt and it wouldn't be as fun.
>>
>>102223733
You have a poor case of interpretation of meanings. Why don't you try to learn and read a bit more? It always help so that you don't look as retarded as you are now.
>>
>>102223803
>wake up
>go to work
>go home
>go to sleep

Yeah, real life sure is interesting.
>>
>>102223777
trips confirm
>>
>>102215631
Think of the last two episodes as an essay of why Shinji shouldn't hate himself. You just quoted the conclusion and completely ignored the process it took to get him to that point.

OP your thread is shit and you are truly a faggot.
>>
>>102223835
I said that a fictional medium isn't closer to reality than the real thing and you disagreed with me. You seem to have mental issues.
>>
>>102223835
What's with stupid people and thinking that "reading more" is some magical activity that just makes people smarter? Did you watch the Pagemaster too many times? There is such things as shitty books that don't teach anything, in fact I would say most books fall into this category. You putting books on a pedestal is reminiscent of what virgins do to sex.
>>
>>102223592
Yes. Especially when I want to watch something about different people, cultures and their perception of reality.
>>
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>>102223835
I would sure like to hear your clever definition of art, that makes the "art is a representation of reality" statement seem plausible.
>>
>>102216292
>Watch a movie
>Turn it off before the climactic ending
>"Meh. six outta ten".
>Make a thread on /a/ about it.

Fuck this board..
>>
>>102223954
>believes that's actually diverse perceptions

As expected of the type of people who try to psychoanalyze anonymous users on the internet.
>>
>>102223963
Let me show you how to really do this.
>>
>>102224043
Yes, I do believe that people living in different parts of the world have a different views on many things. Because it's obviously true.
>>
>>102224127
hmm seems you lack reading comprehension so I'm going to tell you outright

Fictional mediums do not show how real people work, at least not as good as getting to know them directly.
>>
>people treating a movie like another different show from the TV series

Pls, its not the 90s anymore. You google the name and you get every OVA/movie/etc name of the franchise.
>>
>>102224248
>Fictional mediums do not show how real people work
I never said that. They are still a close representation of reality and usually author's personal views.

This is not the case with anime. Anime are much closer to video games at this point. They are mass produced, adapted from the lowest form of entertainment and work as a wishfullfilment fantasies. They don't even try or want to show an imitation of reality
>>
>>102224796
>implying films or books are any different
>>
>>102224877
They are. Anime is far more repetitive than films or books.
>>
>>102225070
are you serious
>>
>>102225070
All credibility lost.

Books have been around for countless centuries with same ideas being repeated over and over again.

Film has also been around for a good while and has been repeated over and over again.
>>
>>102225295
Animation has been around for longer than film. Japanese animation is almost as old as Japanese film.
>>102225262
Of course.
>>
>>102225393
Why are you skirting around the issue? The point was that both books and film have long been exhausted from creativity and are repetitive mediums just like anything else.
>>
>>102225513
And they are less repetitive than anime.
>>
>>102215631
Where do Tim and Eric belong on that list?
>>
>>102225594
No they aren't. All fiction has long been exhausted of creativity.
>>
BIrdemic is the greatest film of all time. It's too deep for you to understand.
>>
>>102225631
Of course they are. You have this silly cult, or rather fetishization, of youth. Most anime feature school girls doing unimportant things, school boys saving the world, etc.
Now look at film or books. They broach all kinds of contemporary issues, characters age range from babies to old people, they are about different people, different professions, point of views, etc.
Anime isn't even close to it. There aren't many anime about 40 year olds, or artists, or prostitution, or ageing population. There aren't even many historical anime, crime anime, or shit even drama anime.
The difference is huge and you must be blind to not see it.
>>
>>102226072
What you are doing is looking at a specific subset and then comparing it to the usual daily airing shows which is completely disingenuous.

You can't honestly tell me that the average film Hollywood shits out is any better or whatever the latest "young adult" book is. I'd also like to emphasize that, especially in the case of books, they've been around for FAR longer and are far easier to make on a technical level.
>>
>>102225922
Birdemic was like something out of my high school video production class, except somehow shittier
>>
>>102216365
Anyone else think Spice and Wolf should be higher up, maybe around Haruhi?
>>
>>102226300
No. I'm comparing anime and film. I know and understand why anime is much more repetitive than film. But it seems like some people truly believe that TV anime are creative. More creative than film or books, which is ridiculous.
>>
>>102226740
You've ignored everything I said, good job.

Let me ask again, do you really believe that the average Hollywood film or latest book is any better than your normal TV anime?
>>
>>102226830
I didn't ignore it I just don't see how is that relevant.
>do you really believe that the average Hollywood film or latest book is any better than your normal TV anime?
Does this matter? But yes, if your average anime is a bad light novel adaptation then the average Hollywood film is probably better.
>>
>>102227079
>Does this matter?
Yes because that is the majority of the medium.

>But yes, if your average anime is a bad light novel adaptation then the average Hollywood film is probably better.
You're retarded.
>>
>>102227138
Even mediocre Hollywood flicks tend to be more interesting than harem anime.
>Yes because that is the majority of the medium.
I don't think so.
>>
>>102225631
>All fiction has long been exhausted of creativity.

let's go back to this, is this true?

Has every 'moral of the story' been used? Has every possible plot device been discovered? Is every story just a matter of compiling different pre-existing tropes and themes in a unique manner?
>>
>>102216365
I'm very close to become a wizard, huh?
Watching seasonal anime with /a/ sure helps to your powerlevel.
Eva should be at the same level of Clannad or even TTGL.
>>
>>102227293
No. The world is changing. Our culture is changing. Creativity will never die out. Books and films from 50s are different than modern ones.
>>
>>102217373
>Being this new
>Tripfag

Get out
>>
>>102215631
what is this list of jewish names?
>>
>>102227293
I'd argue the actual plot of a book/movie/anime isn't even important. What's most important is often the aspects easily regarded as "secondary"; things in the environment, how the work interacts with the social setting and collective concepts of the context of the reader/watcher. The "plot" of a work is just a medium via which one tells the real story. What makes a good work good is seldom the plot itself, but the social concepts -- "memes", if you will -- that one picks up, interns and processes thanks to the work.

Gintama makes a good example. (I know not everyone likes Gintama, but that's not the point in case.) The plot in each episode is trivial, almost pointless; what makes it interesting is how the characters react to the various things that happen to and around them. That allows the watcher to pick up all kinds of social mores that the makers try to communicate, and that's precisely why one watches it, even if one doesn't necessarily realize it.

If you want books, Lord of the rings is also a good example. It's not like the plot is uninteresting, but it's not the main point of reading the books. What one truly appreciates when reading them is being able to watch and analyze such concepts that one doesn't usually make contact with -- notions of kinship, destiny, social interaction, kingship vs. tyranny, and so on.

In that way, it doesn't really matter if "every possible plot device has been discovered" or not. The plot devices are not important.
>>
>>102227912
>Tripfag
>>
>>102227966
To go on about that point, you don't even have to look at modern works. Just take the Iliad or something; the plot itself is only so interesting. Everyone at that time knew about wars and how they work.

The reason people wanted to hear the Iliad wasn't so much because of the "suspense" or because "the plot is so unique", but because Hector and Ajax set social examples for others to follow, or because it gives all who have listened to it a set of common symbols via which war or peace can be discussed and related to.
>>
>>102215631
Given that most people seem to miss this and get caught up in the window dressings...
>>
>>102227893
The same goes for anime, however. You may call anime repititive, but in fact it is an extremly fast changing medium. You can easily notice great changes in its general style over just a few years, far less than for books for example.
>>
>>102227966
I think it's interesting that you say the plot is a medium for the setting and characters, rather than the other way around. I don't know why I have ever thought about it in that manner.

Anime like SAO/Log Horizon/.hack are popular not primarily for the plot, but because of the setting of an MMORPG. SAO has a weak plot and main character but what makes it popular is the amount of worldbuilding the author put into it. People want to imagine life in a world like that, and the shows/books do a good job at that, even if it lacks in other areas.
>>
>>102221695
>what kind of people watch Haibane Renmei.
People who watch shit for the character designer and a whole lot of diappointed Murakamifags. So I guess it's deeper than fanart on pixiv, but not as deep or polarizing as mainstream lit.

To the average anime demographic, it's inaccessible, but in the grand scheme it's more eye candy and feels than brain food.
>>
>>102228240
>.hack
>popular
what
>>
>>102225622
in the core of the earth
>>
>>102228272
>People who watch shit for the character designer and a whole lot of diappointed Murakamifags. So I guess it's deeper than fanart on pixiv, but not as deep or polarizing as mainstream lit.
You don't even try anymore, now. Just stop embarassing yourself.
>>
>>102228402
It was a generalization, sorry.
>>
>>102217255
>ADTRW not even on the list
sasuga sa
>>
>>102228684
What is wrong with that statement? aBe isn't exactly known for much other than his art and it pulls heavily from the end of the world chapters of Hard Boiled Wonderland.
>>
>>102216365
Why is SoL that low? Don't get me wrong, I love SoL, but most anime watchers typically like the stuff, and sometimes it's the only thing that they watch, combined with triple A stuff like Shingeki.
>>
>>102229033
>ADTRW
What year do you think it is and who do you think that list is aimed at?
>>
>>102229540
Here or elsewhere? IRL, even among more knowledgeable people, it's not exactly a favorite and is usually the grounds of hardcore otaku and on other sites EVERYONE is 12 and has never heard of most of it.
>>
>>102229540
Turboweebs like SoL, and that's not the bulk of the fandom by far.
>>
>>102229669
ADTRW is a nice entry level resource though (but yeah paying for an SA account specifically for ADTRW is just not going to happen)



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