Are EVAs robots?
No, now fuck off
hey, I'm the one who agrees with you, but it felt to me like it was me vs everyone else before. So don't act as if I'm to blame here.
Are gundams robots?
Does that happen in EoE? I never bothered to watch it.
this post pretty much explains why the entire debate is even possible. normalfags are talking out of their ass
Yes, they are
>bbuh muh EVA biological mechs never be done before so original!
It was done before and they are still mechs
Try watching it to the end, baka.
That's like saying Frankenstein's Monster isn't a monster.
He's made up of humans but he's a monster.
EVAs are robots made up of Angels.
The Billion Dollar man, is still a robot.
No, normalfags would just claim shit out of their asses. I just never felt compelled enough to watch it. I was satisfied with the original ending.
>No, normalfags would just claim shit out of their asses.
Protip: If they're normalfags, they wouldn't care enough to debate.
you mean the ending anno was forced to make after he was told he didn't have enough money for the original ending?
And then rebuild happened, removing all creepyness
>Ive only eaten green vegetables before so since carrots are orange they arent vegetables
A robot need not be purely electronical. It could even be a living person.
No, they're mothers.
How can it be a living person?
You sure sound like a robot, you aspie speglord.
Terminators have biological parts along with electronic parts, yet they're still robots.
Nevertheless, MP evas are the best evas
>getting jimmies rocked by being wrong
Your tears are delicious.
But they aren't really a living person. I see what you are saying though. In other words, biological parts but the brain is still a computer.
If evas are robots than humans are too and the word would lose all meaning.
>Bear in charge of knowing shit
>Bear in charge of shit taste
>Bear in charge of being automatically wrong
>The T-800 was Skynet's first cybernetic organism, with living tissue over a hyperalloy endoskeleton
>The EVA was NERVs first cybernetic organism, with a hyperalloy covering living tissue
the terminator is the exact opposite of an EVa, anon
Because the definition of a robot encompasses that. A living person, who is controlled by some means can be called a robot as well.
Wow that's a lot of mad.
>If evas are fictional than humans are too and the word would lose all meaning.
No, you retard
But that doesn't even have anything to do with my taste anon!
If carrots are vegetables then radishes are too and the word would lose all its meaning
Yes. I liked it.
You aren't following.
Evas are organic living beings. If those are categorically "robots," then humans would have to qualify too.
EVAs are copies of adam infused with mechanical interfaces for restraint and for interface for human use, infused with the soul of a human.
EVAs are not robots, they are Adam clone cyborgs.
An android is a robot shaped in the image of a human that acts human, but EVAs do not look like humans, and sure as hell don't act like them.
A robot is a tool dictated by artificial intelligence (AI being interface or a directive) while an EVA is an organic being infused with technology to be controlled.
If they were living, take you for instance, you could be converted into a robot.
All it requires is that you respond to commands and execute them. The degree of hardwiring and capability beyond that is another matter.
The EVA's are technological,biological machines, used as slaves, robots, commanded to do one's bidding. When it does not respond to it's masters bidding, it has gone "out of control".
It is a giant cyborg. A robot.
But it has a soul.
It is the equivalent of taking a living person, brainwashing them, restraining them, and hardwiring their brains so that they are slaves, they are now robots.
No, it's made pretty clear they aren't. Unless you take shinji's friends calling it a giant robot as fact it's a giant robot.
Monster is used as a description, your comparison is wrong.
You need to re-watch Terminator.
>A robot is a tool dictated by artificial intelligence (AI being interface or a directive)
That is quite wrong.
A robot doesn't need any sort of programming or AI, but it can have that.
Your post, is shit.
They are cyborgs.
>for interface for human use
They're cars. Evas are cars.
Ah, now I see what you are saying. That makes sense.
They are Organic Robots.
That's the dictionary term for robots, turd-bugler. They have to have a measure of autonomy.
No that would be monster-like, monstrous, etc.
You would use Robot as you would Monster.
Who's monster is it? It's Frankenstein's Monster, it's not Frankenstein's monstrous cadaver.
So it finally happened.
"BUT YOU ARE USING THE REAL DEFINITION THAT IS IN THE DICTIONARY, YOU CANNOT DO THAT!"
EVAs are robots.
Way to bring a whole race of robots by comparing them with niggers.
no, not at all
they just have limiters/armor that makes them look that way
Did..... did you just criticize me and imply I was wrong for using the term correctly?
Did you think before you post?
How about how EVAs respond to emotional stimuli of the pilots? Have you read "Do robots dream of electric sheep?"
If evas are robots because they're living things that are "controlled" by an outside entity, then wouldn't any trained animal would be a robot?
If this is the gist of OP's argument, he might as well have asked "are show dogs robots?"
Mechs are basically armors for the pilots inside them.
So EVA isn't a robot, EVA is a guy who's piloting a giant Mech.
And EVA pilot is piloting the EVA that's piloting the giant mech.
No, that was in the show. After EVA-01's rampage in EP 19.
It is largely irrelevant, it is made to respond to those exact stimuli. It's control and movement is a mechanic process made possible by technology, most importantly, it is deliberate.
No, since the animal would chose to do so. The animal isn't controlled directly, it is suggested an action.
EVAs as an organic being with a soul restrained by technology have shown the ability to become autonomous with mental stimuli from another biological being to the point of being able to "Select" who can pilot them (rejection of the "identical as a pilot" dummy plug) to even moving to what some doctors considered impossible, when Shinji was swallowed into the LCL of 01 did he become part of the robot and lose his humanity or did he become part of another being momentarily?
>robot, any automatically operated machine that replaces human effort, though it may not resemble human beings in appearance or perform functions in a humanlike manner. By extension, robotics is the engineering discipline dealing with the design, construction, and operation of robots.
In other words, robots.
How about when 01 protected Shinji or at EoE when 01 autonomously moved to make Shinji get in? When 01 became a God, it was not a machine but a divergent evolution of Adam that was an organic being. However this was all predetermined as it was a copy of Adam to begin with. Therefore not a robot, but a sealed being.
You forgot "operated", implying operation takes place.
I don't think any giant mecha are technically robots, because none of them can act autonomously.
The exception being, amusingly enough, the mostly organic Eva units. But since they're not mechanical, they aren't robots either.
>No, since the animal would chose to do so. The animal isn't controlled directly, it is suggested an action.
robot, any automatically operated machine
While those are adjectives, saying monster isn't, is wrong.
>It is the equivalent of taking a living person, brainwashing them, restraining them, and hardwiring their brains so that they are slaves, they are now robots.
You twisted the definition of robot to apply it to your argument, good work.
The core facts about the evangelion units is clear in that they are not robots.
Saying human brainwashed slaves are robots therefore evas are robots is wrong.
It's not even a debate, it was crystal clear from the first few episodes/
But robots constraint to programming, or input, while EVAs can react on will and soul.
of course. mech is just short for mechanical. and the evas are machines.
>The animal isn't controlled directly
How direct is "directly?" Does it count as control if I lure ants with sugar? Do they "choose" to follow it? This whole distinction is extremely vague.
By command, though.
I am OP. I didn't make any statement.
But I know that EVAs aren't robots
They constrained by commands and are piloted like robots, still.
Keep in mind that EVA's do not intrinsically have souls. The Evangelion is made without a soul first, the soul is part of the mechanism that controls it.
Even a robot can take actions not explicitly asked for, and in this case, the instinct to protect the child is a part of the robot's mechanism.
What are you trying to say here? The EVA's, but not the animal, fall under the definition of robot.
The Britannica description also refers to artificial humans, i.e robots.
The EVA's are automatically operated on occasion as well, and a robot can also be remotely controlled.
If you tried to make a point, I do not see it.
Evas are robots, though. See: >>101974282
Robots aren't piloted. If they're piloted, they aren't autonomous, and thus can't be classified as robots.
AI and programming don't count as being piloted, because if you program a robot and then leave it alone, it'll continue running on its programming without you.
The EVAs have shown to break the restraints numerous times, and are not controlled by pilots in berserk mode. There is no command to protect Shinji, but Yui's soul made the EVA move to her will beyond the logic and what Akagi considered "Impossible"
>You twisted the definition of robot to apply it to your argument, good work.
I did no such thing. You, however...
>The core facts about the evangelion units is clear in that they are not robots.
And your citation and authority for stating this is where, exactly?
>Saying human brainwashed slaves are robots therefore evas are robots is wrong.
That is within the definition, so it would be correct.
You are just reacting against the idea because you somehow find it "deep" that they werent' robots. You're a pretentious douchebag.
EVAs with dummy plugs, robots.
EVAs without, not robots.
>What are you trying to say here? The EVA's, but not the animal, fall under the definition of robot.
>How direct is "directly?" Does it count as control if I lure ants with sugar? Do they "choose" to follow it? This whole distinction is extremely vague.
It is not. The EVA has wirings directly into it's own body, circuitry, implants, right into it's nervous system, which allows for it to be controlled, monitored and communicated with.
Noone is laying out sugar for the EVA's or asking it to do x or y for a reward. The EVA is, much like a robot, controlled without any input from the EVA itself, if any, it is attempted subdued.
This is to include without a power source, which is the main concern of robotics, and a law of physics, one action has an opposite reaction, no battery: No movement. EVAs moved without a power source before using their biological being.
>Robots aren't piloted. If they're piloted, they aren't autonomous
Mechas are piloted, though. Or are you saying all Super Robots aren't robots?
Technically they are Armored Suits
Just because humans have a measure of control over an organism it does not mean said organism is a robot.
We train dogs, do we not?
We can put armour on a dog, and command it (regardless of it wearing armour of course), can we not?
Are dogs robots?
It's certainly a higher level of control, that which the humans in NGE have over the evangelion units, but they are by no means robots because of the control placed upon them.
>And your citation and authority for stating this is where, exactly?
Authority? Too obvious.
It's 5:30am I'm not going to go through 26 episodes and four films to dump screencaps for a troll.
>You are just reacting against the idea because you somehow find it "deep" that they werent' robots. You're a pretentious douchebag.
6/10 you had me replying until that entire post.
Are you saying that Voltron isn't a robot? The robots in Pacific Rim aren't robots?
>In 1981, the series was re-edited for theatrical release and split into three movies. The characters were designed by Yoshikazu Yasuhiko, and Kunio Okawara was responsible for the mechanical designs, including the eponymous giant robot, the RX-78-2 Gundam.
They aren't. That's why people USE the term "mecha," because they technically aren't robots.
Which is, operating.
Even without they are robots. Still they are commanded by a master, the pilot. Every movement controlled independently from the EVA's own will. Reminder that when the EVA does assert it's will, it is out of control.
Robots aren't piloted? That would be news to me. I do suppose surgical robots aren't robots, or the entire field of engineering and robotics is made completely invalid then.
Robots can indeed be piloted, and you must see the lunacy in people trying to differentiate EVA from "robot anime" such as Gundam..... because the EVA is piloted, and the Gundam isn't.
ALRIGHT NIGGAS HERE WE GO
EVA: Adam Organic with Interface for Lillith being/Cyborg.
Was the fact that frankenstein was human part of the theme?
Or was it just a simple Man Vs. Nature theme?
>Just because humans have a measure of control over an organism it does not mean said organism is a robot.
But that's where the term robot came from. Anything can be a robot as long as it is doing free labor by itself. Be it a human a machine anything.
>It's 5:30am I'm not going to go through 26 episodes and four films to dump screencaps for a troll.
....in other words, you've got nothing.
Anon, they are robots. More than robots, but robots nonetheless.
The word was more ambiguous back then, use your fucking brain, its a cartoon. Gundam writers aren't exactly the cutting edge in robotics or mechanics.
>Even without they are robots. Still they are commanded by a master, the pilot.
By that logic, your car is a robot. A robot doesn't have a pilot, it follows commands.
Are you really quoting wikipedia on something so technical?
It's from an official source, so it's a robot.
>and you must see the lunacy in people trying to differentiate EVA from "robot anime" such as Gundam..... because the EVA is piloted, and the Gundam isn't.
I'm differentiating Evas from other mechas like Gundams because Evas are organic.
And I use the term "mecha" there because Gundams aren't robots, either. Other than the few that actually ARE autonomous, like the Devil Gundam.
An EVA is, from a lack of a single term, a giant clone fitted with robotic parts. The metal plates aren't armor, but limiters so they don't use their full strength. The interface system ("cockpit") is a cilinder-shaped "Entry Plug", which "fills" an empty space in the EVA's spinal cord. The robotic parts are:
- Part of the spinal cord
- Some tendons
- Back of the neck
EVA-01 is a clone of Lilith, thus it has a form that looks passable as a human. The other EVAs are clones of Adam, thus they look a little different, mainly their head, which doesn't look like a human's, but more like a wild animal - see EVA-02, which face looks like a dog or a lizard... something like that.
A car is a mech, a gundam is a mech, Variable wing fighters? Mech. Optimus Prime is a robot, 3CPO is a robot. We throw the word robot because people are scientifically illiterate.
the fuck is a robotic part?
Are you really relying on no resources to back up your point?
Welp if you're too stupid to remember the series and 4 films, on your own head be it.
As I said I'm not going to go through them all at this time to flatten your argument, remembering the contents of what we're discussing is enough closure for me.
But a Mech is a robot.
Robot: An agent which responds to and executes commands, it's actions depending on the application and form of the robot.
Mech: Fictional genre-specific term for a robot with human-like extremeties, often piloted by a human being.
EVA: Robot piloted either by a human being or control software, fashioned from biological and other metallic or synthetic material. In effect, for human control, it is a two-seater mech.
This is an honest question, and not an effort to debunk either side.
Are there any natural living organisms that run off of electricity generated by an outside source?
>I'm differentiating Evas from other mechas like Gundams because Evas are organic.
That's all right. That difference does exist.
>And I use the term "mecha" there because Gundams aren't robots, either. Other than the few that actually ARE autonomous, like the Devil Gundam.
That is a mistake, Gundams are definitely robots. According to it's own creator, the dictionary definition, in every way that matters, the Gundam and the EVA is a robot.
A robot can be fully autonomous or semi-autonomous.
You're pathetic, you know that? I wonder just how pathetic you must be to keep the pretense up. You poor insecure little thing.
By the way, EVA-01 is brown/black in color (beneath the armor). You can see it when it feasts on one of the Angels, I think one of its arms is ripped off and it recreates the arm... or was it that it ripped the metal plates from the armor off? I think I'm mixing the anime with Rebirth. Either way, EVA-01 was the one that we've seen the most of (if you don't count EVA-02's entrails).
There are EVAs that came before EVA-00. They're called Proto EVAs, and are failures that were discarded in Central Dogma. Some of those prototypes see more use - i.e. the "simulators" the Children use to test their synchro rate? They're actually EVA carcasses, just the top part (torso and head).
One more thing: what really matters is the core of the EVA, not the body. The cores are swappable - it happened at least twice (Rei can pilot EVA-01 in the beginning, but not after the core recognizes Shinji as... well, that's a spoiler).
The electricity in your body comes from an outside source, but you generate the electricity yourself.
To answer your question, not to my knowledge, although it's hardly relevant tot he discussion.
>You're pathetic, you know that? I wonder just how pathetic you must be to keep the pretense up. You poor insecure little thing.
Don't blame me because you're ignoring several portions of a 26 episode series + 4 films and doing nothing but claiming no source.
Clearly you haven't even watched them recently, so until you do, don't bother arguing the point.
I want to choke you slowly in your sleep sometimes anon, but I still love you so I will take the time to re-explain myself to you.
A robot is an autonomous/programmed artificially created being/object, this can range from a simple arm made to move a cube from one place to another, and to keep doing so until it runs out of juice/breaks, to a being that can think for itself but is made of mechanical parts, down to the processing/thinking level.
A "mech" is an object that serves a purpose but requires interface from another party directly, it has the basic of functions, but cannot do any thinking outside of computing to fulfill its purpose, examples, a jet, a car, a variable wing fighter etc.
They have a metal casing around their spine (there's also a space to insert the entry plug). It's a mechanical part, simple and clean.
The "limiters" are metal rods that tighten the muscles and hold them in place, hidering them from exerting past a certain threshold. Once the limiter is turned off (either by NERV or by the EVA itself), the rods will come off the muscles, and you can see them from the outside. You can see them pretty clearly in the end of the 2nd Rebirth movie.
So is Eva a mech?
>(Kidō Senshi Gandamu)
>Genre: Military science fiction, Real Robot
Not technically unless you count an artificial organ or a pacemaker as a part of a being run by electricity of an outside source.
>By that logic, your car is a robot.
Modern cars to some degree, are. Only extremely simplified.
>A robot doesn't have a pilot, it follows commands.
Oh? You would say that turning the wheel, and the car's mechanic and hardwired response, is not you commanding the car to perform a turn?
so suddenly any metallic or mechanical part can be called "robotic" just for the sake of it?
those aren't robotic parts. And you are wrong
>Unut 01, it's reached it's limit!
>It's backup power is down!
>According to it's own creator,
Doesn't matter. It's a misnomer. Just because everyone calls them "panda bears" doesn't make them, scientifically, bears.
>the dictionary definition
The dictionary definition of a robot says they have to be autonomous and mechanical. Gundams fail the first point, and Evas fail the second. If something is autonomous but not mechanical, it's a living thing. If it's mechanical but not autonomous, well, there isn't really a mainstream word for that, but in the current context it's a mecha.
Eva is an organic cyborg that has an interface for humans, not quite a mech, if I had to describe it to something I would call it almost parasitism.
Are armored horses robots?
>A robot is an autonomous/programmed artificially created being/object,
Semi-autonomous or autonomous.
Mechs can be fully autonomous as well.
The level of abstraction is perhaps at a level you don't understand. Even in Gundam, the mech (robot) acts with autonomy, the pilot doesn't pilot it with the thought of "raise right arm, squeeze right trigger finger, or even left right leg control. That part is autonomous.
A surgical robot, is a mech as well as a robot.
You would be surprised to know there are at least two robots shaped after a horse, that are also controlled by a horse.
Aren't they cyborgs?
No, no. A horse that has armor, is that a robot? Because it has
If an Eva is a robot, then an armored horse is a robot.
Arguably. Cyborgs have the non-organic parts helping, not hindering. The only non-organic parts on Evas are there to limit its abilities.
after 3.33, there ain't shit in the world that would surprise me
The EVA's mechanical parts are cirurgically inserted into them, they're not just external armor.
Even older than that, actually. G Gundam is about as old as the Eva TV series.
>Doesn't matter. It's a misnomer. Just because everyone calls them "panda bears" doesn't make them, scientifically, bears.
It is a point to consider however.
I also see you have some peculiar and strange dictionary definition. Very narrow of living and life as well.
The oxford dictionary, the merriam-webster dictionary, and about a dozen others make no claim as to whether or not it should be fully autonomous. Maybe you should recheck.
It is merely a device or agent capable of carrying out complex tasks as instructed. That's the magic to it.
People retards often want to claim eva especially subverts something or tricks the audience. It's part of the charm, you see. So people would love the idea of "omg they weren't robots, just like soylent green is people, what a twweestt!", and would go really far to defend that, even to ruin the definition of robot by making excuses like saying there's biological parts in the machine. It doesn't matter.
The original "robots" weren't even mechanical, they were actual people.
It is hard to explain but let me answer >>101975551 and add on to my previous answer, http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/09/0901_050901_wormparasite.html
In the article there is the topic that bacteria can in fact reprogram the brain of the host into subjecting itself into some situations, so think as the cybernetics as the method that humans use to control the brain of the EVA, we hear numerous times that they are in place to "restrain" the EVA, but why? That is because they are living beings.
What episode is that?
That doesn't make them any more robots than some human with prosthetic parts.
It was for some cross-promotion commercial from when Eva 3.0 was about to hit theatres.
look at this faggot.
look at him and laugh
Stop baiting the one anon going all scientific and shit, he doesn't know he is being trolled softly.
>retards often want to claim eva especially subverts something or tricks the audience. It's part of the charm, you see. So people would love the idea of "omg they weren't robots, just like soylent green is people, what a twweestt!"
Nobody's said that. I didn't even enjoy evangelion, but wow, your whole reason for arguing this is an emotional one against a group of people who don't even exist.
Guess what kiddo, it's not the amount of electronics in your body that makes you a robot.
It's whether or not you are wired to and in effect, accept commands and execute them.
>Nobody's said that. I didn't even enjoy evangelion, but wow, your whole reason for arguing this is an emotional one against a group of people who don't even exist.
>who don't even exist.
Yeah, I wish.
The EVAs have personalities, and can feel pain and anger. This alone makes them as un-robotic as you can get.
how does that make them robots?
you people just keep avoiding the central point whenever you are proven wrong
>they are mechanical, hence robots
>ok but they are man made, hence robots
>ok but they can be controlled, hence robots
nope nope nope
a car is mechanical, can be controlled and has electronic circuits. doesn't make it a robot
a warhorse has organic and mechanic parts, can be controlled, is partly autonomous, can be grown by man. that doesn't make it a cyborg.
EVAs are not robots.
you people are just doing damage control at this point
Are you new? That's the big problem with eva fans in general.
Ignorance and blind belief, all in one convenient package. EVA's aren't "mechs", or even "robots" because
>a car is mechanical, can be controlled and has electronic circuits. doesn't make it a robot
why are you trying to use "panda bears" as an example of a misnomer? Pandas are bears.
Apply yourself next time. You're being too obvious.
they're clearly cyborgs
how is this even a debate?
>Eva 'robot' has no power left
>Oh hi mom
>how does that make them robots?
You got it explained? They are in fact, machines wired to accept and execute commands. Is there more to this story? Of course, but they are robots nonetheless.
>a car is mechanical, can be controlled and has electronic circuits. doesn't make it a robot
Actually, yes, it does. But it's not a term we use because we have the better word "car".
>a warhorse has organic and mechanic parts, can be controlled, is partly autonomous, can be grown by man. that doesn't make it a cyborg.
That's retarded. Do you even know what a cyborg is?
>EVAs are not robots.
They are as robot as robot can be, my friend.
Too soon, man. Too soon.
>For many decades, the precise taxonomic classification of the giant panda was under debate because it shares characteristics with both bears and raccoons. However, molecular studies suggest the giant panda is a true bear and part of the Ursidae family, though it differentiated early in history from the main ursine stock. The giant panda's closest extant relative is the spectacled bear of South America. The giant panda has been referred to as a living fossil.
he probably ment the red panda (a marsupial)
Give me a break, I haven't watched it.
>They are in fact, machines wired to accept and execute commands
that definition is CLEARLy in contrast with all other we found, but even if it were correct, even if I granted you that:
1) Evas are not autonomous when plugged (repeated for the 3rd time)
2) Evas do not execute mechanical nor routine tasks
3) Evas do not work on command, they are controlled.
I disagree, emotion alone does not compose a living being, since technically emotions are programmed into our brain by electrical currents and the release of certain chemicals, all which can "eventually" be reproduced by machines. I think the main concern is the biological aspect of the being, and the idea of "soul" Animals are programmed to fight, to hunt, to mate, to eat, to migrate. But this is a result of evolution, a process unaffected by machine, machines can be programmed to fight, to hunt, to mate, to eat, to migrate, but that programming is based on the human experience, not evolution.
He's retarded. He thinks panda's aren't bears. I mean he even tries to use the word "scientifically" when we've already determined the genealogy of the species, and yes, it is a fucking bear.
wait, did you just copy/paste my comment from the previous thread ??
Fine, that was a bad example. I'm an idiot.
Koalas, then. People call THEM bears as well, and they aren't.
>can be controlled
He didn't say "Can be controlled". He said "wired to and in effect, accept commands and execute them". These two phrases are entirely different, but I bet you're ignoring that because you're loving the attention.
>You got it explained? They are in fact, machines wired to accept and execute commands
So a toaster is a robot then yeah? It does a mechanical routine task on command. That definition is pretty godawful you should look at the other bunch we quoted along with the etymology of the word.
Shitposting and what not.
Because some people are silly.
>Why can't I hold all of this robot?
>Oh, because I'm missing an arm
>Hold up boys, let me just regrow it real fast
Didn't we see Unit 01 without the top of its helmet at the end of episode 2?
Even still, in the very first fight we see, we hear a distinct crunch and squish as Sachiel crushed Unit 01's arm?
I mean, that alone gives away its nature as being organic. Anime doesn't really use squishes and crunches when mecha are crushed, right?
>1) Evas are not autonomous when plugged (repeated for the 3rd time)
Robots don't need to be autonomous. Picture related.
>2) Evas do not execute mechanical nor routine tasks
They don't? They handle large pieces of equipment with their appendages, they are giant humanoid robots.
>3) Evas do not work on command, they are controlled.
I'm getting trolled aren't I
>They are in fact, machines wired to accept and execute commands.
Right there. "On command" doesn't mean that it's piloted you know, or you should check what a command is as well.
I swear this is an Eve no Jikan thread.
Has anyone said "Wow, you're right. You have proven me wrong" yet?
dude, you just keep copy/pasting my previous posts....
>What are organic robots?
There is no difference between having emotions and replicating emotions to the outside observer.
>Robots don't need to be autonomous. Picture related.
>a real or imaginary machine that is controlled by a computer and is often made to look like a human or animal
>a machine that can do the work of a person and that works automatically or is controlled by a computer
>a device that automatically performs complicated often repetitive tasks
Therefore Evas are not robots.
>emotions are programmed into our brain
By who? That's the difference between artificial intelligence and genuine intelligence. One of them is programmed into place with by a different agent.
this guy >>101976427 learned that a panda was a bear today.
How about you answer this: >>101976494
It isn't like they could be both or anything. That would be ridiculous. Especially for anime.
And he'll soon learn that Eva are robots too!
Are you saying toasters aren't robots?
Yes, they are robots, but because of their very, very limited use, and because a robot is designed for complex tasks, we call it a toaster and not a robot.
On command, that he device/agent/thing responds to command, an instruction, or even a gesture, as it is programmed to do, wired to do, is perfectly in tone with piloting. Flicking of a switch, the pull of a lever, a mere thought, all commands, all actions with the intent to impose a directive, an order. Through the language, be it voice, thought, gesture, movement, farting, the robot responds and executes the associated command.
Forward button, forward movement. Backward button, backward movement. Kill all humans button, well, you get the picture.
EVAs are restrained by cybernetics, however where your argument flails is one key term away: Humanoid. EVAs are not made in the image of humans, they are made in the image of Adam, as they are clones of Adam. Their cybernetics are in place to restraint the Adam, and to prevent them from "Awakening" The only units able to "Awaken" have a soul, thus the adam is but a biological shell to a soul, which is added information to the idea of the failed "shells"
Welcome to the Cyborg faction. Now watch the thread and enjoy the show.
So where is that word in the greentext? The site you link to? Autonomous?
Huh, you're right.
I dropped Attack on Titan a while ago so I forgot that I basically thought of the Titan forms as flesh mechs.
What I mean is that the Titan forms were just giant bodies that the people in them essentially piloted. I mean it really isn't too different from shit like psychoframes in terms of UI.
That and the way they appeared to be built was also less alive, and more like a series of parts.
Though that would be pretty horrifying to pilot an organic mech without any sort of Armour obscuring its identity like an EVA.
>She's taking the S2 engine into herself?
>Eva Unit 01 is...
>That's right. It's not really armor.
>Those are restraints that allow us to control the Eva's power.
>But now the Eva is removing the web that binds it to our will
>We can no longer control the Eva
>Unit 01's been awakened and set free
There's a lot more detailing it as we all remember, but I love the OST during this scene the most so I went and grabbed it.
You're retarded, since you're implying that autonomous = automatic.
>EVAs are restrained by cybernetics, however where your argument flails is one key term away: Humanoid. EVAs are not made in the image of humans,
Did you just have a brainfart?
Did you seriously just erase the entire meaning of the word "humanoid", because Adam technically, predates humans inside a fantasy universe?
LOOK AT ADAM, AND IF YOU DARE SAY THAT IS NOT HUMANOID, I WILL FUCKING FIND YOU AND SHIT DOWN YOUR NECK
>doesn't know autonomous and automatic have the same roots
More humiliating proof.
>A robot is a mechanical or virtual agent, usually an electro-mechanical machine that is guided by a computer program or electronic circuitry. Robots can be autonomous or semi-autonomous and range from humanoids such as Honda's Advanced Step in Innovative Mobility (ASIMO) and TOSY's TOSY Ping Pong Playing Robot (TOPIO) to industrial robots, collectively programmed 'swarm' robots, and even microscopic nano robots. By mimicking a lifelike appearance or automating movements, a robot may convey a sense of intelligence or thought of its own
Obviously, but a cyborg could be a robot as well.
>he thinks cars and toasters are robots
Learn the dictionary meaning of the term.
I thought we already had this argument fucking years ago.
What's the occasion today?
>doesn't know autonomous and automatic have the same roots
Most words have the same roots, but they mean different things.
Darth Vader is not a robot, Americunt.
I see you ignored this part
>Robots can be autonomous or semi-autonomous
Nowhere there are Robots described to not be autonomous.
The only one being humiliated here is yourself. Autonomous and automatic share a root like many words in the english language, but they have two separate meanings which destroy your petty argument.
Why wouldn't they be? Objects or concepts can be defined by more than one word.
You're a life-form, but you're also a human being, more precisely. Am I not correct?
In the same way, a car and a toaster is a robot, but more precisely, a car and a toaster.
Just saying but a "robot" is a self controlled system that does some sort of work, evas are vehicles if anything. I know you americans call anything a robot that has metallic parts but if you gonna argue so much about it then yeah that is actually wrong.
it all started out because of this
ok, fuck this shit.
I'll have to agree with the other anon, AMERITARDS don't even know what a robot is.
Do you even understand the universe of Eva? They call humans Lillith beings, because the two seeds of origin fell on earth. Humans are the "18th angel". Gifted with the fruit of Knowledge. Created from the blood of lilith.
>Nowhere there are Robots described to not be autonomous.
What do you think semi-autonomous is? The Gundam and EVA are both semi-autonomous. They are directed continuously through a pilot's control, making them semi-autonomous.
Do you have some form of problem with understanding "could" ?
Burgerland residents shitflinging for the sake of it.
It's been determined that they aren't robots since the 90s.
He's right, though.
Semi-autonomous <> not autonomous
There should always be a degree of autonomy in a being for it to become a robot.
>It's been determined that they aren't robots since the 90s.
Gundam are not semi autonomous, they do not move on will, they move on command, EVAs choose, move at will without power sources and refuse orders.
>living entity with its own will able to make decisions and take actions not programmed into it
Sage for full retard.
>It's been determined that they aren't robots since the 90s.
On the other hand, Anno describes the EVA's as robots, even super-robots.
That's not what semi-autonomous means. If they're not moving without pilot direction, then they're not autonomous or semi-autonomous. They're vehicle.s
I really need to make a flow chart for this.
If it can be piloted and is mechanical it's a Mech.
If it can be piloted and isn't mechanical it's a bio weapon, or whatever the fuck the term would be
If it can't be piloted and is mechanical it's just a machine
If it's autonomous and mechanical it's a robot
If it's autonomous and a mix of mechanical and organic it's a cyborg
If it's autonomous and is organic it's alive and most likely an animal
If it's sentient and mechanical it's an A.I or program
If it's sentient and organic it's a person or some variation like a humanoid alien
Anything else that doesn't fall under those categories is one thing and one thing only:
EVAs aren't robots.
Why don't we just call them Bio Weapons?
>Gundam are not semi autonomous
Definitely they are. Their movements and actions are autonomous, calculated by it's computer. Where to take the step, where to aim, it's all done by computer, semi-autonomously based on the pilots commands.
The EVA's work in the same way. But, some times, they fail to do that - emphasis on fail - because the EVA's are highly unstable and experimental.
Check out this series from the 90s, it's called Neon Genesis Evangelion.
I don't think you understand what the word autonomous means anon.
The source of autonomy matters. If it's acting in a way that wasn't programmed, it has genuine (not artificial) intelligence. Nobody programmed evas to eat S2 organs or feel emotions or any of that. It just comes naturally.
You mean the same faggot that added the word Evangelion for shits and giggles?
He created it, moron. It's his work that's being debated.
Stop being retarded.
What is the EVA but a vehicle?
If you're not autonomous, you cannot take any action at all whatsoever without the exact input needed to do everything.
The Gundam and EVA are both semi-autonmous, they use a pilot to operate it which is where they get the input needed to perform their task.
For instance, the pilot of the RX-72 presses a button to target and fire at an enemy in front of him. What does the Gundam do? It does a bunch of calculations, it lifts it's robot hands, it takes aim and it actually presses a physical trigger. It obeyed a commaned and semi-autonomously executed it.
The EVA works in a similar way, only with thought as well as button presses.
So are Evas robots or not?
They are giant cyborgs turned into robots.
They have the potential to break free.
Wrong, their movement is PREDETERMINED by a computer, hydraulic pressure release in hatch 3, angle 3 degrees, pressurize point 2, movement 30m front, cease movement, manual input x axis minus 3, rotation 30 pressurize point 6. The movements are programmed to be that way, it is NOT organic, do you tell your brain all this information to bend down or is there a tiny pilot with a joystick in your brain doing all your will?
So they are robots?
>implying animals aren't sentient
Adam Cyborgs retrained by human tech to be controlled
Yes, the EVA's are robots. They are constructed, mechanical and biomechanical beings, in effect a cyborg, that has been programmed and hardwired to serve as robots, more accurately, mechs.
However, they are also beings with a suppressed will.
Some are and some aren't.
>living entities with their own will able to make decisions and take actions not programmed into them are robots
because then any soldier would be a bioweapon.
the real definition of bioweapon is a pathological or elsewise dangerous microorganism of some sort
I still think "Pants shittingly terrifying insult to god abominations" is the best term.
But yeah, didn't say that was absolute, just how I think of it.
I agree with you too, I feel like the EVA's could easily be equated to Kaiju with reins attached to giant nails driven into their skulls.
With the pilots basically using those to control them from neck saddles.
I swear I've seen that somewhere.
If I implied that, I didn't mean to.
I guess "intelligence on par with, or greater than, a person" is what I'd describe my definition of sentience as.
No because they make a huge deal out of the fact that they're not in the series.
Which makes every one of those things, on the computers own level, autonomous. The robot itself is semi-autonomous for the reasons you mention.
Okay, then can we just call them what they are?
you mean grown. there is a difference.
Horses are grown too, add some armor and they are cyborgs. they can even be commanded. doesn't make them robots
Lilith is a human? and Adam too?
I don't know anymore.
Why do you think it's possible to refer to people as robots?
You know, the first "robots" in fiction, and the ones that coined the word, were also living entities with their own will.
"Robot", translated from it's originating language, means "forced labour", or "slave" IIRC. That's what the robot is.
>Definitions are what I want them to be
No, soldiers are bioweapons just as much as say the weaponized Marburg virus the russians have.
But we are not computers, you can refuse orders if given orders, the only way a Gundam stops functioning is damage or lockout from controls, EVAs have shown to reject orders thus making them organic being restrained by cybernetics.
Mind-controlled clones of alien deities with armor plating, cybernetic enhancements, and in the case of Eva 01 - the soul of a human.
>add some armor and they are cyborgs
That's not what cyborgs mean.
>you mean grown. there is a difference.
The difference means nothing. The mechanical parts are constructed, and so are the bio mechanical ones.
The non-organic parts are assembled, the organic ones are grown, but the EVA is constructed from both mechanical and organic parts.
>add some armor and they are cyborgs
just as much as evas are bioweapons
>soul of a human
But he's made of Lilith, the mother of humanity.
I'm not talking our terms of classification. I'm talking the in universe classification if they refer to the EVA's as angels.
It doesn't even need to be spoken, some supplementary material is fine.
I don't know what anything is anymore.
>Why do you think it's possible to refer to people as robots?
The definition has changed. Slaves aren't robots. Their brains weren't crafted cell by cell by an outside agent to suit a specific task. If it's not programmed for a purpose, it's not a robot.
I'm talking about how Shinji's mom's soul is inside Unit 01.
>But we are not computers, you can refuse orders if given orders
So can a computer. given it's programming. It can deny you from executing the order you want.
The Gundam is well-programmed, and on some occasions, it will refuse orders or instructions as well, it will even take control.
EVA's are organic beings restrained by cybernetics, but they are robots as well.
>clone of alien
lol yes.you need to watch some psycho pass
>we are not computers
Well your brain really is just a circuitboard. Made of cells that are completely reliant on outside stimulus. Every single thing you do and say is because of you're environment. You never did anything that was truly your actions, there's nothing in you that has magical free will and rationality. Everything you are made of is just responding to signals, so you are as well.
Except Evas are functionally robots.
>The definition has changed.
No, this is the current definition.
Slaves are more accurately called slaves. We have many words for the same thing.
I think they said it in the series at some point. also in EoE. not gonna look for it though sorry, i'm not that much into this debate
>lol yes.you need to watch some psycho pass
Jesus Christ, implants <> armor. Psycho Pass has nothing to do with this. You're simply wrong.
>No, this is the current definition.
Not in English, hombre.
The answer doesn't lie in the general process of action anon, it lies on the origin of the being, Gundams are pure machines, but they are Mechs awaiting instruction, Optimus Prime is a pure machine with a sense of being, making him a robot. EVAs are organic beings restrained by cybernetics, making them cyborgs. Why won't you listen to logic you mongrel.
Look it up. It includes the usage of referring to a person as a robot.
Gundams are pure machines, but so are the EVA's. Biological machines.
Organic, is also mechanic.
I can see why you might think evas were robots considering you classify living human slaves as robots, but that's not what the word means.
>You're simply wrong.
only in your mind
>EoE? I never bothered to watch it.
Shit negro what are you doing
Dismiss-able, I already talked about it >>101976395
EVA 01 acted on its own instinct and absorbed the N2 engine on its own.
Except you can't even refute the point.
Show me. If you mean humans can be called robots in metaphor, then that's fine, but that doesn't make them literal robots. It's just like saying a person is a "busy bee" doesn't mean you're literally saying they're a flying insect.
>robots or humanoids
>Horses are grown too, add some armor and they are cyborgs
This Horse analogy is bullshit. Not even part of this argument but that's fucking ridiculous. Horses choose to co-operate, just as humans choose to do jobs for one another. For both humans and horses punishment is an incentive, with being poor being the punishment on the human side. EVAs on the other hand are completely forced, not through incentive or punishment, but through brain and muscle hijack. Humans don't pull this shit on horses. Some sort of willingness must be present. Eva units aren't fucking rewarded. Try actually being around horses before you start throwing this bullshit comparison around. I give 0 fucks about whether Evas are robots or not. Just get your facts straight about horses. Fuck.
>clone of alien with a human soul in it
The EVAs are not Machines, they are organic being controlled by humans blah blah blah read this >>101975825 blah blah blah
But only Adam is a alien for us unless Lilith.
How are horses any different from your claim that Evas are robots? If Evas aren't robots, then so are armored horses.
But we didn't program the EVAs. And the chemicals in the brain could not possibly be reproduced by a comupter unless you build a computer out of tiny computers in a vat that communicated through diffusion. In which case you just built a brain. Which is also a computer.
>I can see why you might think evas were robots considering you classify living human slaves as robots, but that's not what the word means.
The dictionary, the origin of the word, it all disagrees with you.
Contemporary robots, ethical, clean robots are all electronic. People are only exposed to this and will think that only the computer-controlled robot is indeed, a robot.
But a robot, even in fiction, is shown to take multiple shapes. Biological. Even non-physical, ephemeral. A common plot is to have "the robot" attain sentience, to qualify itself as being just as living a being as you or I.
The original robots, they were not mechanical. They were commanded and used to do tasks, and in the end, they revolt despite their "programming".
EVA's are like that. They intrinsically have no souls. They are biological machines, imbued with a human soul to power it's control mechanism. In all effect, the Evangelion is a two-seater mech: The mother pilot, and the child pilot that together synchronize and makes the Evangelion move.
What are you trying to argue for? That the brain can be broken down to be a machine? Sure in layman's terms yes, the computer is a machine, but in no sense it is robotic.
>How are horses any different from your claim that Evas are robots
I never said that Evas are or aren't robots. I'm stating that horses aren't programmed to take commands or pre-ordained to do tasks for humans, but willingly carry them out. Evas do not willingly act under human will. I'm not taking sides in this argument. I'm just saying that you don't know shit about horses, and you should stop using that shit analogy.
The origin of the word referred to slaves in Czech and Russian. It definitely doesn't refer to slaves in modern English.
The meaning's changed. Robots are programmed by outside entities. This is the difference between artificial and genuine intelligence. Nobody programmed evas to have emotions or punch things or eat certain organs--it just comes naturally. This really isn't complicated.
Dude clearly likes horses.
The origin explains the current use, and explains why we don't just call what you propose to be robots, for machines.
Even in the current definition over at oxford, merriam-websters, and even in fiction and debate, it refers to the structure a slave would follow - obey the commands that are given.
In fact, it is the only thing that's solidly defined, it's capacity for doing as it's told automatically without question.
How is it not?
What about its being nothing more than a complex input/output device makes it free?
What part of you is free?
In the play that's the origin of the word "robot," the entities didn't have souls, so even using your origin story idea evas don't count since they have will and emotion.
evas and human slaves are only "robots" metaphorically, since they aren't programmed.
>they aren't programmed.
They are though. By your genes and brain structure acquired by past experiences you were programmed to do everything you do.
Programming by an outside entity. This is the distinction between genuine intelligence and artificial intelligence.
What about that isn't external?
They are cyborgs. I can't believe this thread is almost 300 posts.
You ignored the word "entity." Nobody sat down one day building humans and decided they would like the taste of honey more than feces. It arose without any such designer.
Cyborgs can be robots.
Not metaphorically, in actuality. They are programmed, how do you think the control system works?
They have a will, yes, which is supressed. They are robots, but when said suppression breaks... they no longer are.
le intelligent design faec ;^)
Are you saying that your parents didn't have a massive impact on who you are today? I would consider them entities, and I would consider the choices they made raising you as programming seeing as it set the foundations for your brain and everything.
They have emotions constantly, which aren't programmed. When they want to enough, they break the constraints. If they had no souls I'd agree with you, but they have will and intentions that nobody programmed.
"influence" != "programmed and designed for an explicit purpose"
>which aren't programmed
You're not getting this are you.
After confirming that they're cyborgs why does it matter if they're subclassed as robots? It's as meaningless as arguing if an android is alive because there will never be a proper consensus.
Even emotions and all that is programmed.
In EVA there is the exception however, which makes them more than robots as I said. But as long as that is suppressed, they are robots.
Programming does not require intention.
Then Evas are robots.
>emotions and all that is programmed.
By who? What entity decided I should be happier when I eat than when I starve?
That's the cruelty of it, random chance.
Get the fuck out with the pseudo science bullshit, I already explained that programming due to evolution differs from artificial programming
Yes it does.
>programmed and designed for an explicit purpose
Well lets look at that shall we. You were raised to be what I hope is a functioning member of society, and you were designed by your genetic code to be able to fuel your existence and pass on your genes.
But r they real robots or super robots?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
This argument is fucking stupid.
Do you guys think yourselves as Nietzsche or Freud? These pseudo-intellectual babbles are embarrassing to read.
So nothing. No planner, no intention, no program. That is unless you think rocks are "programmed" to fall downhill.
How is simple cause and effect applied to your cells and then to you as a whole in any way a psuedo science?
Clearly I never said that. Try harder.
They're real super robots.
Does it matter who programmed it? The rock would fall either way.
>designed by your genetic code
Which has no agency. Using "design" in the sense of something that can't think is like saying rocks were "programmed" to fall down hills instead of up them.
You didn't refute that they can be subclassed as robots, therefore they're robots.
You are worse than the decadence explained by Niezstche and have more brain issues than Freud's Thesis.
Fuck you m8
Are you saying that the word of the Council of Anons is not trustworthy or scientifically accepted?
But there is a program for you. That is why you are predictable. That is why all of your actions aren't random bullshit. That is why you do what it is that you do.
The idea that a machine's programming makes it "alive" I'm done with this fucking thread, if you wanna talk about this shit go to /pol/ or /sci/ or fucking /narnia/
In total EVAs are Adam/Lillith based Cyborgs that's it, fuck you and your fucking illiterate 90's kid bullshit mind.
The use of words like "program" and "design" necessitates thinking agents.
Not to get all fedora tippy but nobody programmed the laws of physics, anon.
Yet for some reason it's directly responsible for your design.
You have a design. It is determined by, among other things, your genetic code.
If that code were different you would be different.
Stop hiding behind the flaws in an imperfect language and make a fucking point already.
I didn't refute that they cannot be subclassed as robots, therefore the opposite is an equal possibility.
Why is everything so black and white, anon? Why are you look to reinforce your opinion in a post that leans towards neither side?
>I didn't refute that they cannot be subclassed as robots
So Evas can be robots.
Laws require enforcement anon, there's no time and space police. I don't see how you can call something a law when you aren't required to abide by it.
They also could not be robots. All things could ultimately be possible since this world is warped by our subjective views. We only create "facts" by combining this collective of skewed viewpoints in an attempt to line them up. Everything is ultimately possible anon. Everything.
No plan, no purpose, no design.
>make a fucking point already.
Robots are programmed and designed by agents for a purpose. Evas aren't robots because they don't meet these criteria.
Oh I agree with you there. I just want you to understand why determinism is right.
Yeah, no the people saying EVAs are robots are fucking stupid.
So Evas aren't Robots, But are they Mechs?
Anno's vegetarianism strong.
So after the 26 eps, what do i watch? anyone got the pic with all the movies and shit?
what end of evangelion. rebuilds are optional, death and rebirth is a waste of time
fuck, i can't type today
They're cyborg aliens.
But they are robots.