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Guide (Start here):
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1G5C7fCe07CDzYalZYZObzxv_fhw7RUNsLHiMAY-t7FA/edit

Reading List:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv?key=0Agk2IH0ZXhn7dDNmSW1BVFU5dVgyOHkzWjU4b2l2dkE
#l/a/nguage on irc.rizon.net
Pastebin
http://pastebin.com/w0gRFM0c

Previous Thread:
http://archive.foolz.us/a/thread/101688231/#101688231

Didn't see a DJT thread up. Looks like there hasn't been for two days. Why is that?

I've never made a DJT thread so I apologize if I missed something
>>
>>101824885
There was a thread up just a few hours ago.
>>
>>101824968
Looks like the archives fooled me.
>>
>>101824885
When learning grammar, is this something you review and study numerous times, or is it moreso something you look over once?
>>
This means mountain exit, correct?

いでる山

Or is it exit mountain? is there a better way to say it?
>>
>>101825456
>asking a question without posting the full sentence
You're an idiot.
>>
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Does anyone have any advice for self-studying above the elementary level Genki books?

Apparently the intermediate and advanced levels don't have answer keys, I can't really enroll at a uni with an instructor either. Are there keys for the workbooks that only instructors have access to?
>>
>>101825901
Read.
>>
あたし、ちょっとしたモンなんです・・・すうでにこのトシにして、もう。

I'm pretty sure thats この歳にして and it looks like a phrase but i can't find anything on it, what's the joke here I don't get it.
>>
>>101825973
Probably もう is implying もう無理 so it's something like "At this age, I can't do it"

Hard to elaborate without more context though.
>>
>>101825942

I get that, but you're def learning less without being able to check workbook answers etc
>>
>>101826239
Back to the classroom with you.
>>
>>101826091
She uses it again in the sentence でも、あたしは!身もココロも!すうでにこのトシにして、もう!but it seems to hold a different meaning.

I feels like she trying to say she's already this old (yet more mature then she looks) but isn't ちょっとしたもの a polite/humble phrase? They seem to clash.
>>
狭き門より入れ♂
>>
>>101825380
I imagine it varies from person to person. I was already trying to read as I was studying grammar so I never felt the need to review. Reading was my way of reviewing.
>>
>>101826239
Shut up and start reading.
>>
>>101825380
I would say it a combination of the two, it is something you should look over many times.

You see people quite often who are learning grammar very slowly, because they are doing all the exercises and trying to master the grammar before they move on. You don't need to do this. Just learn enough so you will recognize it when you see it, you have the rest of your life to master it.

I recently started learning German, and the first thing I did was find a grammar site, similar to Tae Kim, and just read the entire thing in 1-2 days. I don't remember much of it, but if I am having a problem with grammar in a sentence, I can easily find the relevant section, or I know the correct terms to use in Google to find an answer.
>>
What does ごほーび mean?
>>
>>101828234
Reward or prize.
>>
>>101828398
Is it a dialect/specialized word? Google translate and checking multiple translation sites gave me nothing. I thought it meant breakfast because I kept getting food blogs.
>>
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Why do people recommend Google IME? I've found it far inferior to the built in Windows one, always fucking recommending shitty interweb slang and the learning algorithm is beyond terrible.
>>
Is it really possible to learn purely through self-study? how many people here have actually been given lessons in school, college, university or abroad?
>>
>>101826091
A:あと3年もすれば、正式に鑑識課への配属がきまりますから。

A: あたし、ちょっとしたモンなんです・・・すうでにこのトシにして、もう。

B:・・・あの。現在の職業をセイカクに言うと・・・?

A:まあ、カガク的にあえてゲンミツに言うのであれば・・

A:”こうこうにねんせい”?になるのかもしれませんケド。

A: でも、あたしは!身もココロも!すうでにこのトシにして、もう!

B:(やれやれ・・・タマゴか・この子も)

Really long drawn out stupid context but I really don't get the joke here, it feels like there's a punchline but it's going over my head.
>>
>>101829772
>Is it really possible to learn purely through self-study?
Ask the hundreds of polyglots on youtube, they've learn several languages purely through self-study.
>>
>>101829647
It's just an odd way of spelling ごほうび.
>>
>>101829772
The only that can really screw up self-study is that you're accountable only to yourself and not teachers and grades. If you're a disciplined person then that's not really an issue. There's also the chance that you're learning the wrong thing without knowing it so it's important to pay attention to what you're doing. It's recommended to interact with other speakers because of this. Aside from that there's really no difference.
>>
>>101830226
>There's also the chance that you're learning the wrong thing without knowing it so it's important to pay attention to what you're doing.
I never thought this was really an issue. If you read and listen to the language a lot, any misunderstanding you might have will soon be resolved by itself.
>>
>>101829799
The joke is that she's claiming she's too old when she's actually a high schooler
>身もココロも!すでにこのトシにして、もう
>>
>>101829772

I tried doing lessons once, since I hit a wall in my self study and I was just too lazy to keep doing. I thought having a schedule for classes and a teacher to help would make me do better.
I was way too advanced for the class though, and the slow ass pace and teacher with a really awkward pronunciation made me kinda mad. I only got to see around 20 kanji in half a year I spent there.
It seemed like she was making us waste our times on purpose. Doing things like getting up from the chair and drawing the kana in the air with our fingers usually took like half and hour of class, and if we had some minutes left we did paper cranes.
Not to mention I had the worst kind of weeaboos and social rejects as my classmates. And not the silent kind, like the average /a/ browser, these guys had no idea what "hiding powerlevel" meant at all.
I ended up dropping it and taking it slowly and comfy at home.
>>
>>101830383
Well yea I caught that I though that タマゴか was the punchline or something and I still don't really get why it's there.

Also can you explain how あえて is used there? I've been having problems understanding it recently.
>>
>>101830784
DOJG probably has a section on it.
>>
>>101830784
>and I still don't really get why it's there.
Don't you know the first thing about boke and tsukkomi dynamics?
>>
>>101830963
Nope, I don't know too much about Japanese comedy, I'm just reading this for the practice.
>>
>>101831020
It's just that it's something that's so pervasive I'd imagine anyone who watches anime would be able to recognize. Basically when someone says something stupid someone always needs to give a retort, or 突っ込み. It's just how jokes are structured in Japan a lot of the time, just like we are used to structuring things in terms of a punchline.
>>
>>101830784
Well, it might actually be her bragging about being accomplished at a young age, like "Already at this age I'm like an adult" which makes more sense with the first line.

Then the other guy's last comment is just like "Still a child huh"
>>
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How old is Yotsuba? Is she just retarded or something?
>>
Does plurality exist in Japanese? Can you use "りんご” to refer to multiple apples as well as one?
>>
>>101832300
>Does plurality exist in Japanese?
yes
>Can you use "りんご” to refer to multiple apples as well as one?
yes
>>
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>せっきょく‐てき〔セキキヨク‐〕【積極的】
>[形動]物事を進んでするさま。「―に仕事に取り組む」

>すすんで【進んで】
>[副]自分から積極的に。「エコ活動に―取り組む」
>>
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Does anyone know where to get Japanese subs for airing shows?
>>
>>101832717
(⊃ * ⊂)゚∀゚)
>>
>>101832829
死んでくれないか?
>>
>>101833178
(´∀`(⊃ ω ⊂)
>>
Should I be ignoring stuff I don't understand when reading? usually when i pick a game or vn or something i want to play I wonder if I should be trying to understand every single line or just beat the game.

What do you guys do?
>>
>>101832717
http://kitsunekko.net/subtitles/japanese/
>>
Oh man this takes so damn long
>>
>>101833859
>Still no Gosick
Why cant I get Japanese subtitles for this show?
>>
>>101834055
糞アニメを見るのをやめたら?
>>
>>101835076
FUCK YOU
>>
>>101832253
5 or 6. I'm not sure which one they decided on.
>>
Where's the best place to get high quality raw manga? specifically Mayo chiki, I found one download but the pages got gradually worst, like each page would be smaller than the last.
>>
>>101834014
You don't plan to post this on every thread do you?
>>
>>101834014
>724 in 134
What the fuck are you doing, just clicking "next"?
>>
>>101834014
Maybe instead of complaining you should study smarter.
>>
>>101833801
I like to go fuck yourself.

Get outta here.
>>
When are ・ used in Japanese written language? I've been using them as a space for foreign names such as
マウント・ドゥーム (Mount Doom from LoTR)

Is this the correct way to use them? What esle can they be used for beside the ・・・ which means a pause in dialogue.
>>
>>101836437
yea you got it
>>
>>101836308
Wow what the fuck is your problem I'm just asking what you guys would do in this situation? I thought this thread was about learning Japanese.
>>
>>101836604
You thought wrong.
>>
>>101836486
Ok good. It seems like I was the only one using it like that, from when I talk to native Japanese people or read Japanese text. The words are usually combined without the ・ separator. Thanks.
>>
>>101836873
バニッシュメント・ディス・ワールド!
>>
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>>101837114
デス
>>
>>101836679
Then what am I supposed to do?
>>
>>101837194
lurk more
>>
I am still early on in my grammar studies but I am confused on the difference between the different "there is" verbs.

>あります
>です
>ありません
>じゃありません

Maybe I have just been studying this for too long today and am starting to confuse things.
>>
>>101837238
Do you even know what I was asking? I was asking for your human experiences not the guide on how to shitpost.
>>
What's the difference between
"これがら帰るとこ" and "これがら帰るところ"
>>
>>101837542
the first phrase has るとこ while the other has ところ
>>101837443
read the guide shitface
>>
>>101837542
>がら
>>
>>101837542
You probably mean これから
And とこ is just an informal form of ところ
>>
>>101837616
That doesn't help me understand if i should just drop sentences I don't understand
>>
>>101837663
>>101837709
Sorry. That was a typo. Thanks.
>>
>>101833801
Trying to understand everything will just frustrate you.
Try to understand what you feel is important, by using ITH+JParser you will end up learning words that are used often after a while.
>>
>>101832628
Endless loop: The dictionary
>>
I am comparing climates of other countries to Japan and want to create a sentence saying "Compared to Japan, thats not bad at all".

Would this work?
その国は日本に比べと、全然悪くない。

I've never used に比べ before and it seems like it isn't used much when comparing things.
>>
>>101833801
It's up to you. Personally I don't try to learn from games, but I'm not that interested in them either.

>>101838242
より?
>>
Am I the only beginner reading Yotsuba& that sometimes breezes through chapters and at other times gets real because of the vocab or grammar?
>>
>>101838524
>より?
Does that really work for the type of sentence I want to create? I was under the impression that より roughly translated to "than". Like
>Japan is smaller than America.
>I can eat more than you.

If so, it wouldn't work for the sentence I want to create. I think anyway.
>>
>>101835108
Ah, fuck you, leather man. Maybe you and I should settle it right here in the ring if you think you're that tough.
>>
So /djt/.

There is a bug in Bravely Default where an ability doesn't stack even though it is stated it is supposed to. I was going to tweet them and ask about bug fixes, but there only seems to be a Nip twitter. I wrote up a short message asking about it, but my grammar is horrible, and I know I sound like an idiot. In the end I know they probably won't say anything, but it's worth a shot.

What I came up with:
>商人のアビリティ「入手金額アップ」はパーティ内に重複じゃない。バグフィックスはいつか?北アメリカのヴァージョンです。
The ability in question is called More Money (入手金額アップ) and the class is the Merchant (商人).

What I'm trying to say is:
>The Merchant ability "More Money" does not stack within the party. Bugfixes soon? It is the North American version.

Any suggestions? I know that first line is super fucked up, but I'm not sure what needs to be changed.
>>
dostedt
>>
>>101838981
ブレイブリーデフォルト フライングフェアリの中には、商人の「入手金額アップ」の能力が壊れている。近いうちにバグフィックスがありますか。この問題はアメリカのバージョンの問題です。
>In the game Bravely Default: Flying fairy, the merchant ability "More Money" is broken. Will there be a bugfix soon? This problem is a problem with the American version.

I'm not sure what you mean by
>does not stack within the party
could you try to describe it in a different way?
>>
>>101839647
So you have four party members, and there are a bunch of different jobs you can choose from. One of the jobs, the Merchant, has an ability called More Money.

>Earn 1.5 times more money than normal after a battle. Note that this effect does not stack with similar items, BUT the bonus from multiple characters using this ability does stack.

So the idea is that you change everybody into a Merchant and get a shit ton of money after a battle, but that doesn't end up working so well because it doesn't stack. You just get the benefit from one even though the game says you should get it from all four.
>>
>>101838981
>>101839881
任豚ざまぁ
>>
>>101839881
ブレイブリーデフォルト フライングフェアリの中には、商人の「入手金額アップ」の能力が壊れている。全部党員は商人けれども、一戦後、1党員のベネフィットを得てばかりです。「入手金額アップ」の能力が積まないです。近いうちにバグフィックスがありますか。この問題はアメリカのバージョンの問題です。ありがとうございます。

>In the game Bravely Default: Flying Fairy, the merchant ability "More Money" is broken. Even though all my party members are merchants, after the battle is over, I only get the benefits of 1. The "More Money" ability does not stack. Will there be a bug fix in the near future? This problem is a problem with the American version. Thank you.

I'm not sure they will do anything about it since this is the American version though.
>>
>>101840707
Thank a bunch. I would imagine it is a problem in the Japanese version too, because it seems to have the same description when you set the text to Japanese.

But yeah, I don't think much was ever changed because of a tweet.
>>
>党員
please.
>>101840947
I recommend asking on Lang8 or somewhere else where people actually know japanese.
>>
>>101840947
Actually, looking at that picture you're wrong. It specifically says that it doesn't stack from multiple characters in the japanese text.
>>
>>101840707
I might just be tired or stupid but doesn't it say it does not duplicate with several characters?
>>
>>101840947
Looks like the translation team fucked up they took 重複 as redundant, not duplicate.
>>
>>101841245
>>101841293
So the whole thing is just translated incorrectly? Does it also say it DOES stack with similar items? Because that's how it works in the game.

Welp.
>>
>>101841357
That's a pretty stupid mistake considering the grammatical structure of セットしても, but I guess that's what they must have done.
>>
>食べられる - able to eat

What is the grammar behind it?
>>
>>101841364
I haven't played the game so I don't know how it works but it's worded as any equipable with it stacks on that one character,
>>
>>101841502
Read the guide.
>>
>>101841522
I would, but I don't know what section it would be in which is why I will ask.
>>
>>101841541
Read all of it.
>>
>>101841502
potential
>>
>>101841564
I will read all of it, but I wanted to know the answer for this first and I am not there yet.

>>101841602
Thanks.
>>
>>101841364
That translation makes no sense in addition to being plain wrong. I mean seriously, what RPG can you name where the effects from different items don't stack but the effects of the same ability from multiple characters do? Whoever translated this did a half-assed job.
>>
>>101841753
>items don't stack with ability
A lot of games actually. World of Warcraft and Terra are the biggest ones that come to mind.

For instance, you can't have a priest cast PwF and then use Runescroll of Fortitude, thinking its going to stack. You'd become OP (over-powered) in some respects.
>>
>>101842262
Yeah but that's an item and a skill, I'm talking about different items worn by the same character.
>>
>>101842330
'More Money' is a Merchant's skill/ability whose effect doesn't stack with items that have a similar effect.

PwF is a priest's skill/ability whose effect doesn't stack with Runescroll of Fortitude.


Its the same thing.
>>
Have you done your reps?
>>
>>101843983
Yes.
>>
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>>101843983
はい
>>
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>>101843983
Yup.
>>
>>101844300
I guess that's one way to do it.
>>
>>101844371
Discovered anki about 600-1000 cards in. Didn't want to take the time to add/find all the cards to make an anki deck. Its nice not staring at a computer screen for a long time though.
>>
>>101843983
Yes
>>101844048
What's up with your graph stopping at 10w?
>>101844300
I remember when I had those, I'd review them anywhere every time
>>
>>101844577
>What's up with your graph stopping at 10w?
Because I haven't studied in months. I cannot learn Japanese.
>>
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>>101844300
>>
>>101843983
Been about a month and a half since I stopped doing anki. My general level is still the same.
>>
>>101844300
Do you also use an abacus instead of a calculator and corded cups instead of a phone?
>>
>>101844655
>Not using |+ゐ
>>
>>101844597
日本語を習う。
>>
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>>101834014
>>
>>101844655
I don't understand. Did I do something wrong?

>>101844701
In my math classes, we are forbid from using a calculator.
>>
>>101845380
I wish the android version was as handy. I use it explicitly because doing reps in bed is just so much more comfy
>>
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>>101845492
>>
>>101845900
So what did you learn about streaming anime?
>>
>>101845995
I'm not ready for such advanced technology.
I'll just stick to watching Korra on nickelodeon.
>>
>>101838242
You don't use と with 比べ、「日本に比べ」or「日本に比べて」. I don't know what you've said before, but 「その国は」is most likely redundant. You've already established that the topic you're speaking about is another country, so you usually leave it out.

Furthermore, 日本と比べ全然悪くない would imply that 日本は悪い, which is probably not what you want to say. If you're comparing a certain aspect of the climate, you should simply use that. 「日本と比べて雨が多い」、「日本と比べてちょっと暑い」If you really want to say good/bad, then that is your subjective opinion, and you should mark that with a 「と思う/と思います」at the end, because otherwise you're basically presenting your opinion as an objective truth.
>>
>>101846327
you're my type of kid
>>
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>internet goes out
>This is the day I will start learning Japanese
>internet is back on when i come back from getting a pen and paper
>>
>>101848067
I don't understand this post. Why would you need a pen and paper to learn Japanese?
>>
>>101848125
Not that guy, but I use pen and paper in learning anything. It just helps reinforces it better for me if I write it and sound it out at the same time.
>>
>>101848181
I freak out when I see screenshots of people finishing 500 cards in like an hour and then I realise I'm so slow because I use pen and paper alongside anki
>>
Just a reminder from /jp/. You are all plebs if you aren't n1 level after a year.
>>
>>101848334
bad imouto stop lying to everyone.
>>
>>101848334
That's hilarious because /jp/ is shit at Japanese compared to the DJT and because you apparently think reaching n1 is some kind of accomplishment.
>>
I need your guys' help.

A while back I watched a hilarious comedy sketch about a bunch of people at a train station. Someone leaves their bag on the chair, goes to the bathroom, and the bag's gone when they come back. Cue argument from everyone, and each person speaks a different Japanese dialect.

I've been looking for it for an hour and can't find it. Can someone help me?
>>
I'm an intermediate level Japanese speaker living in Japan right now. Right now my Japanese study consists basically of reading manga and adding sentences from them into Anki. I'm basically transcribing 75% of volume one of Azumanga Daioh now into Anki.

I'm thinking of supplementing that with sentences from the Dictionary of Basic/Intermediate Japanese Grammar. Is this a good path? I've basically said "no way" to studying individual kanji and am concentrating soley on vocabulary and grammar, hopefully picking up kanji through that.

Will this work or is it a fool's errand?
>>
>>101850042
How much Japanese did you learn before living there?
>>
For those who use Tae Kim:

do you make an Anki deck for all the vocab as it goes along, or do you ignore the vocab and just concentrate on other kanji first? I'm doing Kanjidamage separately so I know how to write them all and have a reading or two to go along with them, but how do I go vocab alongside this?
>>
>>101850187

Theoretically up to JLPT Level 3. I'm in between Level 3 and 2 right now. However, there is a WORLD of difference between my listening and speaking skills.

Listening is no problem. As long it's something like a comedy or a drama, I can understand the storyline fairly well. Crime dramas or medical dramas, not so much though.

Speaking, though, is atrocious. I wind up mixing up grammar and what not, like ので and から.
>>
>>101850283

The vocab in TK's guide is almost all stuff I've already seen in Core2k or KD. Just occasionally do I see a word I haven't seen yet and add it.
>>
>>101850042
I wouldn't avoid studying kanji. At the very least learn the ones that you see several times, or keep a minimum daily quota, even if it's only a handful of them. There are dozens of words that I can recognize and understand if I see them, but since I don't actually know the kanji individually I'm not able to construct those words from memory. I guess it really depends on what your end goals are. Do you want to be able to write, or just read? And at what level do you want to be able to read?
>>
>>101850409
Okay, thanks. I'm new to this, so could I please ask you what exactly Core2k is? I'm assuming an Anki deck?

My current plan is doing 20 kanji a day from KD, reviews in evening, and a page or two of Tae Kim for grammar. As you can see, I have nothing for vocab. Should I get that Core2k deck, or make my own as I go along? Just a bit worried about drowning in reviews, really. It's happened before.
>>
>>101850545

Do 20 words of vocab and 10 kanji instead.
>>
>>101850587
Kanji I remember pretty well, so I'm happy with 20, really. How would you suggest I do the vocab, through a Core2k deck?
>>
>>101850283
As I read Tae Kim I was already trying to read stuff and mine them for vocabulary. I treated Tae Kim just as anything else I'd read, that is, I wouldn't add every single word to my anki deck, but I would still try to pick up words I thought would be a nice addition to my deck.
>>
>>101850517

Would you say learning the kanji helps you better recall it during speaking? Or only during writing?

In all honesty, I could go without learning how to write by hand, if I could read, speak, and listen just fine.
>>
>>101850698
Did you take separate words or whole sentences?
>>
>>101850833
I've always taken separate words, but I leave a field in my card template for example sentences or supplementary comments to be used when the dictionary definition is too vague or confusing. I often write down the sentence I mined the word from in that field.
>>
How do I add Onyomi to "Heisig's Remembering the Kanji 1+3 with 2010 joyo kanji" deck?
>>
>>101851586

Download a deck that already has them instead of manually editing thousands of cards.
>>
>>101851693
There are none with the exact same number of cards.
You can just add a field too all the cards but I'm not sure how.
>>
>>101851812

You can add a field to every card at once but you have to manually enter the CONTENT of that field for every card.
>>
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>>101851907
Well, shit.
I was really hoping I could somehow add it like pic related.

Which deck has kanji in the front and english meaning + onyomi on the back?

Tried a bunch of them but non had that combination.
>>
I made it halfway through RTK before getting bogged down, as my recall rates dropped to 70% and kanji that would disappear into Anki after I "learned" them would show up for the first time in two weeks and I'd forget it. I was using the stories on koohi, was I just not imagining hard enough or something?

How do you solve this "disappears into Anki two weeks, forget it when it pops up again for the first time in a long time" problem?
>>
>>101851988

If you don't like the layout of a card, you can easily change it just by flipping the card or exchanging a few of the fields with each other.
Get one with the content you want and then edit the layout, it will change all the cards at once.
>>
>>101852060
So press "Hard" in Anki instead of "Good" or whatever.
>>
>>101836001
No.
>>101836064
What should I do then?

>>101845380
I don't get what this is trying to say.
>>
How realistic of it would it be for me to learn Japanese solely through absorption? I'm talking studying basics up to JLPT 3 or whatever, then just learning the rest through putting in sentences/words from manga, games, anime, dramas, etc. in Anki.

I ask because I'm finding the textbook approach really boring. I had more fun translating a VN slowly but surely than I had going through Genki II.
>>
>>101852317
>How realistic of it would it be for me to learn Japanese solely through absorption?

You can't. Yes, we all find textbooks fucking boring. Suck it up and learn properly or give up. Watching 500 anime series and becoming proficient in Japanese is a myth.
>>
>>101852317
Its thoroughly impossible.

If it was another language that didn't use a writing system that was as diverse as Japanese then I would say maybe.
>>
>>101852430
>>101852500

What about muh AJATT?
>>
Does Tae kim cover all the same topics as Genki? Does Genki just have more exercises and examples?
>>
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Is there anything wrong with learning jouyou kanji in a random order?

I found a really nice deck ([guicek]) which has a good card layout but the kanji aren't ordered by anything.
>>
>>101852840
No, there's nothing wrong. Learning in radical order can make it easier, but if you're having no problem this way I don't see why you should bother.

You should still take some care to learn the significance of radicals though, cause they really help organizing the Kanji in your head, e.g. the 月 is used as a simplification of 肉, so a lot of Kanji with 月 in them signify things related to the body such as organs and parts of the body: 股, 胃, 腕, 肩, 腹, 肋, 肝...
>>
So the guide tells you to study kanji, vocab and grammar concurrently.

Kanji I'm doing with Kanjidamage.
Grammar I'm reading through with Tae Kim.

What do I do for vocab? Please, any help you can offer is helpful.
>>
>>101852303
I think they're saying if you combined them all into one deck it would be easier to manage your due and new card limits, so you're not doing 20 new cards each for every single deck every day. You can still just edit the global settings and lower the card per day count for all decks if you're in over your head.
I don't know how those decks are organized, but I imagine you're only supposed to start the next 'step' after you've finished the ones before it. I use my own decks though, so I can't say for sure.
>>
>>101853208
seconding because I have no clue what anki deck to pick
>>
>>101852430
Different person, but wait, how far do you go with textbooks? I went through I what I assume would be the equivalent of Genki II, but I've just been reading stuff and grinding kanji/vocab since then.
>>
>>101853088
alright, thanks.
>>
>>101853479
>>101853208
My personal favorite:
https://ankiweb.net/shared/info/702754122

But you can really just pick any of them that looks good to you.
>>
>>101853594
Thanks man, I'll give this one a go.

Actually, has anyone considered making a part of the guide where there's a comparison of the more commonly used Anki vocab decks and what are the best, etc?
>>
>>101853208
Anyone got any other recommendations, while we're at it?
>>
don't die
>>
>>101846442
Ah, my mistake. I have a typo, it is supposed to be
>比べると
making it a conditional. If you compare (those temperatures i stated in the previous sentence) to Japan, thats not bad at all.
I realize this sounds a bit objective, but I am expecting the reader to agree with me on this. Since the coldest temperature in New Zealand is 10 degrees Celsius, which is laughable to what Japan gets.

So would
日本に比べると、悪くないと思います。
work?
>>
I have some questions:
Is it better to build my vocabulary and learn the kanji required to make the words OR should I learn the kanji first and then build my vocabulary by learning the worlds that the particular kanji is used to write? (tl;dr: kanji first or vocab first?)

Is there any point in downloading one of the pre-made anki decks? I'm just creating my own at the moment with the words I've encountered.
>>
>>101857179
That's up to you.
I prefer to learn the kanji first so I won't be overwhelmed by it when studying vocab, but for some reason a lot of people here think it's a retarded thing to do.
It works for me, but I guess different ways work for different people.
>>
>>101857523
But a lot of kanji have multiple readings, doesn't that muddle your mind?
>>
>>101857616
You don't have to memorize all the readings, those come naturally when you start learning vocab.
>>
>>101857616
You don't need to learn all of the readings at once. Actually, you don't really need to learn any of them if you don't want to. Learning the reading is the easy part and it comes automatically with learning vocab.
>>
>>101857616
I usually learn words using at least one one of each of the most common readings so I have an example I can use whenever I think of the kanji. Conversely, it's very hard for me to remember a reading if I don't know a word using it.
>>
10 kanji a day, is it possible?
>>
>>101857843

10 kanji a day is actually going very slow, anon.
I'm doing 20 and I get really impatient from time to time, so I end up doing an extra 20 if I'm not tired.
>>
>>101857843
Even I find 10 be to be a tad fast while learning vocabulary and grammar.

For my kanji I look up the stroke order, origins, radicals, and individual pieces of each kanji and try to build a story out of it. And then I practice writing it down in sentences from a textbook many times until it starts to become muscle memory.

I can't even begin to imagine doing more than 10 kanji a day and still being able to not only recall, but write it a week later.
>>
>>101857957
Stats don't matter, you won't retain them at that rate and in the long run your kani/day ratio approaches zero anyway.
>>
南駄素れ!
子野低度野安合すら嫁内和毛?
>>
>>101858168
Are you making anki flashcards for your kanji?
>>
>>101857957
Just curious, how much time do you study every day? By the time I've looked up 10 kanji with a sample of their corresponding vocabulary and taken the time to write out and memorize each one a few hours have probably passed by.
I work a shitty manual labor job, so that's about all the time I can give to studying before passing out each day. I'm also too dumb to be able to retain much more than that.
>>
>>101858243
I have not yet. I am actually going to start doing that today to help with retention even more.
>>
>>101858190

I have no idea what you are talking about.
I'm not really doing it for any stats, I just didn't want to spend an entire year of studying and only know the 常用 list.
I started on january 1st and only got to a thousand today, but I haven't forgotten a single one of them.
>>
>>101858303
That depends.
I don't keep a fix schedule, I use RTK along with a list that fixes the wrong meanings. Learning the 20 of the day takes me about an hour, and if I get lazy, I could spend 2 hours with anki while doing the reviews.
Vocab isn't my priority right now, so I don't keep a vocab deck, I just play games and keep jisho at hand to learn the words.
>>
>>101858216
>なんだそれ
>このていどのあんごうすらよめないわけ?

>leaving すら in kana
>>
>>101859079
絵来絵来
>>
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tae kims guide gives a kun-yomi reading for a certain kanji but when I check jisho.org it's not on the list of kun readings. PANIC. Help?
>>
>>101859197
Most common words are usually the exception to the kanji reading rules.
>>
>>101859156
いいから日本語スレに中国語書くの止めてくれない?
>>
>>101859244
Oh it's an on-yomi reading that is used for a single kanji word, makes sense now. Thanks.
>>
ああ双葉を閲覧し始めたは大間違いだった
昔は「日本語を勉強したら大数の翻訳されてないVNやアニメなどを見る・読むぜ!」とか思った
でも双葉に入るとまもなく双葉しか読まないようになってしまった
まったく4chanと同じ罠に落ちた
>>
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I thought you couldn't use だ after i-adj
>>
古典をわかるためには「読みまくる」ことが重要です。同じ文章を何度も何度も読む。古典とはいっても同じ 日本語ですから現代文の読解力がついている人であれば古典の文章を読みなれることでなんとなく意味がわかって きます。もちろん古典特有の言葉や、現代と異なる意味の言葉などを覚えることも重要ですが、あまり細かいこと にこだわりすぎると全体がみえなくなったりつまらなくなってしまったりします。
>>
>>101861347
えーっと
あ、ありがとう?参考になりそう
>>
Hello DJP

What is this 特別な気分 that is all over Pixiv at the moment?

http://www.pixiv.net/search.php?s_mode=s_tag_full&word=%E7%89%B9%E5%88%A5%E3%81%AA%E6%B0%97%E5%88%86
>>
>>101862168
I'm guessing it's parodies of that image of a couple getting interviewed that got posted somewhere and generated a lot of OC.
>>
Is 焼き just a catch-all term for baked, fried and grilled foodstuff or is there a distinction?
>>
>>101862447
It is a catch all term. Japanese don't have half as many cooking related verbs as English does.
>>
>>101862297
What was the original image and what was so embarrassing/funny about it?
>>
>>101862676
Why are you asking this here. Go to the archive or something if you're so interested. This has nothing to do with DJT.
>>
is it 毒舌者 or 毒舌を持つ者?
>>
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Any recommendations for Japanese learning mobile apps? So far I have on my phone:
Ankidroid
OCR Manga Reader
Jade Reader
Aedict Japanese Dictionary

Also, what does DJT feel about adding a mobile apps section to the guide?
>>
I know 500+ kanji and its onyomi but not kunyomi.
How fucked am I?
>>
>>101863580
I use Obenkyo and adobe for textbooks.
Kanji recognizer a shit, it never understands my input.
For kanji searching I use wwjdic and search by radicals.
Also this:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.appforall.jisho&hl=en
It's jisho.

Obenkyo has got to be the single best japanese learning app in the play store though.
>>
>>101863654
You're not really fucked. You'll end up learning their kunyomi when studying vocab anyway, since they're verbs. I only learned onyomi when studying kanji.
>>
>>101863099
What do you want to say exactly?
>>
>>101860686
It's a kid speaking, dude.
>>
>>101863099
>is it 毒舌者 or 毒舌を持つ者?
it's 毒舌な人
>>
>>101864240
毒舌の人 works fine.
>>
>>101863580
On that topic: Opinions on anki aniki?
>>
Should I be practicing the hiragana on squared paper? I checked the guide and it doesn't touch on the matter.
>>
>>101864376
it doesn't matter. Why would it?
>>
>>101857843
I find 10 to be the perfect number for me, and that's recall/recognition, both pronunciations, a couple vocab words, and practicing writing them out neatly. I find I forget a couple details here and there, but it really doesn't matter considering I'm able to permanently pick them up over time by repeatedly pressing "hard" in Anki.
>>
>>101864376
I only write kanji on squared paper because I have a better idea of proportions when using it.
>>
>>101864429
>>101864515
Thats what I thought about the proportions, I struggle with my hand eye co-ordination so getting the kanji right is difficult...
>>
would 遠慮があったので___ be correct for '___ because i had reservations about posting' or would i use 遠慮して___
>>
>>101864876
No
>>
フラヌヲス
>>
>>101863654
Congratulations, you know Chinese. Let us know if you want to start learning Japanese.
>>
>>101864150
No it isn't. That's the dad.
>>
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>>101864150
>>101865384
Here's the full page.
>>
>>101864343
It's amazing. Reps go by pretty fast while commuting and I've stopped using the desktop version completely. I've got 2000+ kanji and 5000+ words so far with just 5 months of study.
>>
>>101865631
>>101864343
isn't it just an inferior version of anki?
>>
>>101865816
It is, but it's the best android has.
>>
>>101865631
Holy hell, are you going at a pace of 20/day? How do you even manage? Got some kind of trick?
>>
>>101865853
Elaborate.
Anki for android is perfectly fine. Syncing with desktop makes it amazing.
>>
>>101865535

I understand what they are talking about but I can't decipher Yotsuba's grammar.

Should I just press on reading that way and give up on trying to understand every little detail immediately?
>>
>>101865631
Why can't I be smart like you can remember something? I can't do more than 3 or 4 kanji and a little vocabulary a day and I don't remember anything but the meaning for those kanji anyway.
>>
>>101866503
Mnemonics are your friends, anon.
Make up some story using the radicals and you'll have no trouble remembering any kanji.
>>
>>101865816
It's a small tradeoff for being able to have flashcards on the go and not having to sit in front of the computer doing the same thing over and over again.

>>101865854
I do 50/day, except for the first 40 days where I did 100/day, 50 for kanji and 50 for vocab. I stopped adding cards regurlarly for about a month and a half. I'd guess the trick to it is that if you do a large amount of new cards per day, you get used to the pace and it becomes a maneagable routine, and commuting makes the large amount of reps that come afterwards go by pretty fast.
>>
>>101866732
>It's a small tradeoff for being able to have flashcards on the go
See >>101865944
>>
>>101865854
>>101866503

If you guys don't have an obvious lengthy timeslot like that anon does (commuting) within which to do your reps, then don't worry too much about not doing as much as him. Believe me, when you're completely reliant on your self-discipline to get reps done then there's no way you'll be doing that many reviews on a daily basis.

If you feel like you can push yourselves further then definitely do so, but take it slow.
>>
>>101866732
>I do 50/day, except for the first 40 days where I did 100/day, 50 for kanji and 50 for vocab
Enjoy your shit retention.
>>
>>101867130
>implying 50 is a lot
>>
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われわれは うちうじんだ じんるい の 時間 おわります。 さあ... ぜんぶを ころしています!

きしゃああああああああ!
>>
So I want to make a Japanese sentence out of
>Especially during Summer; where the days are long and hot.

Any idea on the japanese equivalent of a semi-colon is?

特に夏中;日が長いや熱いです。
Thats all i got. I was thinking maybe using a relative clause, but I'm not sure.
>>
ねw

パン作ったことある?
>>
>>101867492
>trying to learn 50 a day
>on top of remembering the 50 you learned yesterday
>and a few days ago
>and X number of reps from other days
>>
>>101867590
(性的な意味で)
>>
>>101867518
もっと漢字を使ってください。目が痛いです。全部、あんたのせいですよ。
>>
>>101867547
Learn how to use a semicolon in English first.

Semicolons aren't used in Japanese anyway.
>>
>>101867660
>Trying to learn 1 a day
>on top of remembering the 1 you learned yesterday
>and a few days ago
>and X number of reps form other days

You'll be completely overwhelmed if you do more than zero reps a day
>>
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>>101853594

This guy mentioned the deck I'm talking about, hoping someone can explain to me how to use these core whateverk decks. Do I just use the top one?

Also, as I'm seeing all this vocab for the first time, do I just write it out as I see it, and review it again the next day? And can someone recommend me what a good number of vocab a day is?

Sorry to bombard, but I'm just so confused by Anki and all these decks and I want to do good at this.
>>
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>>101867547
Holy shit, that's not how you use a semicolon.
>>
>>101867796
Clearly you can't argue without throwing things out of proportion. Learning 1 thing a day and remembering X number of 1 reps is completely different than 50.
>>
>>101867872
There's no substantive difference in the arguments without reference.

For me and most people without mental handicaps even 100 a day isn't that big a deal once you get into a groove. Try actually doing shit instead of worrying about why you cant.
>>
How does one understand dictionary.goo definitions?
For example:
びん‐ぼう〔‐ボフ〕【貧乏】
[名・形動](スル)財産や収入が少なくて生活が苦しいこと。また、そのさま。「―な人」「職がなく―する」「器用―」
What does the 名 part and (スル) part mean? also what does the 「―な人」「職がなく―する」「器用―」 part mean? 貧乏な人?
>>
>>101867806
If you just use the top one you'll be fine, they all pretty much correspond to each other (though the last two are more specific subsets).

Make sure you've thoroughly read the anki page on that deck, though, as it gives crucial information about stuff like loading images and forcing the cards to be in the correct order.
>>
>>101868033
>autism isn't a mental handicap
>>
>>101867590
wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
>>
>>101868123
Good then you have no excuses, get cracking!
>>
>>101868156
wwwwww
>>
>>101867547
1. don't capitalize seasons
2. semicolons separate independent clauses
3. use "when" with temporal nouns
4. it's semicolon not semi-colon
5. japanese don't have semicolons; they would just use a stop or comma (and it would work because semicolons separate independent clauses)
6. do you see what I did there
>>
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>>101867130
I've got a pretty good retention, anon.
>>
>>101868155
>not wwwwwwwwwwwww
disgusting
>>
>>101866289
Yotsuba speaks like a child. So her grammar is at times incorrect.
>>
アニメと結婚したい
>>
How do you deal with cards that anki classifies as "leeches"? Do you turn them off or add them back in at some point?
I didn't even know what a leech was, but I'm getting quite a bit now.
>>
>>101868228
>>101866732
Are you just doing the heisig method, like "this kanji" means "tree". Or are you actually learning the kun and on and writing?
>>
>>101868228
Try having to input things rather than just hit a button.
>>
>>101868270

vv vv vv vv vv vv
>>
is the ても in 憶えていられても困ります the same as the ても in 白身の魚なら食べてもいい?
>>
>>101869206
私も
>>
>>101871097
Yes, it is the same etymologically. I would not translate it the same, however, because it is not "even" (=an extreme condition) in both.
>>
>>101868055
名 refers to its noun status, (スル) refers to the capability of it becoming a verb using する. The dashes indicate the placement of the word in an example sentence (no idea why they don't actually put the word, but all jap dictionaries do this)
>>
>>101865535
I know this is a late response, but he's treating the verb as a noun (referring to the word itself). She's using the wrong word, and he's suggesting a more appropriate term (and using the copula while doing it). In this type of usage you will often see the word itself surrounded by brackets, but they didn't do that here.
>>
>>101872579
So is it even if you don't remember it's still a problem or if you remember it's a problem?
>>
>>101872931
Well, the exact translation will depend on context, but it's definitely not the former. This usage of ても is actually similar to ては.
>>
朝食は超食だね
>>
Dear diary,
I learned how to write 楽しい today. I am ureshii but I don't know how to write that.

Stupid diaries aside, I'm going through Tae Kim's android app, the exercises are nice but I never know when to use が instead of は. I only get it right because sometimes it just sounds right, and that's because of the years spent watching anime.
>>
俺の日記、其の2

今日は微分学の講義をサボった。やっぱそういう教科は俺には難しすぎる。
俺が日本人だとしたらきっと勉強がうまくなるだろう。結局大和魂を呼び出して勉強を励むしかない。
>>
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Why is there so many different ways to say "beach". For what purpose? Do they really expect me to memorize every single one of those?
>>
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>>101878228
>>
>>101878228
>Do they really expect me to memorize every single one of those?
Yes.
>>
>>101878228
If I remember correctly, Japan is an island
>>
>>101878287
>>101878337
>>101878477
So which one should I pick? Are they all interchangeable? That would be stupid.
>>
>>101878604
Why are you "picking" a word? If you were ready to pick them for anything, you'd understand any nuance that comes along with them.
>>
>>101878228

>Do they really expect me to memorize every single one of those?

Who's "they"? Is this specifically requirement for a test?
>>
>>101878604
びっち is the most common.
>>
>>101878604
Just from seeing that page you can see some differences between the words. You've got a beach, a coast, a seashore, a rocky beach, a sandy beach, 等

>>101878741
Though this one is the most common if you're talking about a normal beach.
>>
>>101878729
"They" being the average Japanese person that I may converse with. My goal is to be able to speak as well as an average Japanese person.

>>101878741
Thanks.

>>101878788
>sandy beach
Never understood that. Why create a word specifically for "sandy beach" when you can combine an adjective "sandy" and noun "beach" to mean the exact same thing? For multiple descriptions of a beach no less.
>>
>>101879039
>びっち is the most common.
クックッ
>>
>>101879039

>"They" being the average Japanese person that I may converse with. My goal is to be able to speak as well as an average Japanese person.

I ask because (and I'm sure I'm not the only one) suspect this is part of a generally inefficient approach you're taking to learning the language. If you're giving yourself a list of English words to learn the Japanese translations for, you're making it much more difficult for yourself, and the problem you mentioned here is a perfect example of that. Memorising vocab lists of out of context words is a very problematic approach. Dictionaries may give you a defintion and a couple of example sentences, but you can't learn to actually use the words by reading dictionaries. You'd be far better off constructing vocab lists by reading primary Japanese sources and noting down words and expressions you're unfamiliar with. This not only gives a fully natural appropriate context for learning each new word, it also makes you prioritize more common vocabulary automatically. I say this from my own experience (with French and Mandarin), and I'm sure many people here will agree.
>>
>>101879501
I agree with you on that. Right now, I am focusing on learning grammar, kanji, and a few vocab along the way. In this particular case, I was trying to create a sentence for a Japanese person I am speaking with for practice. I tried to create this sentence
>Florida's beaches often have sharp broken shells all over. My feet get cut every time I go.
I just looked up the word beach, because I wasn't sure if 海 would have sufficed.
>>
I can't be the only one that finishes all their reps but still feels like they are forgetting something.
>>
>>101878741
Is this bait? I'm cautious because of ビッチ
>>
>>101881197
It's not the same as bitch if that's what you're asking.
>>
>>101881197
beach = ビーチ
bitch = びっち
>>
>>101881348
Anon this is making things worse.
>>
>>101881197
ビーチ and ビッチ can be used pretty much interchangeably since they sound so similar. That sounds weird, but it ends up being a matter of context like everything else (a Japanese person wouldn't call a slut a beach).

So ビッチ works.
>>
>>101881197

Google image search びっち, and tell me if those results correspond better to beaches or bitches.
>>
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>>101881348
You got them mixed up.
>>
>>101881452

No he didn't.
>>
Currently I have my anki deck font set pretty big. Will this cause issues recognizing kanji in smaller fonts? Should I be doing my study in a normal sized font?
>>
>>101881641

Learning to write Kanji is also important for fluent reading. I'm sure reading at any legible size will be fine if you know the anji well enough to write them.
>>
>>101881759
I see, I really should be putting more into my writing practice. Thanks for the input anon
>>
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Made something stupid to help with verb conjugation

pick a verb, hit generate, work out how to conjugate it.
>>
Is the ヲ particle ever used at all?
>>
At what point should I move on from learning kana? I've memorized it all, but I can't really read quickly. I have to stop and think about each character. Should I start learning grammar or should I learn how to read fluently first?
>>
>>101883065
Move on.
You'll read faster with practice later.

It's what you'll be using the most after all.
>>
>>101883219
Thanks
>>
>>101882988

Particles are always written in hiragana.
If you mean the ヲ katakana, it's almost never used, but I can think of one example in the title of ソラノヲト, and it's just because it's stylized that way.
>>
>>101881486
I'm never sure when people are serious on the internet anymore.
>>
Ehm, since you guys all seem like an intelligent, hardworking bunch, i kinda wanna ask firsthand, where i should start learning japanese, before now i just watched alot of anime, but i really want to make an effort and learn it. Every suggestions is welcome, Thanks in advance!
>>
>>101884824
My suggestion is read the fucking guide in the OP, it's there for a reason.
>>
>>101884824
Christ, do these retards ever read the OP or the thread? Or do they think they need to be spoon-fed everything?
>>
>>101884824
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/1G5C7fCe07CDzYalZYZObzxv_fhw7RUNsLHiMAY-t7FA/edit

Sorry, i`m a complete newfag, i admit, and sorry , but thanks! because now i understand..
>>
>>101885052
B-b-b-but I'm polite and I'll put in a lot of effort and everything! Every suggestion is welcome you know!

And thanks in advance!
>>
>move to Japan
>have date with beautiful Japanese girl, best looking girl I've ever had a date with
>go out, she speaks zero English
>I understand most of what's she saying no problem
>my Japanese is broken, I'm stumbling over words, using "eeto" a lot
>it clearly hinders conversation, and the date
>tfw lost your chance with a pretty girl

Well, good news is my motivation to study is now through the roof so this type of thing doesn't happen again. It sucked so badly.

Is going out to bars (NOT gaijin bars) and talking to random Japanese people to practice your Japanese usually cool? Or will they just tell you to fuck off?
>>
はらへった☆
でも酷い風邪引いてて動きさえ出来ないから
しんじゃう☆
>>
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as an english speaker with no asian language experience, just how difficult is it to learn to read japanese? the characters are practically heiroglyphics, right?
>>
>>101886062
You can't learn Japanese.

We won't miss you!
>>
>>101885962

If you understood her, but couldn't convey your own thoughts, then yeah, speaking is your problem. Up your reps definitely. Through enough repetition, you should be able to reproduce words and grammar more easily.

The bar idea doesn't sound so hot to me. It's costly and intimidating.
>>
>>101885962
imagine you're in a bar looking to wet your dick and some random foreigner comes up to you and tries to strike a conversation about absolutely nothing in particular in slow cartoon english
also they're ugly
>>
>>101886255
what if you're gay
>>
>>101886339
they're still ugly
>>
>>101885712
> I'll put in a lot of effort and everything
Not reading the OP is a bad sign in that regard.
>>
It feels like DJT has gotten even slower than usual lately, even ignoring that it's not a busy time right now. Is everyone actually doing their reps instead of talking about them?
>>
>>101886350
Don't you go to a bar in order to make girls/guys less ugly looking? Don't tell me you are sipping on milk/water.
>>
>>101887291
Everyone was raptured.
>>
>>101887539
I seriously doubt the kind of people that go here would meet rapture requirements, unless there was some church session I wasn't invited to.
>>
>>101887539
>raptured.
More like ruptured (a vein of the head variety). Theres no way I can finish all this kanji today.
>>
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/a/, 何がしているのか?
>>
>>101888409
今泣いている( ;∀;)
>>
>>101888409
お前のボイプッシー
>>
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>>101888992

何それ?!
>>
2次元でいいや、3次元のメス豚共なんていらねー
っと自分に何度も何度も言い返しても
実は痛いほど寂しい
>>
age
>>
Anyone new who's following Namasensei's videos.
I made a tribute.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-vAkiijG8A
>>
>>101892495

Shit nigga that's kawaii.
>>
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>>101892495
>>
>養殖と違って釣るのは難しいぞ

I can't figure out what's going on in
>養殖と違って
I'm not sure
>>
0-4 study
5-9 cry myself to sleep
>>
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愚かな白豚。
>>
>>101894206
What the hell is the context here? Is someone fishing weirdly?
>>
>>101894206
養殖と違って is like saying "besides cultivated/bred X". Since the verb is 釣る I guess they're talking about fish. So the translation might be something like "It's hard to catch anything outside of fish farms"
>>
>>101894344
i should probably go study now
>>
>>101894511
I see. But what is the function of と in this instance? I haven't seen many instances of it between a noun and te form verb.
>>
>>101894344
Holy shit just add like 2-3 words a day. If you get motivated to do more than it'll be a piece of cake. If you don't, then you'll know you aren't really interested in studying Nipponese after all. Just get past the initial hump of studying.
>>
>>101894629
I can't really think of a good English equivalent, but I've seen it used in other forms such as:
それと比べて (Compared with that...)
だからといって (With that being said...)
>>
>>101894816
>だからといって
So, kind of like how it functions as a quoting particle?
>>
>>101890572
気にすんな
お前みたいなもんにも未来があるんだよ
まあ、2次元の未来なんだけどね
>>
>>101894867
Yeah, it's not a direct quote but it serves as a link to the previous topic.
>>
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>that feelio when you understand your games a little more now

Now I am going to work twice as hard. Watch me, /djt/.
>>
>>101895222
Just don't lose your way, anon
>>
Is there a decent site that goes over Kyushu dialect? I can barely understand half of the shit being said in the anime Ghost Hound. I've managed to get certain phrases like ばってん and じゃなか down, but everything else is pretty difficult since dictionaries don't really cover dialects very well.
>>
>>101894816
だからといって has nothing to do with the "with" と, and I have no idea where you're getting "it's hard to catch anything outside of fish farms". 養殖と違って means "unlike farming/unlike aquaculture". He's saying getting wild fish is an actual challenge, which farming is not..
>>
>>101895615
http://hougen.u-biq.org/
>>
>>101896240
>http://hougen.u-biq.org/
Very helpful, thanks Anon
>>
>>101896125
So the と in 養殖と違って is in fact the "with" と?
>>
>>101896517
http://kotobank.jp/word/%E3%81%A8?dic=daijirin&oid=DJR_to_-210
> 比較の基準を表す。 「考え方が君-違う」 「以前-同じ要領です」
Daijirin has a completely separate entry for "comparative と". I think of it as "with", but that depends on how finely you want to divide up the usages.

Regardless, it's not the same as in だからといって.
>>
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Is the として in this, the same one that's defined as "apart from (used to change the topic)"?
>>
>>101897468
Yes, it's basically saying "we'll treat this as .... (and leave it at that), ..."
>>
I have all of Hiragana and Katakana down, and started with Genki. Since I'm studying this alone, I'm doing all of the exercises in the chapters and the stuff on this page too http://web.lyon.edu/users/mpeek/JapanWebpages/GenkiExercises.htm

At Chapter 3 all the kanji hit me. Before that I hadn't really worked on them much, and now I'm thinking what would be best way about learning/remembering them, hopefully in order they come up in chapters.
If I go with Anki cards, what would be good format for those to be in? Haven't really used the program before.
>>
>>101898149
I love your blog.

But seriously, just make a deck with the keyword or meaning(s) of the kanji on the front of the cards, and the kanji on the back. It's that simple.
>>
>>101898262

Put the kanji on the front and the other information on the back instead if you want to learn how to recognize them.
>>
age
>>
How the fuck do I know the difference between しよ and は when its not perfect computer symbols?
Seems fucked to me
>>
If I just go through the Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar and input every sentence from that into Anki, how will my Japanese be? Is that practical at all?
>>
How do I learn and proper use なんか. It seems to be used all the freaking time in manga and I don't quite get it.
>>
>know 1000+ Kanji
>barely know any vocab
Just how fucked am I?
When I started it sounded smart to me to get the Kanji down first before actually using them in vocab but now I realized that I still can't read shit despite learning for 2 months already.
>>
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>tfw that the Japanese you learned will only help you to read various info on 70's tv shows
>>
What Anki deck do people recommend I use to start vocab?
>>
>>101902583
I'm in this boat

>>101902733
And this one
>>
>>101902583
ya dun goofed.

You shouldn't need to bother with any more kanji, just switch entirely to vocab and anything else you're missing
>>
>>101901959
get glasses

>>101902113
sounds dumb and inefficient

>>101902221
http://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/qa/question_detail/q1211881617
>>
>>101902948
How so? Surely if he were doing Heisig he'd get to 2000 and still not be able to read shit. WHy not just keep going and learn vocab concurrently?
>>
>>101902221
You read more and get used to it just like the rest of the language.
>>
>>101902948
>just switch entirely to vocab
yeah no

>>101902583
you're either exaggerating about not knowing vocab or knowing kanji
>>
>>101902221
You'll mostly understand it in the context.
>>
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>>101903079
Because the jury is still out on if heisig does anything but allow you to write.That and he's trying to learn japanese.
>>
>>101902583
I pretty much dropped RTK at around 800 words for vocab and havent looked back since. To be honest if there ever is a kanji that I start to get trouble on ill then look it up.
>>
I made a post on lang-8, which I had corrected. I'm a bit confused about some of the corrections though. With

僕は出所がそのかなり北方にある所というスウェーデンだ.,

I was trying to say something like ' I'm a guy from a pretty northerly place called Sweden.' It was corrected to 僕の出身はかなり北方にあるスウェーデンと言われているところだ. What confuses is how かなり北方にある is used. It seems wierd to qualify the noun Sweden, as there's only one kind of sweden.

In this correction:

でも, 私は運が良いことに海岸の近くの町に住んでいるから, 普段はあまり寒くならないです,

住んでいる seems to take the に particle twice. Is that allowed? Also, beta.jisho tells me that 普段 is an adjective, but I thought they couldn't be used as the topic of a sentence?
>>
>>101903357
>It seems wierd to qualify the noun Sweden, as there's only one kind of sweden.
There's nothing wrong with classifying something that's already not ambiguous. For example in "Please invite your lovely wife to the party too." there's only one person the speaker could be talking about, yet the lovely doesn't seem out of place. Perhaps you got confused because you thought something like "Northern Sweden" which would indeed mean something else.
>>
>>101903264
I thought that was the point of the separate kanji process from vocab: developing the ability to memorise how to write kanji. Get that out of the way while developing vocab.

Anyway, how did you learn vocab? I'm doing KanjiDamage myself and would genuinely like some help.
>>
>>101902583

Just finish heisig. Don't drop it like a pussy faggot.
>>
>>101903357
>It seems wierd to qualify the noun Sweden, as there's only one kind of sweden.
whatever logic you're using to think this needs to be abolished
it's an adjectival phrase which is perfectly natural to use on any noun

>住んでいる seems to take the に particle twice. Is that allowed?
this is not really how you should think, but even if we say words "take" particles (the hell does that even mean), this is how it would work:

でも 私は 運が 良いことに 海岸の 近くの 町に 住んでいるから

住んでいる doesn't "take" に more than once (or at all). I don't know what about this sentence you think isn't "allowed"

>Also, beta.jisho tells me that 普段 is an adjective, but I thought they couldn't be used as the topic of a sentence?
な-adjectives are very similar to nouns. Many words are both. talk to a linguist to learn why, otherwise just memorize it.
>>
>>101903503
>Perhaps you got confused because you thought something like "Northern Sweden

No, not that. I don't, it just seems like かなり北方にある is part of what the place is called, which obviously isn't what I was trying to say. I would like to attach かなり北方にある to ところ, somehow.
>>
>>101903745
かなり北方の所であるスウェーデン。

Still, I think you're too fixed in trying to get every word of the English (or Swedish) sentence into the Japanese equivalent, which is a pretty pointless thing to do and can be pretty harmful if you want to sound natural.
>>
>>101903643
>I don't know what about this sentence you think isn't "allowed"

I don't know why I thought so either. It just truck me that saying (time)に(place)にがいる is fine.
>>
>>101903863
>が

ignore that
>>
>>101903537
I learn the vocab words as actual words used in a language spoken by people and then rep them in anki until I can recognize the kanji used to represent them in a drunken stupor. I want to learn the language first and foremost and might to do kanjidamage once I actually know enough for the experience to be worthwhile. I can't see the point in writing right now if none of it is actually in Japanese.
>>
>>101903854
>である

is this で+ある or the formal state of being である?
>>
Straight-up vocab question: how do I start?
I have my Heisig. I have Tae Kim. Now I need words to learn.

Where do I start, are there lists? A specialised Anki deck? I beg for help, the shared decks are all very confusing.
>>
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Why dont people just read the guide?
>>
>>101904104
The latter. I don't think your average Japanese person makes much distinction though.
>>
>>101904144
I use coreplus because it's too late to stop this train, but I've heard better things about further optimized core. Either way, you'll be rescheduling vocab because there is no perfect deck.
>>
>>101904144
>Straight-up vocab question: how do I start?
Reading the guide. That's ALWAYS how you start.
>>
>>101904189
Because it's been poorly edited, glosses over major things and is generally a bit useless as anything other than a resource list.
>>
>>101904144
Guide

Start reading as soon as you can since it's actually not boring as fuck compared to Anki.
>>
>>101904144
Don't do Anki, it's just a poor substitute for reading. If you must to ease your mind, build your own from your reading material. Pre-made decks are a bad choice in general.
>>
>>101904269
I did. It told me to find an Anki shared deck.
Now I'm asking you which ones you recommend, because I'm such a beginner sifting through all those decks will be useless to me.
>>
>>101904406
I'd advise making your own, but that's just because it's what I did. I never managed to get too far in a pre-made deck. It's as boring as reading a dictionary.
>>
>>101904366

When reading, do you just look up every other word in the dictionary? Or do you just plow
through and ignore anything you don't know?

I'm living in Japan now, so I'm surrounded by a gold mine of reading.
>>
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Finally finished Tae kim. Time to read extensively and build upon my vocab.
>>
>>101904398
>>101904469

Okay, you guys are contradicting the guide which tells me to find a shared deck. Can I ask what sort of materials you used to get off the ground? What sort of phrases shall I try putting in a custom deck first?
>>
>>101904828
it really doesn't matter either way if you use the optimized core plus or make you're own deck from reading material, you just need to start studying and gain a base amount of vocab.
>>
>>101904828
I'm sorry for contradicting the guide. I didn't know you expected us to have a consensus on everything and give you a foolproof easy path towards knowing Japanese.

You want to know what I did? What I did is I didn't ask for /a/ to tell me every single thing I needed to do and started finding things that I could read and which I found interesting while picking words and phrased which I thought would be useful to have in my reps. There's thousands and thousands of games, manga and LN out there, just find one you like and start stumbling your way through it.

Seriously, I don't mind people asking for help and recommendation, but people who can't lift a finger unless someone has told them what to do really annoy me. Learning a language is 90% being inquisitive and exploring and 10% method.
>>
i don't know what this fixation on learning vocab is

vocab that sticks (i.e. is worth learning) is learned through natural and frequent exposure and/or deducing the meaning from the kanji

anyone who has 自動販売機 on a flashcard is a moron
>>
>>101905020
>自動販売機

Thanks man, I didn't know that one. I'll add it to my deck!
>>
>>101905020
Depends. He might have learned both the terms 自動 and 販売 when seeing that word for the first time and he thought he'd make a single card to recall it all.
>>
>>101904704

Remember to review
>>
Can anyone explain this grammar to me?

[Verb] に [Verb + ず] Like:

食べるに食べず

I know ず means without but can't really think of anything for this setup.
>>
>>101905004
I'm sorry man. I just... I've no clue what I'm fucking doing. That much is obvious, I'm sure, but I'm confused. I want to make a serious stab at this. I've spent ages going about this the wrong way and I'm tired of doing that. I don't need my hand held throughout the entire process but I just appreciate some help getting off the ground.

Thanks for your help. I'm sorry to have frustrated you.
>>
>>101904704
so you can translate every post in this thread into japanese if I gave you the vocab?
>>
>>101905141
http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/negativeverbs2
>>
>>101905246
Obviously I am nowhere near finished with grammar but at least I have a basic understanding to get started with reading.

You really never will be "done" with grammar.
>>
>>101905280
>An old-fashioned way to say a negative verb is to use 「ぬ」 instead of 「ない」.
>Examples
>韓国人と結婚してはならぬ!
いいやつだな、たえきん。日本語だけじゃなくて、日本の文化も教えている
>>
>>101905324
>Obviously I am nowhere near finished with grammar
>Finally finished Tae kim.
these sentences contradict
what did you even learn?

>You really never will be "done" with grammar.
this is pure nonsense
are you not "done" with english grammar?
>>
>>101905497
Not him but hes still got a long way to go since Tae kim does not cover everything when it comes to grammar.
>>
>>101905497
>grammar ends when you finish tae kim
>>
>>101905497
>implying that a country's grammar rules could be finished
Tae Kim's grammar is just the tip of the iceberg.
>>
Guys, I'm lost. Everything I know is a fucking joke.

For the last year I've been trying to do KanjiDamage, on and off. I got to about 1500 (reading along Tae Kim but not really picking up vocab separately). Then I found this (specifically the final notes at the bottom):

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1R47fYgomF4-gjQ1PlHAMzVDmz4brN_t7lnfvQyYvF9g/edit

What the fuck have I done guys? Have I been wasting my time? Has it all been total shit? At this point, shall I keep going? All I've been using KD for is the onyomi + kanji, I've also been looking up stroke orders and such through jisho. Shall I pack it all in, start over with Heisig? I want to do this seriously, I really do. I'm scared.
>>
Reading a bit on NKH Easy News. This, specifically: http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/easy/tsunamikeihou/index.html

ひとりでも多くの人を助けるために

I'm pretty sure that this means "In order to help many people that are left by themselves" (or does it?), but how does ひとりでも function here?

NHKがテレビなどでどのように伝えるかをこのページでお知らせします

Does this tell people that "this page will tell them in what way NKH will transmit news by TV, et.c.?"
>>
>>101906285
You're fucked. Just give up now.
>>
>>101906285

Your mind has been ruined by Kanjidamage. Commit sudoku
>>
>>101906619
Why am I fucked exactly? Sure, I might just restart with Heisig, but before I do, what's your reasoning?
>>
>>101906636
...or start over with Heisig?
>>
>>101906285
There's no more saving you. Either find a way to brainwash everything you learn out of your mind (perhaps a strong blow to the head will do the trick if you don't mind risk and the nasty side-effects), or just give up learning Japanese forever.
>>
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>>101906684
Only you can decide if you can learn Japanese. Also, being underestimated/undervalued is oddly a strange motivator.
>>
>>101906285
I'm sorry but you're going to be monolingual for the rest of your life.
>>
>>101906761
Well, now you're just being mean, man.

But fine, I take it this is your way of saying give up on the KD approach altogether. Fine.
>>
>>101906841
It was actually my way of saying stop being such a drama queen, but that's good advice too. It had been a long time since I'd read that KD intro text you link and by God is it ridiculous and misleading. I feel bad for thinking it wasn't complete bullshit when I first read it too. It probably did a lot of harm to me at the start I guess.
>>
>>101906902
Okay. Well, it suckered me in and now here I am. But my desire to learn the language is genuine. Learn from your mistakes, right?
So... Heisig, I take it?
>>
>>101904704
好きだぞ一子
>>
>>101906985
Suit yourself.
>>
>>101906985
You decide your path
>>
>>101906985
How much of the language can you understand?
>>
>>101905586
It doesn't, but it covers the essentials, which are enough to get through almost everything. Or do you disagree with that too?

>>101905667
I don't believe for a single second someone who evaluates himself at "nowhere near" and "basic understanding" is "finished" with kim.

I picture someone who's just read a book from start to finish, without taking notes or going back once, then clapping it shut and going "done!"

>>101905781
>more hyperbole
You're full of it.
>>
>>101906491

Anyone?
>>
>>101906491
>ひとりで
Alone, with just one person
>も
Even

For the sake of helping many people, even if alone.

A more reasonable wording would require context.
>>
>>101907230
>A more reasonable wording would require context.

The article is in the link I posted. It's very short.
>>
>>101906985
If it took you a year to realize that you're going nowhere then the problem is mostly you. Just check your progress a bit more frequently, concrete metrics help too.

Go aim for these in 2/3 years, faster if you can because there's still plenty to learn.
3000 Kanji +Grammar
20000 Vocab
>>
>>101907127
You're just trying to be annoying for the sake of being annoying aren't you? He clearly meant he had finished reading Tae Kim from start to finish and was going to start reading shit now.
>>
>>101907155
I think it could be translated as "In order to save many, or even one person". ひとり usually has the connotation of "alone", but it can also just mean "one person".
>>
>>101907335
>"In order to save many, or even one person"

That makes good sense in the context
>>
>>101907127
Feel free to further elaborate all your points as your pedantic fixation on semantics amuses me.
>>
>>101905020
SRS is for the words/phrases that you don't come across often enough to learn by exposure. Stuff like そつなくこなす which I've only seen in two manga.
>>
>>101907601
>そつなくこなす
This is as stupid as putting 自動販売機 in your deck. You could just learn そつなく and こなす separately.
>>
>>101907740
Or just use one card for it. Bet your autism couldn't handle that though
>>
>>101904189
It's a shit. Have someone re-write it in a way that doesn't scream autism.

>But it's a guide! Of course it has to be a sand-dry overly-organized list.

If you want newfags to read it then you better make it interesting, faggots.
>>
>>101907740
Then you'd have two cards instead of one.
>>
>>101907872
>>101907883
>le autisms buzzword xDD
>>
>>101907740

There is no point in NOT putting something in a deck. If you know what it is immediately, the card fucks off in less than two seconds and won't come up again until a bunch of months pass. If you still know it immediately, it fucks off until next year. No harm done.
>>
>>101907872
Yeah, but separately they aren't exactly rare words at all.
>>
>>101907883
We don't want somebody who's such retard he can't even use a guide like that to be lurking this thread in the first place.
>>
>>101907601
>which I've only seen in two manga
and that just screams "worth learning" to you?
>>
>>101908002
You must have a very limited vocabulary.
>>
>>101907883
>If you want newfags to read it then you better make it interesting, faggots
fuck off
>>
>>101907977
>>101908097
I don't think you understand the concept of a guide. It exists to help out people who have no idea where they are or what's going on around them. The people you idiots deem 'worthy' don't need it. They can just look up information by themselves.
>>
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エルサは寂しいみたいです。
>>
I just started reading the "Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar" and it's blowing my mind. It's teaching me way more about the differences between similar grammar forms than my three years of classes did.

How did I not start using this sooner? Oh, I know why. Cause "dictionary" sounded boring. How foolish of me.
>>
>>101908196
焦らす女
>>
>>101908190
I guess we should just put down the guide for good then and tell everybody asking for help to fuck off until they know the basics.
>>
>>101908200
Well it is kinda boring if you read it like a book. I like using it as a reference though.
>>
>>101907883
>sand-dry overly-organized list.
Quick! Mix up the topics and add hentai to it!
>>
Why is Kanji Damage even in the guide if it's so horrible? I know the guide says to take it with a grain of salt but it seems like it should just be cut out altogether, especially if it really is incredibly inaccurate.
>>
>>101908085
I admit, it is not easy for me to remember something I've only read twice--or care.
>>
>>101908446

How about you try to form your own opinion rather than parotting others? There's nothing wrong with the order or the concept of making up "inofficial" radicals to remember kanji better given in KD. Unlike RTK it comes with readings and vocabulary examples which is what actually matters, not the keywords and mnemonics.
>>
If beginners want a step-by-step guide then just google "Nukemarine's Suggested Guide for Beginners"
>>
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>>101908270
Basically, yes. Poeple gotta learn to be independant somehow, and if you keep looking after them they'll turn into horrible, entitled manchildren.

>realize that google glasses will have facial recognition and show you peoples names when you talk to them
>they'll show you the fastest routes to your destination as a dotted line on the ground so you don't get lost
>they'll translate foreign languages in real time, and replace words you don't understand with simpler ones

The future is coming, anon. Be prepared.
>>
>>101908085
He's fine. You don't need much to post on 4chan.
>>
>>101908270
That sounds great
>>
>>101908409
You describing a different kind of shitty doesn't justify the terribleness we have to deal right now, idiot.

>People are dying, John!
>W-well, how would you like it if everyone were a horrible Nazi, huh? People dying doesn't sound so bad now, does it?
>>
this is probably a stupid question, but I couldn't find an answer anywhere.

How do I do japanese punctuation with google IME?

I know how to do the regular dot and comma, but I can't find the keys for quotation marks, since google IME doesn't show me the keyboard layout like kotoeri did.
>>
ここ に 本 が あります。

is it a single book, or many books? i think i am missing something
>>
>>101908775
[ is 「 and ] is 」 on Google IME.
>>
>>101908773
please don't reply to me thanks
>>
>>101908828
there's no indication of plurality in japanese, you('re supposed to) know from context.
>>
>>101908703
>>101908270
L-Let me try it then...
ok uh...

>>101908828
Fuck off.

...like that?
>>
>>101908943
>implying implied plurality isn't still an indication of plurality
>>
>>101908828
You're missing the context, which is what should tell you the answer to your question.
>>
>>101908943
私達
彼ら
バカども
>no indication of plurality
>>
>>101909062
he probably meant nouns

do you have any examples of non-pronouns?
>>
>>101909104
連中
>>
>>101909104
You can use 達 to anthropomorphize practically anything.

えっ、全部売るの?でも人形達が可哀相じゃない
>>
>>101909174
that's not plural, in the same way "group" isn't plural

>>101909227
>anthropomorphize practically anything
>chooses dolls
that's just cheating
>>
>>101909372
>that's just cheating
It's a legitimate counter-example to "there's no indication of plurality in japanese".
>>
>>101909486
ok

do you have any examples of plurality in non-pronouns that don't make you sound like a tripping lunatic?
>>
>>101909604
木々
>>
>>101908643
I read this story. I don't like the future.
http://www.flashfictiononline.com/f20100901-tags-andrew-gudgel.html
>>
>>101908878
[]][][][][][][][][‹⁄⁄[]\ÒÒÔÔÚÚÚÚ^^^^^ÿ∏ØıÙÙÍÎÈËËÁŒ[]|][][]†®®ƒ@gっhっjんhっgfっr%&RFVBJMNBZUJ\ÒÔÔı·‚Ù‚‚·‚˜·˜˜˜˜¯¯¯·‚‚‚······‡‡‡‡flflflflfififiÅÅÅÅ˙»»»»÷÷÷÷÷—————•••••ÆÆÆÆÿÿÿ˘˘˘˘˘¢¢¢¢ææææ槧§§§ààààè觧§§¢¢¢¢¢¬¬¬¬∆¬¬¬¬∆ππ¢¬¬¬∆∆ºººK¯˜¯˜˜¯¯¯¯····‚‚‚‚¬¬∆∆ºººªªª@@@@ƒƒƒ∫√∫√[code:lit]≈≈≈≈¥¥¥¥@ƒ†ªªº∆¬¬¬¬≤≤≤¬¬¬¬¬¬¬¬¬¢¢¢¢¬¬¬¬¬¬¬¬[/code]∆………º°Ω†®[/code:lit]
>>
>>101908878
[]][][][][][][][][ why is this purple
>>
What's the difference between production and recognition on the Core2k Anki deck?
>>
>>101908878
[][][]%&

doesn't seem to be working.
>>
>>101910980
press space shitlord
>>
>>101910071
さらばお爺さん
>>
>>101911178
it doesn't work for shit

I tried changing it in the preferences, and this piece of crap doesn't work for shit.
>>
Is there any difference in nuance between saying 送る or 過ごす when talking about passing time? As in 愉しい日々を過ごす(送る).
>>
Let's settle this.
KanjiDamage: useful or avoid entirely?

The case for and case against. Whoever makes the better case gets it wiped from the guide.
>>
>>101912628

heisig is true enlightenment

-nukemarine approved
>>
>>101912628
What is your goal? Read books or get autismal over lexography? You don't need a system to do either. The former is just vaguely memorizing shapes and attaching them to words and the latter is better done with this.

http://www.genetickanji.com/
>>
>>101912628
He's a jew; that should say enough.
>>
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Why's there katakana thrown in the mix to spell kuso and maji? Are they considered slang words or something?
>>
>>101912628

See >>101908560
>>
>>101913210

Emphasis.

also
>seriously bothersome

God I fucking hate literal translations.
>>
>>101913210
Because she's a REALLY FUCKING BITCH.
>>
>>101912772

who?
>>
>>101913309
Nukemarine from Nukemarine's Suggested Guide for Beginners.
>>
>>101912628
Kill it or change the guide to reflect that only the general method is worth it.

>people ask where to start
>HOLY SHIT FOLLOW THE GUIDE
>guide says Kanji Damage is good if you follow it with a grain of salt
>turns out Kanji Damage is shit tier (link in >>101906285)
>people ask what to do next
>HOLY SHIT WHY ARE YOU FOLLOWING THE GUIDE AND NOT DOING YOUR OWN THING

Heisig is basically the same thing anyway.
>>
>>101913407
He any good?
>>
>>101913456
So if you were midway through Kanjidamage would you suggest following it through?

In fact, has anyone?
>>
>>101913456

I don't get it faggots just rush through kanji without even trying to read shit every now and then?
>>
>>101913523
No one finishes, they either give up or move to vocab when they realize it's not worth it for what they want to do.
>>
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japan a shit
>>
>>101913555
Pretty much. I think most people here have this idea of learning all of the Kanji. Then something between 2000 and 6000 words and THEN pick up baby level literature to read. It's really fucked up.
>>
>>101913563
I'd go farther with that. It's not worth it ever to start with. I'm extremely interested in handwriting, but learning all those kanji out of context, and without knowing how to read is a waste of time and effort.
>>
>>101913468

yeah sure
>>
>>101913657
Just learn to write when you actually have something to write. It's a lot easier and much more memorable to go through heisig when you already recognize everything from real words and don't need those horrible keywords in your way.
>>
>>101913523

I went through the Anki deck and am currently using the KD Boosterpack deck.

I'm not sure what the problem is for all these spergs around here, I use it a) as a way to remember kanji better based on their radicals and b) as a quick reference for new vocabulary by searching tangorin & co. for the kanji I'm seeing.
Most of the complaints seem to either stem from the inaccuracies in the website's introduction (which I don't really give a shit about) or the method of learning kanji itself.

RTK seems useless in comparison in my opinion. Grinding through all the kanji before touching vocab is a waste of time. Either do it in tandem with vocab or ONLY do vocab.
>>
>>101913657
so how did you go about this?

You just did vocab and learnt kanji as you went along?
>>
>>101913808
Okay man, I'm going to follow your method. I'm too far into KD to want to give up now, really.

May I ask how you started off vocab? Just things that interested you, or a vocab list, or...?

(Thanks. I was getting worried.)
>>
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>>101913924

From the beginning, I did KD and a Core deck (which also has voiced cards).
Every time I get a new card in KD I look the kanji up in an online dictionary and add the useful words to the Personal Vocab deck.

I also read/play easy manga/games and mine words from them.

Plus Rikaisama has a hotkey to save whatever you're hovering over to a text file. I frequently do that and add whatever I've saved to Anki at the end of the day.
>>
>>101913811
Exactly. I always take a look at each new kanji as they come up, which is probably something most people do. Look at its various meanings, then right back into the vocab reviews.

The guide is there to give you options, but most of the alternatives are a waste.
>>
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How do you think that you could ever learn Japanese when it takes most people their entire lives to learn 2000 kanji?
>>
>>101914184
better give up
>>
>>101914184

No job, school or obligations. Then it only takes a few weeks.
>>
>>101914184
>2005-11-11
>1425 posts
That's what you get when you spend more time talking about what the best method for studying is rather than doing any actual study
>>
>>101914564

Studying is for nerds.
>>
先生 先制 宣誓 陝西 専制

Fuck you.
>>
>>101914709
>こう
Now figure out which one it was supposed to be in the middle of some dense pseudo-scientific talk full of neologisms. Sensei ain't shit.
>>
>>101905020
>>101905072
>自動販売機
Do you really need a flashcard for this?

I mean, if you know 自動, 販売, and 機, you should have no problems understanding what a 自動販売機 is. And if you don't know those three basic words, you should learn those before learning a compound like 自動販売機.
>>
>>101915070

The whole point was that you don't.
>>
>>101915253
I didn't say otherwise. Though, I still recommend flashcards for less common, but still relatively common words. Once they stick, you'll see them everywhere.
>>
>>101905020
>>101915070
I don't know about that. Long compound words are really fun, and can help you with regular words you have trouble with.

>未確認飛行物体
I don't forget 確認 any more thanks to this.
>>
>>101915070
I'm not so sure. This isn't particular to the vending machine case, but if there are 'complex' compound words that are used more often than the parts that make it up

Even in english, you'll hear the words 'vending machine' together than you'll hear 'vend'
>>
>>101917050
"... that make it up, then it might be better to learn that"



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