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>Finally started watching Fate/Zero
>Entirely for this motherfucker

Best Servant, hands down.
>>
>>101347210
Died like a bitch.
>>
>>101347259

Like 90% of the cast?
>>
>>101347210

The only reason F/Z was good.
>>
>>101347463
I do like the intrigue, but I smile every time he comes on screen.

10/10 would pledge undying allegiance to.
>>
>>101347259
That's not Fast Wheels.
>>
You're going to shit bricks when you see his Noble Phantasm. Even Gilgamesh pisses himself.
>>
Fuck that.
Saber is my waifu/10
Gilgamesh 10/10 would love him to call me mongrel
Berserker was cool until that jet shit
>Caster'
Rider was a fat punk with shitty ideals.
>Assassin
Sage because fighting words
>>
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> Ufotable's F/SN this year
> mfw F/SN's Rider isn't a hotblooded, total bro who gets Saber told
>>
>>101347210
Would bend the knee.

If they made a show of just Waver and Iskandar I would watch the shit out of it.
>>
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>gets killed like a bitch by gil
>>
Rider a fucking shit
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>>101347210
Mah nigga.
>>
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>>101347817
He's everything I want to be.
>>
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that speech at the very end ;_;
>>
My favorite was that killer dude and his Caster. They just had such a great chemistry together.
>>
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>>101347259
>mono e mono against the greatest hero who ever lived
>the king of heroes recognized you as his peer
>like a bitch

Does not compute.
>>
>>101347259
>Died like a bitch
he charged right through a hail of blades, impaled five times or more, and didn't even come close to stopping until Gil pulled out his chains of bullshit.
>>
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Best Servant right here
>>
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>mfw Ionian Hetairoi
>>
>>101348946
KONO DIO DA
>>
IF you forget he's supposed to be Alexander the fucking Great... well, I guess so.

He's far for being the worst character, thought. Saber easily takes that spot.
>>
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>You'll never be fucked in your boypussy by Rider after a long day of glorious conquest
>>
Heh, I like this Rider more.
>>
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>>101347210
Not even his entire army in a reality marble could defeat Gil.
>yfw Shirou beat Gil using Unlimited Blade Works by himself.
>>
>>101349159
Except that it's explicitly stated that UBW is the perfect counter against Gil, did you even play the VN?
>>
>>101349159
You probably just watched the show, huh?
>>
>>101349159
Gil underestimated Shirou and didn't use Ea at it's full power 5 seconds into the battle, unlike against Alexander.
>>
>>101349229
Yeah I did, just found it funny an entire army couldn't take down Gil as opposed to Shirou. However if Gil used Ea UBW would be fucked.
>>101349282
Nope, read the LN for F/Z and VN for Fate.
>>101349318
This.
>>
>>101349159
Alexander was asking for it.

Who spawns like 3 football fields away from an archer?
>>
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>>101349098
>You'll never drink, feast and make merry with the King of Conquerors
>>
>>101349159
Even the VN largely attributes Shirou's victory in UBW to Gil's emotional state.
>>
>>101349340
Basically

Gil was taking seriously Iskandar, therefore he stood no chance especially without his Chariot

On the other hand he never considered Shirou worthy to go all out and that was his loss

Lancelot can kill Gil
>>
>>101349340
Shirou would not be retarded enough to give Gil a chance to ever charge up his Ea.

From the moment, Shirou saw Ea, he knew he had to make sure Gil never ever got a chance to charge it up.
>>
>>101349364
I don't think Reality Marbles come with a level editor.
>>
>>101349340
>However if Gil used Ea UBW would be fucked.
Shirou was quick enough to realize how dangerous Ea was and cut off Gil's arm the moment he pulled it out.
>>
>>101349364
>>101349469
Oh fuck you I laughed
>>
>>101349459
>Lancelot can kill Gil
Pfft, Lancelot can't kill anyone. I mean, his noble phantasm is cool as fuck, but that doesn't make him strong.
>>
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>admires Bill Clinton
>addicted to tactics based video games
>the speeches he gave

I swear, energy like that made F/Z great.
It was the mixture of him and Kerry that made me stick around.
>>
>>101349467
Not so much a question of Shirou being retarded, but Gilgamesh. He acknowledged that he'd be fighting a losing battle if Gil wasn't so flustered.
>>
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>>101349469
>>101349364
>>
>>101347259
And I cried like a bitch.
>>
>>101349469
except that in the novel it's heavily implied that Alexander can control the starting positions of the people inside the reality Marble
>>
>>101347210
He beheaded some sexy Assassin chick in skin tight clothing. Dude couldn't die quickly enough.
>>
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>>101349459
>Lancelot can kill Gil
What kinda drugs are you on mate? I believe you mean Gawain since he actually stands a chance in the sun, plus he died better in F/E.
>>
>>101349140

Not a bro
Doesn't get Saber told

Ufotable's F/SN better compensate for this.
>>
>>101349819
She IS a fucking bro though.
And she kills Saber, even better.
>>
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>>101349469
The very POINT of Nero's is that whatever she wants to happen HAPPENS.
>>
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>>101349752
Well shit, I guess they do come with a level editor.

But it wouldn't really be an honourable duel between heroes of legend if he just spawned within dicklength of Gil and stabbed him on the spot.
>>
>>101349159

Honestly, none of Rider's soldiers could even touch Gil, he was already disintegrating the reality marble. We'll never know how a battle between him and his army would have gone if he hadn't made that move.
>>
>>101348946
Mah nigga.
>>
>>101349814
Gilgamesh had a Noble Phantasm to counter Numeral of the Saint in CCC.
>>
By far one of the most obnoxious characters in the Fate series.

>>101349864
>Rider
>Killing Saber
That was Shirou you idiot. I don't get what people see in Rider? She's has the same personality as Saber but with a more mature body.
>>
>>101349902
Nero doesn't have a reality marble, her theater is high thaumaturgy.
>>
>>101349864

Doesn't like tactic videogames
Won't slap your shit for being an annoying cunt
Doesn't have outstanding pectorals

But I guess she's fine
>>
>>101349902
Nero has something that is better than a reality marble actually.
>>
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>>101350204
Oh she is
Mightily so.
>>
>>101349917
>But it wouldn't really be an honourable duel between heroes of legend if he just spawned within dicklength of Gil and stabbed him on the spot.
Precisely.
>>
>>101349932
Since Gil can swordspam omnidirectionally, odds are Rider would still be up shit's creek.
>>
>>101350286
Though, stabbing gil would not be enough. His armor can take hits from Excalibur, and rider doesn't have any single weapon with that kind of power.
>>
>>101350079
Wait he did? All I know about him in CCC is that his noble phantasm basically oneshots anything.
>>
>>101350379
>His armor can take hits from Excalibur
DEEN, plz.
>>
>>101350453
I've never seen the anime. In the VN, he was blocking excalibur with his hands before it was fully activated.

Rider doesn't have any single weapon as strong as latent excalibur, so I'm not sure what you're getting at.
>>
>>101347259
-1/10, try more
>>
>>101350390
Allegedly. When Gawain threatens Gil, he shrugs it off and claims he has a shroud of night somewhere in the Gate of Babylon anyway.
>>
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>You will never rest your head over Rider's powerful pecs.
>>
>>101350275
>OVA series
>Waver transfers schools
>Iskander is his host-dad
>Medusa is his home-room teach
>Iskander vows to teach Waver to be a man to win her
>Hijinks ensue
>>
>>101350275
People only like her because she's game for sex anytime. Other than that, her personality is on par with a brick.
>>
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>>101350689
I liked her because she is a caring onee-chan.
Don't you like onee-chans?
>>
>>101350646
genius
Rider and Rider are easily best man and girl
>>
>>101350204
>Has comperable chest
>Will slap your shit if ya fuck her over
>Enjoys reading
She's great
>>101350080
A lil knife was just the finishing blow, or are you saying that it could have all went down w/o shirou turning into a vegetable? Rider's piercing beam made Saber her bitch.
Rider saved people's asses all the time during HF.
>>
>>101350689
>Confirmed for not reading the novel
I bet you think Saber had the personality of a brick as well.
>>
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>>101350590
Well of course, Gil fucking owns everything.
>>101350646
Shouldn't Waver be like, motherfucking Lord El-Malloi II by that time?
+When Shirou shows his face waver will be blueballed hard.
>>
>>101350646

>OVA series
>Waver transfers schools
>Medusa is his host-mom
>Iskander is his homeroom teacher
>Medusa vows to teach Waver to be a girl to win him
>greatest love story ever told
>>
I would go completely gay for Iskandar if he was 3D.
>>
>>101350791
Saber was kicking Rider's ass the entire fight. She needed Shirou to prop up her noble phantasm.
>>
>>101350910
Alternative Universe, I ain't gotta explain shit

>>101350769
>Gilgamesh is Principle
>Kids get sent to his office
>Spends so long talking about how great he is he forgets what the hell they are doing there
>Vice-Principle Saber has to do everything
>>
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>>101350987
>Worst Kettle crisps around
>>
>>101349140

Does she get fucked after this scene?
>>
>>101351138
>implying the worst Kettle Chips aren't still Eldritch God tier chips
>>
>>101350987
>I would go completly gar for iskander if he was 3D.
Fixed that post for you anon
>>
>>101350748
She's a imouto though.
>>
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>>101350910
Waver is too busy being someone's bitch
>>
>>101351138
Didn't you see that thread when that pic was first posted? With in three posts it had completely devolved into absolute anarchy with anon proclaiming loudly and to the world that Tim's Cascade are the greatest Kettle Chips known to man, and that anyone who says otherwise is a sissy lala and has to sit to pee.
>>
>>101351093
>Tokiomi is Parent Council President
>Caster(Gil) is chemistry teacher
>Taiga is school nurse
find more
>>
>>101351224
She licks his butt hole.
>>
>>101350748
She is a copy of a gorgon who has been long dead, not your onee-chan.

>>101350791
>Rider's piercing beam made Saber her bitch.
She would have been obliterated by Excalibur were it not for Shirou using Rho Aias.
>>
>>101351235
He can do better than this!

>>101351313
I have not and I agree with that anon.
>>
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>>101351224
>>
>>101351354

Is this separate from the F/HA h-scene?

The thought of Rider licking my butt hole is almost too much man, the thought of a beautiful women like that willing to lick me there for my pleasure...;_;
>>
>>101351439
It wasn't just one anon, unless he was samefagging for two hundred posts before the thread was deleted. IT was a triumphant proclamation by all of anon that Tim's Cascade is proof that God exists, and he loves us.
>>
>>101351489

Perfect were it not for the girl on right.
>>
>>101351535
I honestly don't understand the thing with analingus. I had a girl lick my asshole once and it wasn't anything special, and after that even though I knew time had passed and she had brushed her teeth many many times I could not bring myself to kiss her.
>>
>>101351559
I want Tim to cascade my crisps
>>
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>>101351489
It is time.
>>
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They fucked, right?
>>
>>101351348
>Lancer(Dia) is male gym teacher
>Takes a massive interest in the love-lives of his students
>Thinks he knows everything about romance
>It all boils down to "Don't get stabbed by jealous exs"
>>
>>101351666

I don't have that fetish either really, though I'd almost certainly relish licking Rider's anus.

How do you feel about girls who do Ass to Mouth?
>>
>>101351489

>keeping glasses on

YES
>>
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>>101351823
Or by yourself
>>
>>101350590
>>101350910
Why don't you play the actual damn game before making up bullshit, Gilfags?

Gil doesn't own everything. Even in CCC, Gil says he doesn't have any of Karna's NPs which is why Gil tells Karna that once he beats him, he wants Karna's armor and spear since his vault doesn't have them.
>>
>>101351826
I don't care for it. Honestly anything anal related is such a huge turn off. Why would anyone want to stick their dick in a filthy shit filled hole when there is all that delcious vagina out there?
>>
>>101347259
>died
you spelled cried wrong faggot
>>
>>101351997
My knowledge of moonrunes are rather limited anon, waiting for translation/localization.
>>
>>101349814

What the fuck? Is that what 'Chivalry' means to a Knight of the Round Table?
>>
>>101351348
>Medea teaches world history.
>Assassins are campus security with Kojuro always stuck on gate duty.
>>
>>101352023

I wouldn't know either way, but I think it's the supposed extra tightness and being in somewhere extremely private of someone you love.

Ass to Mouth is a bit...grim though, who wants to taste their own ass on someone's dick? I bet Pornstars bleach the ever loving shit out of their anal cavity before doing that.
>>
>>101351997
Why don't you? The part concerning Gil's canopy of night has already been translated.
>>
>>101352266
It's not that much tighter unless the girl is a slut.
>>
>>101352397

Okay then, well the way I see it, the thought of having been in a girls ass (and mouth and vagina) seems kinda hot to me, imagine how close you'd have to be to let someone in there?
>>
>>101352522
And that is the reason weird fetish shit dominates the doujin market. If you haven't had something the mind runs wild and begins to glamorize it.
>>
>>101352125

>Hercules teaches math
>Nero teaches theater, but doesn't actually teach so much as show off the entire time.
>>
>>101352727
>Hercules teaches math
Come on, that was mean.
>>
>>101352697

You reckon I'd not like the reality nearly as much? I hope not, as it looks rather sweet when done right, like in Ciel's h-scene in Tsukihime.

That and I don't see it as that weird, imo it's pretty vanilla.
>>
>>101352727
>>Nero teaches theater, but doesn't actually teach so much as show off the entire time.

I get the impression she'd distract all the male students who lavish her with praise as she inappropriately encourages such comments.
>>
>Download Magical Warfare
>Is not Saber and Gil + Shana SOL in Highschool
>>
>>101353184

All apart of showing off.
>>
>>101353184
like a proper actress
>>
>>101353184
Basically the opposite of Dia, who has to stave off the girls with a stick.
>>
>>101347210
>>
I want to make love to Saber.
>>
>>101353367
>>101353308

>Nero acting a scene from a play of a significant part of her life in Ancient Rome (In other words, any part) on stage next to a mountain of apples.
>>
>>101353478

Which one?
>>
>>101353423
yeah, he's best servant, got anything to say about it, faggot?
>>
>>101353561
Regular Saber.
>>
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>>101352727
>Tamamo is forced to teach japanese because she's japanese.
>Ignores this and instead talks about husband and wife stuff.
>>
>>101353561
Siegfried.
>>
>>101353579

>Archer joins Rider to pull himself out of his CG duties and into Rider's Army

>Ionian Hetairoi backed up with UBW

Sorted.
>>
>>101352727
A day in Saber Nero's class.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64Qyg9K711w
>>
>>101351535
http://exhentai.org/s/0704da140f/211070-22

Bam.
>>
>>101353621

I want to know how Nero would react to meeting Arturia, if she'd be egotistical enough to fall in love with herself, then chase Saber around as she struggles to hold on to her Spaghetti as she's being lusted over by a Woman.
>>
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You will never buy Alexander a B-2 bomber for his birthday. ;_;
>>
>>101353669
>Implying Archer would ever serve under Alexander or work for the military, ever.

Following a war hungry leader contradicts Archer's very ideals.
>>
>>101352125
>>
>>101352697

Does it hurt both people if you go in dry?
>>
>>101353669
Archer would hate Iskander. Just another military junta like all the rest.
>>
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>>101353579
Nah man, is cool.
>>
>>101353923
I don't know, but would assume so since I was asked to lube up first.
>>
>>101353933
>>101353843

Funny how no one ever called Rider out not on the fact that he fucked up everything he had at the end, but that he destroyed hundreds of thousands of lives in his quest for conquest.

Even Saber never said anything.
>>
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>>101353773
Ahnenerbe no Nichijou has the answer.
>>
>>101354040
She tends to be outspoken.
Even an idiot made of swords managed to berate her wish is retarded.
>>
>Mordred teaches philosophy
>Siegfried teaches lit

Also every day Mordred, Nero, and Saber get into some sort of fight
>>
>>101354146
>Jeanne always stops them
>>
>>101354149
Nero wouldn't teach, she'll be a student, rather a delinquent that rides motorcycle with her new "daddy".
>>
>>101354146
>She tends to be outspoken.

She got double teamed at the Kings Banquet. ;_;

That bit where Gil turns to Rider and says says "Lol, did you hear that shit, Rider?" was pretty funny though.
>>
>>101354149
Probably because Nero was acting unprofessionally, Mordred backs Nero just to fuck with Saber. while Dia tries to calm them.

>"Ladies, please, this is not how Knights should act"
>>
>Arturia compared to a Lion on number of occasions

>Nero known to have strangled a Lion barehanded once

Are they trying to imply something?
>>
>>101353579
The world disagrees.
>>
>>101354382
>Rider over Gil
Get fucked, golden boy
>>
>>101354267
Seiba needs Gawain to trash talk for her.
If he was there, both Alex and Gil would be told as well, then it will end up in a brawl.
>>
>>101354382
Is it only me, or does Rin look a lot like Asuka here.
>>
>>101354382
Wait wot, Shiki? I had no idea KnK was that big.
>>
>>101354499
>I had no idea KnK was that big.
Second most popular Type-Moon series.
>>
>>101354382
>The opinions of Elevens
>Relevant to the world
>>
>>101354580
KnK is not bigger than Tsukihime.
>>
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>>101354460
Just you.
>>
>>101354610
>The opinions of gaijin
>Relevant to Type-Moon
>>
>>101354034

Man, you're lucky. Just being asked 'to lube up' sounds awesome.
>>
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>>101354459
>>
>>101354610
Anon please, we voted on this, it was online. I voted Archer, Kotomine, Shirou.

We had threads about it, too.
>>
>>101354652
I guess you're right since Akiha and Kohaku are already on there.
>>
>>101354382
>no kotomine

wtf
>>
>>101354804
His votes were split.

Same for Gil. He'd edge out Sakura otherwise.
>>
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>>101354804
>21 Kirei Kotomine 3517
>>
>>101354382
Why do people like Ilya? She's a murderous cunt. Is it just because she's a loli?
>>
>>101354382
>No Kirei
At least Akiha is there.
>>
>>101354910
No one outside of the top 10 are actually relevant.
>>
>>101354910
No, because she is caring and kind onee-san.
>>
>>101354910
Perfection gained through the forbidden combination of Oneesan and Imouto archetypes.
>>
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>>101354903
Poor guy lost to his daughter.
>>
>>101355070
>caring and kind
>Ilya
>Kills Shirou numerous times
>>
>>101355156
Yeah but SHirou is a faggot
>>
>>101354910
Why would she kill people? She has a servant for that. She did more than Sakura ever could in Heaven's Feel. Heaven's Feel should have had Ilya as the main heroine while Sakura goes stupidly obsessed over Shirou to where she goes evil.
>>
>>101355239
Killing people via her servant still counts as her killing people
>>
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>>101355156
A crazy imouto is fine, too.
>>
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>>101355156
Shirou did steal away Kerry.
It's not Ilya's fault she sometimes accidentally hurts her onii-chan!
>>
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>>101355156
She was just jealous and bitter.
>>
>>101347210
Glad you're happy OP.
I'll start getting into it once I have a better grip of the language,
>>
>>101349902
Her theatre is said to only look like a RM superficially

It's actually something much greater as stated in the bio, and it can last longer since it's built upon the world itself rather than switching places with the world.
>>
>>101355688
>It's actually something much greater as stated
Nope.

It's effects are more pronounced, doesn't mean it's greater.
>>
>>101349080
Yeah, he's an awesome character, but not very Alexander. Still would pledge allegiance tho.
>>
>>101351997
That doesn't really contradict shit; he claims everything as his which is why he tries to fight Karna over his shit and says "Well of course, the grail is already mine, even if I've never seen it" in Zero. To him everything in the world is already his even if he doesn't currently own it, but we know he has the shroud.
>>
>>101355688
>Rank B
>every RM has a higher rank
I dunno about that.
>>
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>>101355861
>>
>>101349080
>He's far for being the worst character, thought. Saber easily takes that spot.
Have people forgotten about Kiritsugu and Gilgamesh? I can understand people hating Saber because /a/ hates moralfags.
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Seiba is best servant.
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>>101355934
That's nice, I guess?
>>
>>101355944
Saber is the number 1 /a/ waifu.
>>
>>101356072
The effects and level of Thaumaturgy are stated to be greater on that page. It's something that superficially resembled a reality marble, but naturally is something different from the start.

>The Flamboyant Golden Theatre (Noble Phantasm)

>Aestus Domus Aurea. Red Sabre's Noble Phantasm, which represented the explosion of her bothersome artistic talent.
>Its precise name was Aestus Estus Domus Aurea.
>In Latin, Aestus Ustus meant "passion" and "heat", while Domus Aurea was the name of the theatre that was constructed.
>It was the manifestation of the tale of Red Sabre declaring "Heed my song!" and locking everyone in the theatre to listen to his singing.
>It created a golden theatre in which everything was advantageous to Sabre, and made it into the battle field. There were rose petals dancing in the air.
>It was different from a Reality Marble, which covered the current World with a different World. The Golden Theatre could persist for long periods because it was built on top of the current World.
>As an aside, when the Golden Theatre was risen, Sabre's sworld would be shrouded in flames like that of the Mount Vesuvius, causing an infernal. Such was the initial design.
>However, it was cut because of the difficulty to animate. The sad limit of handhelds.
>In terms of derivatives, it seemed that there was the Silver Workshop for Sabre's artistic endeavours, and "Blazing Kitchen" for cooking competitions.
>Such was the will of Her Majesty.
>>
>>101355156
>Caring and Kind
>Sacrifices her life to perform the 3rd magic on shirou so that he may have a chance to live
>>
Reminder that Medusa easily beats Iskander in a fight
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>>101356040
I agree.
Saber is the cutest servant as well!
>>
>>101356271
Let's see here.

>Adj. 1. pronounced - strongly marked; easily noticeable; "walked with a marked limp"; "a pronounced flavor of cinnamon"
marked
Hmm. Nope.

>Reality Marble
>A Magecraft close to Sorcery. A taboo among taboos, a mystery among mysteries. One of the pinnacles for a magus.
Double nope.
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>>101356395
Fucking Cybele.
>>
>>101356470
So Nero's NP's effects is more pronounced, but it isn't as "special", or "magical" as a regular RM?
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Saber a best
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>>101355934
>based on the highest and most difficult principles of thaumaturgy
Isn't this line just referencing Reality Marbles?
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>>101356678
I like her new design. It's not like Takeuchi hasn't had sameface problems before.
>>
>>101356678
At least her hair looks more like the model she was based off of.
>>
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>>101356832
but but MUH VENTS
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>>101356596
It's a gigantic golden theatre, it's showy I'll give it that.

Power-wise it doesn't seem that incredible, Nero herself being the reason why it's effective.
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>>101356678
Geh I liked Melty Blood Arc best, hope they don't fuck up Archtype-Earth.
>>
>>101356948
Did Ryukishi07 try drawing Arc?
Also, Air Intakes are the best.
>>
>>101350987
>japanese
>bulge
Something's not right here.
>>
>>101357515
He isn't Japanese, he is a westerner.
>>
>>101355844
That's a lie. When Gil saw Excalibur for the first time, even he wasn't arrogant enough to claim Excalibur belongs to him.
>>
>>101354903
That's only because Kotomine got split into seperate F/SN and Zero categories.
I still have no clue why.
>>
>>101357380
Why didn't Ryukioshi07 just hire an artist for his VNs?
>>
>>101357557
That's because gil has a way better, older version anyways.
>>
>>101356555
Even without Cybele, all Iskandar has is a bunch of men on horses not as good as Pegasus.
>>
>>101357595
The same reason ZUN doesn't, retards claim 'muh unique artstyle'
>>
>>101357617
I'm not sure about way better, but he definitely has an older version of it.
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>>101357687
>>
>>101357620
His chariot is arguably better than Pegasus.
>>
>>101357617
Ea? Yes.

He doesn't have an Excalibur prototype, though.
>>
>>101357839
He has Gram, which is related.
>>
>>101357774
The chariot is just an A+ noble phantasm. The Pegasus is dragon tier that Rider further buffs with an A+ noble phantasm.
>>
>>101357617
Nothing about it says it is better, newfag.

Gae Bolg's prototype for example doesn't have the NPs added to it because the prototype was never wielded by Lancer.
>>
>>101357985
Gram is Caliburn, "Sword drawn from ___".
>>
>>101358004
Older = Better

Gae Bolg would certain still have it's effects, but it's not like Gil gives a shit about it's effects anyways.

Where do newfags come in?
>>
>>101357985
And the prototypes don't have the same abilities as their final types and Gil can't use them anyway because he is an owner and not a master so Gae Bolg's prototype would just be a piece of metal in Gil's hands.
>>
So can someone explain how a BDSM slut is a better servant than fucking Alexander the Great and his entire fucking army?

It's all I ever hear in these threads
>>
>>101358156
Because read the goddamned VN.
>>
>>101357994
Now I don't really give a fuck about the classifications of beasts, but I remember some guy arguing about the oxes being older and thus more powerful.

I don't even care, just repeating what I remember. They're both just A+, though.
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>>101358156
Medusa's cute.
>>
>>101358284
And BARA beats cute any day of the week
>>
>>101358110
Older versions have better quality, but the later ones can surpass them if their effects have a greater legend.

Gae Bolg was better than Gungnir, Caliburn could surpass Gram.
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Rider visits the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia and the administrative region of Central Macedonia.

Which one does he like better?
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>>101358156
She has an area effect ability that basically Auto Kills anyone whose stats aren't high enough, slowly kills anyone with slightly higher stats, and debuffs anyone at a certain level beyond that.

Iskander's entire army falls under the "Auto Kill" category.

Iskander himself falls under the "Slowly Killed" category.

Plus her ride is better so she can win if they just ram into each other.

She's basically an Anti-Army Servant. Her abilities are literally the best possible for fucking him over if you're not factoring in stuff like Gilgamesh's win button EA.
>>
>>101356427

Saber a shit
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>>101358156
Who cares about the fucking army
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>>101347210
>VA used to be Bluebeard
>>
I've never bothered with the fat/zero series because of how bad /a/ says it is on a consistent basis. I wouldn't even know where to begin ether.
>>
>>101358110
Says the Gilfag who is obviously a newfag.

Older does not always equal better.

Archer's newer version of Caladbolg has the added effect of chasing down the enemy until it hits them no matter the director when the original Caladbolg did not have that ability at all.

Also, as expected of newfags. If you played the VN, you would see Archer mentioning how Gae Bolg had more firepower than its predecessor, Odin's spear.

So older does not always mean better.
>>
>>101358455
Iskander falls under instakill, too.
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>>101358465
Bullies not allowed here thank you very mcuh
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>>101354040
Waver did at one point. Rider's reply was just "shit happens"
>>
>>101358565
Wait, I thought Iskander had B Rank Resistance?
>>
>>101358524
>Archer's newer version of Caladbolg has the added effect of chasing down the enemy until it hits them no matter the director when the original Caladbolg did not have that ability at all.
Massive Archerfag here:

What? Caladbolg rarely misses because Archer's just that good. Are you perhaps thinking about Hrunting or something?
>>
>>101358524
The original Caladbolg wasn't an arrow. It was a sword with a similar effect as Excalibur. That's Archer modifying an NP.
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>>101358156
>mystic eyes
>pegasus
>blood fort
>calm and mature; doesn't charge in like a retard every fight
>actually listens to her master
>sleek, erotic body instead of bara muscleman
That good enough for you, faggot?
>>
>>101358664
It's not Magic Resistance, but Magic stat. Archer has D magic res and he could still resist it a little at close range in HF.
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>>101358455
if only her master wasn't Shinji and the war was a regular one
then she would've stood a chance
>>
>>101358455
Basically, Rider is Iskander's worst matchup because she's primarily an anti-army servant. Give her enough time to prep pegasus as well and Iskander is boned.

>>101358770
5th war was hilarious disappointment all around.

>Saber doesn't have a proper master
>Herakles is summoned as a berserker
>True Assassin doesn't assassinate anyone
>Lancer doesn't get to work with Bazette

Hell, Nasu even said Lancer would most likely win if Kotomine didnt screw everything up.
>>
>>101358234
If anything, Pegasus (Age of Gods) is older than the bulls (Age of Men). What sets them apart is ranks: Pegasus is a Phantasmal Beast, while the bulls, as Divine Beasts, outrank it.

That said, with Bellerophon and Via Expugnatio being Anti-Army NPs ill-designed for engaging single targets (let alone ones moving so fast), I'd imagine both Riders would switch to something a little more practical to fight each other with. Sadly for Iskandar, that means getting turned to stone.
>>
>>101359050
What about Basakka?
>>
>>101358524
>Accusing others of newfag
>Gets everything wrong in his post anyways

Older usually does mean better, as the older you are the more divine mystery you get, which has the effect of turning shit into NPs. This is one of the reasons why Berserker's chunk of stone can go toe to toe with Excalibur.

Also, Caladbolg doesn't chase anyone down, you're thinking of another weapon.
>>
>>101359050
>>True Assassin doesn't assassinate anyone
Since when has any Assassin assassinated anyone?
>>
>>101359050
>True Assassin doesn't assassinate anyone
Well uh. He tried.
>>
>>101359176
Realistically speaking, he should be the strongest servant in the war except serious Gil.

>God hand gives him immunity to low ranked NPs, added immunity upon losing a life, and just tough as hell
>Can wield at least four other types of weapons, not just his rock sword
>Can use NL at will, which doesn't get countered by Fragrach
>Can use the hydra bow and arrows, which were coated with poison strong enough to actually melt God Hand and disable his arm in life
>Arrows can actually home in on servants within a certain range

Then again, when asked who would win, Nasu cited Lancer and Bazette as being most likely, so who knows.
>>
>>101359050
Isn't that the point of the Holy Grail War, that it always goes hilariously wrong? There was only suppose to be one and somehow they got up to five.
>>
>>101357687
>Hating ZUNart
know how i can tell you're a faggot?
No one draws like ZUN, the art is a part of the appeal.
>>
>>101359286
TA pretty much lost every fight he went into, only surviving because of the Shadow half the time.
>>
>>101358770
I hope you realize that in the entire history of the Grail Wars, there was no 'regular one' except for the 1st and 2nd, which failed anyways.

The Moon Cell is the closest you're getting to an actual grail war.
>>
Fate universe sounds like a whole load of powerlevel bullshit.
>>
>>101359225
This is one of the reasons why Berserker's chunk of stone can go toe to toe with Excalibur.


Are you retarded? The stone was a modified by the Einzberns themselves. They make weapons, too, you stupid fuck.

And Nasu even mentions how the maids have B rank Servant Strength.
>>
>>101359372
Un-nerfed Cu vs. Un-nerfed Herc would be a ridiculous fight, though Herc has a clear advantage.

>>101359258
True Assassin actually managed to assassinate Medea.

And Li Shuwen almost assassinates you, but decides to maim you instead.
>>
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>>101359371
Poor Acht. Things never go right for him.
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>>101359499
It was modified into a sword, yes.
But it was scavenged from one of his holy temples, which was why it's an NP instead of just a regular weapon. That's why it doesn't just shatter against other NPs.

Nasu has a hard-on for the concept of older = mystery = unique properties.
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>>101359050
>True Assassin doesn't assassinate anyone
This just proves it: Fakes > Originals.
>>
>>101359529
Cu vs Herc is a terrible fight for Cu because of God Hand.

>>101359485
Yeah, but it's fun power levels. It's like animu World of Darkness.
>>
>>101358448
The one he was born in. Don't ask me which one though *runs*

I think the greeks have it right in this case but good luck sorting it out
>>
>>101359529
>And Li Shuwen almost assassinates you, but decides to maim you instead.
In extra? Nah, your servant was just good enough to dodge.

But yeah, forgot about Caster.
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>>101359611
>>
>>101359597
It's not an NP. Nowhere is it stated the axe sword is a NP.

The reason it doesn't shatter is because the Einzberns can make weapons on par with the weapons the Servants use.

If you gave Hercules a tree branch, it would have held just as well as his axe sword because 9 Lives is not limited to his axe sword but can be applied to anything Hercules has his hands on.
>>
>>101359050
>Hell, Nasu even said Lancer would most likely win if Kotomine didnt screw everything up.
I can't find this for the life of me
>>
>>101347210
>Anno Domini 2014
>Liking servants
I thought we all knew that servants, with the exception of Hassan, Counter guardian Emiya and Jean d'arc, are war mongering, delusional violent men and women who lead humanity astray by eschewing logic and reasoning for petty ideals and delusions.

Take Iskander for example, his incessant greed probably got hundreds, thousands if not hundred thousands, of people killed. For what? An imaginary place called Oceanus?
>>
Why does Saber get sexy black armor when she goes Alter but Lancer becomes a dog and Gilg becomes a kaiju?
>>
>>101360070
>war mongering, delusional violent men and women who lead humanity astray by eschewing logic and reasoning for petty ideals and delusions.

I don't see a problem with this.

>>101360150
Gil does not go Alter, Alter goes Gil.
>>
>>101348355

Gil loves him though.
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>>101360070
>Kiritsugu is the only hero we need
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>>101360150
>Why does Saber get sexy black armor when she goes Alter.
Because she always was.
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>>101360070
Kerry please go

Shirou has everything under control
>>
>>101358720

If she fucked me I think I'd sleep so well I never woke up.
>>
>>101360150
Because type-moon are faggots.

Lancer should not turn into a dog but a literal demon when he goes berserk mode.

I wonder who is the furfag on the staff responsible for this.

Fuck, no one can take a blur haired dog seriously.

It would look like Sonic's retarded cousin.
>>
>>101359711
born in Pella, which is in macedonia, greece
>>
>>101348849
So basically if you're Greek, GoB will fuck you over.

And if you're Japanese, then you will not only survive that shit, but end up headshotting the caster.

Good to know.
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>>101360150
>Lancer becomes a dog
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>>101349647
>Highest stats of all Servants in any war even with a Master that holds him back
>Sword that can block anything
>Can turn any weapon including nuclear bombs into a NP
>Can't kill anything
>>
>>101361616
Herakles had higher stats and that was without Ilya turning Mad Enchance on.
>>
>>101361616
What are his stats, exactly? The only stat sheet I've seen for him had them garbled out.
>>
>>101361788
You might want to check Lancelot stats again. His stats without Arondight are on par with Heracles. And Heracles has Ilya as Master, his stats are at the best they could get. Lancelot on the other hand has a shit Master holding him back.
>>
>>101361816
Spirit: Lancelot
Master: Kariya Matou
Alignment: Lawful Mad
Strength: A Mana: C
Endurance: A Luck: B
Agility: A+ N. Phantasm: A
>>
>>101361873
And Herakles doesn't even have his ME on, which makes Arondight moot.
>>
>>101361887
Reminder that his Luck can get a boost by protection of the fairies too.
>>
>>101361587
Yes

Japs decided that "Demon Berseker on the Battlefield that can only be calmed by a bucket of cold water or hot women" somehow translated into "Dog transformation"
>>
>>101361954
Even if that was true, he has Ilya as master compared to Kariya as Master. Lancelot stats can go much higher with a decent master.
>>
>>101362091
There is no proof of that.
>>
>>101362045
Well, the bucket of water thing makes sense at least...
>>
>>101361954
He can't even talk and you are telling me he isn't Mad Enhanced? Ilya actually has it at max to make him pay for the pain he inflicts on her
>>
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Does it bother anyone else that the majority of servants have multiple noble phantasms? Often as many as three or more?
>>
>>101362045
>Demon Berseker on the Battlefield that can only be calmed by a bucket of cold water or hot women
I'm surprised that you know that much about Cu Chulainn but still not know why he's called the Hound of Culann.
>>
>>101362222
Nope, the only instance Mad Enhance is on is in Fate against Saber the last time around.
>>
>>101362192
Saber and Gil stats with shittier Masters are the proof of that.
>>
>>101362294
No, as in that Kariya isn't supplying enough prana.
>>
Whose a better Master

Ilya, Sakura or Rin?
>>
>>101362398
Mana stat and Lancelot death are proof of it.
>>
>>101362424
Rin is the most combat capable though Ilya and Sakura have higher prana output.
>>
>>101362424
Trick question, it's Shirou, nigga doesn't even need a Servant to kill bitches
>>
>>101362424
Rin is. Sakura could be stronger but she has worms eating her mana.
>>
>>101362269
There are different tiers of Mad Enhancement, son.
>>
>>101362497
You have no proof that his Mana stat would be higher with a better master, rather than it being his own low capacity.

And he died because he ran out of juice, yes, but that never meant he wasn't getting enough of it.
>>
>>101362424
Rin. She's been training most of her life for the war after all
>>
>>101362623
He has to retreat all the time because Kariya wasn't good enough to let him keep fighitng.
>>
>>101362590
No, it was never one. Saber notes as much, Ilya just sealed away Berserker's speech and rational thought out of spite.
>>
>>101362707
No, he retreated whenever he got his shit kicked in.
>>
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>>101362581

That's not how it works. Zouken has been training Sakura's body to produce a maximum amount of prana for her Grail War performance.

I swear, do you Nasu-casuals even read the source material or do you just pretend after watching the Fate anime and shitpost?

Every thread is filled with assholes who don't know how anything works in Nasuverse and pretend like they do.
>>
>>101361616
>Sword that can block anything

What is that a part of Arondight's passive buff?

I thought the knight's weapon mastery skill was the perfect counter to Gate of Babylon, even a better counter than UBW.
>>
>>101362775
You are telling me he can't keep going after receiving hits that aren't even close to lethal?
>>
>>101362840
Arondight is unbreakable, none of his other weapons are.

Also, Eternal Arms Mastery isn't that good since it only worked thanks to his high stats.
>Lancelot being able to put up a good fight against Gilgamesh was the result of his abilities being boosted by Mad Enhancement
>>
>>101360070
You only discounted them because they lead to thousands of deaths for reasons you agree with. Fucking peasant.
>>
>>101360070
Don't you have a grail to be stuck in angry manjew?
>>
>>101362880
Getting overrun by Rider's chariot and getting shot by GoB is pretty much the definition of getting his shit kicked in.
>>
>>101363103
And why did he get hit both times? Kariya not being able to be a proper master
>>
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>>101360070
What about the Servants that were authors?
>>
>>101363219
You're pretty incredible, I'll admit that.
>>
>>101355944
People on /a/ hate Saber because she's popular. You used to be able to get banned for insulting her back in the day.
>>
>>101363219
He'd eventually get overwhelmed by GoB, regardless.
>>
>>101362838
>after watching the Fate anime and shitpost?
Last time I remember watching DEEN/Stay Night it was when Unlimited Blade Works was still getting translated.
>>
>>101363256
Faggots.

Both of them.
>>
>>101357076
It creates an arena where all things she desires can come before her, all advantages become hers if she desires, and even faster than light travel isn't difficult to dream of inside the realm of the Emperor.

Of course it's powerful, and not just because she's Nero
>>
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>>101363438
What makes you think Lancelot with much higher stats and a Jet can't do what Iskandar did.
>>
>>101363788
Gil rapes Lancelot, we've been through this before.
>>
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>>101363533
If I had a love life as shit as Andersen's I'd probably go gay and spit on women too.
>>
>>101363896
Nice argument. Expected from a Gilfag.
>>
>>101359529
>True Assassin actually managed to assassinate Medea.

He killed Kuzuki while she could do nothing in that moment, but it was Saber that killed Caster and Zouken that stole her corpse.

However upon reading back it really is obvious that Assassin is the one that killed her master and she just commits suicide by fighting Saber out of grief
>>
>>101363701
Except when she has a headache. Pfft, women, right?
>>
>>101363788
Iskandar got that close because Gil let him get that close.

A jet is not Lancelot's standard equipment.
>>
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>>101363976
Novels, Complete Material and Nasu agree. Cry more.
>>
>>101364090
Lancelot standard equipment is anything he can get his hands on, from a jet to a nuclear bomb, that's his NP. Since when is letting him get close showering him with NPs?
>>
>>101363701
Was the ftl even her own ability? I mean Archer and Caster did it as well with their origin power ups.
>>
>>101363976
The only thing that can trump Gilgamesh is the power of love.
>>
>>101364298
>>101363701
Iirc Nero says that was the origin thingy. Let's see...

>That power―――
>Power of the same order as mine.
>―――What baseness.
>Yes, it was like cheating!
>The surge of power was far beyond Imperial Privilege! (literally: Imperial Privilege has a long way to catch up)
>>
>>101364383
It's more like women, children and fakers.
>>
>>101364298
It wasn't just the origin, everyone bullshitted their own reason how they were able to make it across the universe like that.

Gilgamesh just says "Hah, I happen to have an NP in my vault that does exactly that" when asked from the sound of things, and Tamamo says it was the power of love.

>>101364394
I think that was what she said when going up against BB, isn't it?
>>
>>101364383
The only thing that can trump Lancelot is having a shit Master than can't control him and give him enough prana.
>>
>>101364177
I'm pretty sure all of those had a counterargument so far.
>>
>>101364474
>>101364551
>Lancelotfags shitting up the thread

LE GALAHAD FACE
>>
>>101364465
So it was the origin power up?
>>
>>101364200
Are you that dense? It's flagrantly clear that Gilgamesh could have bound Iskandar at any moment at that point. The narrative takes pains to emphasize how calm Gil.

You're trying to make up a scenario wherein every factor is in Lancelot's favor. He doesn't come with a jet.
>>
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>>101364574
>Gilgafags being unable to find a good argument
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>>101364474

You do realize that if he got anywhere near Medusa and she wasn't holding back and unleashed Cybele he'd be petrified instantly, right?
>>
>>101364551
None of which hold any worth.
>>
>>101364684
Reminder that Lancelot has no divinity, Enkidu doesn't work on him.
>>
>>101364624
I know your servant brags about Origin powers while fighting BB, and gives the same wording "What baseness, power of the same magnitude as mine". However I was pretty sure it was Kiara who sent your servant across the universe while each servant came back giving a different explanation about how they got back in time for each.

Origin was definite for BB
>>
>>101364465
Yeah, she says the Origin mythical wear is far better than her Imperial Privilege.
>>
>>101364474
Gil can sword spam him to death, Seiba can Excaliblast and Giles' tentacle monster.

5th HGW will wreck his ass except for Cu since luck stat to hit
>>
>>101364724
That's also part of his Master being shit and not giving him enough Mana.
>>
>>101364789
Also for no reason here's Gil's speech to Mooncell, or at least part of it.


>“Ha―――-hahahahahahaha!
>Immature planet, he says!
>Truly, what astounding gall coming from a mongrel!

>But very good, it is indeed the truth!
>Though the planet nears its final years,
>the history of humanity is yet in its youth.

>After all, it produced that brazen fool there.
>It certainly cannot be anywhere close to adulthood.

>The slothful humans
>have yet to become capable of proving their worth.
>Thus―――-the time of judgment is not now.

>In the first place, how farcical for the observer of
>some rock to debate the law of the universe!
>It is you who should tone down your impudence.”

>“I speak of genesis.
>The elements intermix, coalesce,
>and bring forth the stars that forge all of creation.

>Know now the apex of the Truth.
>I shall show you that which I acknowledge as truly golden.
>The hidden prototype.

>Now―――
>sing its praises in your death throes, foul noise......!”


“That power―――
Power of the same order as mine.
―――What baseness.”

>“Indeed.
>Not even on the verge of death
>would the king show his primordial form.

>“However, this is a sovereign rite that my mongrel
>had put his life on the line to perform.
>Who but I will answer his offering?”

>“If the malice enveloping this place
>is that of all the world, that is most convenient.
>Heed this, all those that be.
   
>“This man is my contractee.
>Know that you will never lay a finger on
>Kishinami Hakuno without my permission!”
>>
>>101364474
Just stop.
>>
>>101364852
Which you can't prove.
>>
>>101364780
it still works extremely well it just works better on Divines. Herc breaking through was just crazy though
>>
>>101364852

Berserkers take the prana they need from their Masters forcefully, which is why the Masters tend to die from it. It doesn't matter if Kariya was a terrible master, Lancelot was at full strength due to stealing his life force.

If Lancelot was ever suffering from a scarcity of prana, he wouldn't have been able to fight Saber, let alone Gilgamesh.
>>
>>101364913
Saber with Shirou, Gil with Kotomine.
>>
>>101364951
It's just a plain metal chain on anything without divinity, but for those with divinity it grows in strength exponentially for each rank.
>>
>>101364951
Lancelot stats are on par with Heracles, he can break the chains with no effort.
>>
>>101364994
Once again, that you cannot prove that Kariya was unable to supply enough prana.
>>
>>101364780
Missing the point entirely.

Iskandar got within range of Gilgamesh because he had it under control. Lancelot wouldn't get the same treatment.
>>
>>101364993
He was only able to fight for 10 seconds against Saber.
>>
>>101364852
The whole reason why Kariya was dying was because Bahsaka was forcefully drawing out prana from him. So yes, he did have enough prana until the point he stopped while fighting Saber.
>>
>>101365127
He only had to retreat because he took the front end of Zeus divine bulls which are said that each hoof strike or lightning bolt from them is equal to an attack from Saber or Lancer using all of their power. Like a normal prana infused strike with all their might, not like an NP going all out kind of strike.
>>
>>101365071
Read
>>101362707
>>101363219
>>101362497
>>
>>101365277
Still not proving shit. Lancelot got run over by an A+ NP and the the second time Gil combo'd the shit out of him as payback for the flares.
>>
>>101365260
A endurance, he also took a sword to the face and nothing happened.
>>
>>101364994

Except nowhere does it say that Lancelot was not at full stats at any given time. You can try to infer it, but there is nothing anywhere that explicitly states it. In fact, it's outright absurd to believe that he was not at full power, because Servants are almost entirely incapable of demonstrating high stats with low prana. The lower your prana becomes, the weaker and closer to death you are. Lancelot was 100% all the way up until Kariya died and his prana supply was completely cut off and had no anchor left to keep him in the world in the form of a Master.
>>
>>101365430
> the bulls and the chariot travel atop lightning strikes, manifestations of Zeus, allowing it to also move through the air by traveling on the lightning. They create thunderous sounds and webs of lightning with each "stomp" as they travel, and each lightning strike generates the amount of prana Saber or Lancer would use in an attack that utilized every ounce of their strength.

Taking the front end up Alexander's fuck up wheels will disable almost any servant outright. Not to mention you have to take the strike eight times in a row for every hoof trampling you, which is why Alexander was surprised he was still alive.
>>
>>101365466
Plus he was sustained by Sakura's virginity worm
>>
>>101365430
Saber Alter had A endurance and she got taken down by a C-rank NP.
>>
>>101365530
>The true Noble Phantasm is the actual trampling attack used by the chariot, Via Expugnatio: Distant Trampling Domination (遥かなる蹂躙制覇ヴィア・エクスプグナティオ, Haruka Naru Juurin Seiha?). The damage is decided by two factors, damage from the eight strikes from the hooves of the bulls and the damage from being struck by the wheels of the chariot, with both physical damage and the effects of the lightning strikes taking effect with each attack roll. If the target is not strong enough and fails a strength check, additional damage will also be dealt. The basic attack was enough to easily cripple Berserker, and the power rises even more significantly after Rider calls out its true name. Its speed is also very significant, reducing a distance of one hundred meters to zero the instant after its activation, almost matching the speed with which Excalibur is activated. Waver compares its destructive power to that of a strategic bomber, predicting that it can easily turn the entire Shinto area into scorched earth if Rider was allowed to go on a rampage for less than an hour
>>
So Lancelot basically wins if he's given a fighter jet he isn't packaged with, the perfect master available, and opponents that let him waltz up to them as though he were a non-issue.

That's some shit.
>>
>>101365633
Gilgamesh had a monster of a Master in the second war, his stats were higher than with Kotomine.
>>
>>101365735
Gilgamesh has a worse Master in Fate/Extra and he still wins
>>
>>101365735
I wasn't aware Gil was in the second war.
>>
>>101365735
Gil's stats really don't affect his performance. He doesn't fight in melee, he doesn't need a lot of prana unless he's using Ea and he sure as hell doesn't need to worry about support with his Independant Action.
>>
>>101365633

Lancelot is a high power fighter with very few penalties for being summoned as a Berserker and a lot of bonuses. He fits the Berserker class definition of the Servant that is the strongest in a straight fight. He can even disguise himself or use a variety of different weapons thanks to his Noble Phantasms. On top of all of that, he has a powerful sword with a rating equal to Excalibur itself.

He is certainly a powerful Servant, but he is not without weaknesses. He lacks special effects, such as Gae Bolg's close range activation. He has low resistance to magic. He loses some of his mental faculties as a Berserker, and a dumber fighter is a fighter that is easier to trick. His greatest enemy is an opponent like Lancer (F/SN) who can fight him for a long time and let his own prana costs destroy his Master, or use a special effect Noble Phantasm to attain instant victory in a certain circumstance (Gae Bolg, for example).
>>
>>101365869
Third*
>>
>>101365809
>Gilgamesh has a worse Master in Fate/Extra and he still wins

Actually due to compatibility his stats were the same as when he was under Tokiomi, if not eventually higher. MC may not seem like much, but his stupid recklessness and willfulness was eventually able to win Gil over just a touch to the point that he saw him as something amusing.
>>
>>101365961
In terms of master ability at least, Gilgamesh found Tokiomi to be boring shit while the stupid fumbling around of this new kid was at least able to hold his interest. In terms of master potential and compatibility he is a bit higher, if you interpret master potential as something other than just battle ability.
>>
>>101365960
Gil was in the third war?
>>
Gil's stats in CCC were just all around unfair in comparison.

"Cheat character", indeed.
>>
>>101365960
F/Z is the fourth grail war. The third war was the one with head exploding midget Hassan and twin Sabers and Angry Manjew.
>>
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>>101366191
It's Lancer that's the unfair one there
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>>101366194
And the Nazis running around along with the Imperial Japanese Army.

Complete and utter Fucking Chaos, that war.

Oh and one of the Edelfelt's got NTR'd by a Tohsaka, I think.
>>
>>101366180
>>101366194
You get the point
>>
>>101359529
Li Shuwen more or less ensures that you're going to be fucked by crippling and slowly killing your servant.

The only thing that saves you in that scenario is Rin/Rani boning your servant back to full mp.
>>
>>101366364
Against any other servant his move is supposed to be instant kill, it's just that your servant was good enough to dodge it enough so that it only 90% fucked them to death.
>>
>>101366281
True, but her skills weren't as good.
>>
>>101366364
I still don't get why they couldn't just bone their own master.

Fucking NTR, man.

At least a threesome? Shit fuck, what a drag.
>>
>>101366457
plus shes a temp so a boost just a little insurance you don't fuck yourself over. I wish Cu Lancer was playable very much though
>>
>>101366525
I liked it, because I got to punish Rin with a Jackhammering.
>>
>>101366323
I'd buy the shit out of 3rd war.
>>
>>101365633
Lancelot being so versatile needs a Master like Batman to reach his full potential.
>>
>>101359372
Pretty much every every case of Herakles and Cu being incompetent is a matter of Ilya (and the Einzberns) and Kotomine fucking it up.

I mean the Einzberns have never had any good idea anyway, and Kotomine just wants to fuck with shit and hopefully summon satan if he can.

Really summoning not!Satan was a stupid idea in the third war, and summoning Herakles as a fucking Berserker where Noble Phantasms matter way more than brute strength was an even dumber one.
>>
>>101366525
You could have, but Rin didn't feel like explaining how that shit works to you since magic sex is complicated. Since CCC takes place before that point in Extra I guess, you do have a second chance to bone them first there before Rin claims her mark?
>>
>>101366364

Li Shuwen is the best servant in the series.
>>
>>101366559
Would have been awesome, though his NP would have been somewhat lackluster given how it's based on enemy luck.

Fights would boil down to "spam Gae Bolg until it fucking hits".
>>
>>101366625

*Best Assassin, fuck!
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>>101366625
My sub-Saharan sibling. I wish he was a playable Servant.
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>>101366637
It's the reason why Rin always uses a command code to boost his luck before using it.
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>>101366615
Rin? Who said anything about Rin?
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>>101366637

He has his Anti Army one, and his Runes, they could cook something up.
>>
>>101366637
just make it EA except at 1/4 health instead of 1/3
with it doing extreme damage to servants immune to that stuff
>>
>>101366637

I wonder how it feels to have your heart obliterated so fast you can still walk for about 3 seconds before dying, before you even fall down you're technically a zombie.
>>
It is clear that the vast majority of people in this thread have no idea how Nasuverse mechanics works, or based their "knowledge" of it on what other people told them or mistranslations/misinterpretation.
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>>101366783
>>101366763
Shit, it really could work well, too.

Fuck, now I really want it.
>>
>>101365466
I'd believe this, but didn't Archer get weaker and weaker? Like in UBW, his final shot on Gilg was a regular arrow, not a noble phantasm
>>
>>101366968
Archer has Independant Action.
>>
>>101366968
He was also trying to fight off the grail eating him and manifest Enkidu at the same time.

His prana was probably stretched pretty thin
>>
>>101366883

The next Fate/Extra should include Master combat alongside the Servants, and then include the Anti-master class, assassin.
>>
>>101366968
>Independent Action: B
>Normally if a Servant loses his Master, he will disappear within hours if he cannot replenish the mana required to remain in this world. The amount of time each Heroic Spirit has before disappearing varies, but Emiya can remain in this world for 2 days due to Rank B Independent Action. However, this is the ideal value achieved by maximally conserving mana and avoiding battle and Noble Phantasm usage.
>In UBW route, Emiya’s Master switched from Rin to Medea, and after Medea’s death, he continued to operate independently and battled Emiya Shirou. Through all these events, one is able to recognise Emiya’s ability to survive alone. In addition, even if Emiya’s spiritual core sustained lethal damage, he can still survive for a short period. This ability is the reason why Emiya is able to secretly observe Shirou and gang’s battle as a spiritual body after being defeated by Shirou. In addition, after the battle between Shirou and Gilgamesh had concluded at Ryudo Temple, Emiya appeared in front of Gilgamesh as he attempted to pull Shirou into the darkness. He shot an arrow between the eyes of Gilgamesh and sent him alone into the darkness. The arrow shot at that time was a regular arrow, and from the fact that Emiya gradually began to disappear after this attack, this is probably the limit of Emiya’s materialisation.
>>
>>101366968
Archer was destroyed into spirit form, without a master and spent almost all of his prana fighting Shirou. Probably the only reason he could have lasted that long was that he went into town and ate 50 people.
>>
>>101366703

Assassins are always better from outside the fucking confines of always being Hassan.
>>
Complete Materials makes for some occasional nice reading.

>Clairvoyance: C
>The visual ability that is also called “Eagle Eye”. This is a must-have ability of the Archer Class. It is also frequently used during scouting. Simply looking from a high location is sufficient to fully survey the town and search for enemies. In addition, Clairvoyance will affect the accuracy of bows. Also worth mentioning is that, as Emiya readies his bow, he will be able to precisely snipe even enemies moving at high speeds as long as they are within a 4km range.
>Archer, who possesses Clairvoyance, is able to execute “ultra long-range sniping” with accuracy transcending the realm of men.


>Thaumaturgy: C-
>During his life time, the sorceries learned by Emiya are unremarkable. Before becoming a Heroic Spirit, even “reinforcement” was quite difficult. However, the “projection” sorcery he wields is quite special, as it is able to duplicate weapons, including all the components, to near perfection. In addition, during duplication, he can even read the wielder’s skills, which allows him to gain all kinds of Noble Phantasms and combat skills.
>During his life time, Emiya used the preliminary step of projection – “structural analysis”, to find the location of an item’s fault and proceed with repair.


>Eye of the Mind (True): B
>A danger-avoidance ability that utilises the intelligence collected up to the current time as the basis, in order to predict the opponent’s activity and change the current situation. This is not a result of talent, but an overwhelming amount of combat experience. A weapon wielded by none other than a mortal, gained through tenacious training. Using Eye of the Mind, Emiya was able to successfully counter Cú Chulainn’s thrusts that were invisible to the eye.
>Even with Rank B Eye of the Mind (True), Emiya was unable to see through Emiya Shirou’s passion-infused strike which put “ideal” on the line.
>>
>>101367536
>Even with Rank B Eye of the Mind (True), Emiya was unable to see through Emiya Shirou’s passion-infused strike which put “ideal” on the line.
Ah, the inherit weakness of all Tsundere. Just put your heart into it and take him head on and you'll win!
>>
>>101366637
So I'm really not the only one who wants Cu as a servant?
>>
>>101367829
Currently you are because the rest all died horrible deaths.
>>
>>101367829
I doubt it. I know I'd much rather have him than Gilgamesh in CCC. Even if picking him always resulted in an unavoidable bad end.
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Best Lancer with the best luck
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>>101367829
Course not, Lancer's awesome.
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Zhao Yun or Yukimura Sanada for Lancer next, please.
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>>101367956
Whenever I think about the difference between Lizzie and the other Lancers luck, I always imagine her standing on top of a giant B while laughing at them and calling them luckless pigs.
>>
>>101367956

Imagine actually pumping Luck instead of Skill or Attack in Fate/Extra as Lancer, possibly the only time Luck as a stat has ever been purposefully increased in an RPG.
>>
>>101365945
Note that Arondight or other similar stat buffs cannot boost your stats past rank A,

The "+" modifiers are something INNATE to certain servants/Noble Phantasm that allows the Servant to increase the effectiveness TEMPORARILY by one fold for each "+" modifiers in certain circumstances. They typically can't be obtained any other way unless you hack the system.

So Lancelot wouldn't get much bonus if he is stacked with a good Madness Enchantment level and Arondight buff. (But the ME buff is still useful since it buffs his stats enough for him to have a much easier time of finding NPs to use without pulling out his own NP).
Do note that his possession of foreign NP doesn't last forever, it is the reason why he didn't get to keep Gilgamesh's NP and went for a telephone pole to attack Saber.
>>
>>101368553
Lancelot combat ability did get boosted while using Arondight. And all of his stats are already A so I'm sure he went past A during those 10 seconds.
>>
>>101368854
The you need to stop taking part in these discussions because you have no idea what you are talking about.

Rank A is the highest stats can go up to.
>>
>>101368854
That's just Arondight activating and extending the duration of Lancelot's "+" bonus. And it also gained damage from increase in magic stats.
>>
>>101369156
B-but what about EX?
>>
Why is Taiga in almost everything Fate related?
She's only ever in a handful of scenes, she's never important the the plot, she has very little sex appeal and she's unpopular.
I just don't get it.
>>
>>101369408
EX ranks are simply something that cannot be measured by any specific standards, either due to it's variability or unlimited cap and other factors.
>>
>>101369408
EX is not part of the ranking scale. That's why they are EX. They cannot be classified by powerlevels.
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>>101369506
Utter lies.

Taiga best. Taiga Strong!
>>
>>101368553
Gawain's stats triple because of Numeral of the Saint, yet his stats are already A rank all around. Some people say "Well then of course his stats don't go up at all, since you cant' go beyond A rank" but we all know that can't be right.

After all while he has the effect of Numeral he's literally untouchable under the Sun, and that doesn't indicate no bonus.
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>>101369666
>triple
So ++?

What's the problem?
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>>101369506
She was the true final boss of CCC.
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>>101369752
Previous conversations have said befallen such things, it's just a point of digression when the system itself is left vague at times.
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>>101369666
All the skill said was that it increases one's power by three fold, it didn't say anything about increasing the 'ranks'. Therefore it is highly likely it is simply the effect of the "+" modifier being granted like how Gae Bolg could have a "+" in the thrown version.
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>>101370335

she's so tiny and hungry and strong. <3
>>
>>101369506
Taiga is an extention TYPE MARS. An extra dimensional life form that has taken the wish of the dying Earth to an unprecedented extreme. It has begun placing an anchor (A copy of Taiga) in every single conceivable earth in the multiverse. Upon achieving said feet, it will detonate each Anchor, creating a massive black hole that will swallow each earth and reduce them to nothing, allow no possible chance of escape for any lifeform on Earth. As it does not understand the concept of futility or time, it is unable to realize that since the multiverse is infinite that it will never be able to place an "anchor" on every Earth and destroy them all as more keep being created into infinity. Thus it engages in a truly futile endeavor while causing the existence of Taiga to appear on every Earth
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>>101370509
Caster, pls.
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>>101370509
"If we focus on the napping part, she wears a cute lion kigurumi pajamas and becomes a cute character."
- Lancer
>>
>>101370509
Go away Medea.
>>
>>101370658
Why is it that about half the participants in the HGW always end up falling in love with Saber?
>>
>>101370566
That's worse than the 'Mind of Tiger' theory.
>>
>>101362838
>That's not how it works. Zouken has been training Sakura's body to produce a maximum amount of prana for her Grail War performance.

>I swear, do you Nasu-casuals even read the source material

Do you? Zouken had no plans of getting Sakura involved at all, he intended to use her to breed a stronger heir. He says it very clearly: he just saw a possibility at the last minute and decided to jump in.

She spends so much time bedridden before the Shadow starts chomping on Servants precisely because she's extremely low on energy due to the worms draining her.
>>
>>101370811
It's far more than half
>>
>>101370811
Charisma: B
>>
>>101370838
I reread the route recently, and you're off on the second point there. They thought it was the worm fucking her up, but it turned out later on that she was just always fucked up because Angya needed more and more energy like an infant in the womb, in combination with the fact that her body was not readily made to be able to handle heroic spirits at all but she was still sane even after like five of them and Gilgamesh.

She was in bed ever since Caster died early on as that took a huge toll on her as more and more servants died. Zouken has this whole speech when he calls Shirou to his house that one time with True Assassin as he tells Shirou he actually hasn't been activating the worm at all since the start. Although Kotomine did note that almost everything Zouken said was true, he also noted that Zouken left a lot of shit out on purpose in order to use people for his own ends.

We know he was just trying to use Shirou there to turn against Sakura, but everything he said was basically correct. Sakura was mostly fucked up due to being a grail, but they thought it was just the worm at first since that's all they knew until the eleventh day.
>>
>>101371154
Ilya had Archer.
>>
>>101371205
Gilgamesh basically filled the grail by himself

We know he's worth at least five servants anyway; since Berserker, Rider, Assassin, Saber, and maybe Archer were still outside of her grail.
>>
>>101370811

If I was Saber, I'd let Caster do with me whatever she wants. I don't think what Caster does to Saber in UBW was entirely unpleasant from her POV.
>>
>>101368286
Well, she is the only Lancer that isn't confirmed to have died during a grail war, so yeah.

Her stats are also through the roof, I'm sure she can give Cu a run for his money.
>>
>>101371702
Karna also won big in CCC, or at least he accomplished his shit in the end while saving his master. If I recall it was questionable if he died since we don't really see it.
>>
>>101371615
I'd rather be Caster so I can have a personal dress up doll.
>>
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>>101371615
>>
>>101371702
As a Berserker her stats are pretty much on pair with most of the other berserkers and she retains her sanity because ME is E-
>>
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>>101371615
>king arthur
>>
>>101371875

Oh come on Saber, you know you loved it, when she rubbed her hands all over you and dressed you up so you looked pretty.

Caster made you feel like a Sexy Woman.
>>
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>>101371985
>Can't feel pain.
>A rank magic resistance.
>NP produces enough sound to bring down the Tokyo Dome.
Berserker Lizzie sounds scary to go up against.
>>
>>101371848

>It turns out Caster is the Kawaii one
>>
>>101372243
Who wouldn't trust that smile?
>>
>>101372243
Also forget the fact that her NP should never be combined with Nero's NP.
>>
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>>101372216
Craven cur, heed my blade as you perish.
>>
>>101372518
Would you prefer to fuck your sister than let Medea dress you up?
>>
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He was decent, but everyone knows Gil was best servant.
>>
>>101372648
of course saber would rather fuck her sister! They had a lewd homonculus baby and everything.
>>
>>101372790

Why do I get the feeling this Saber is going to tell a Teacher to fuck off and go smoke in the toilets?
>>
>>101372648
Death is preferable to your machinations, rampallian.
>>
>>101372893
>delinquent Saber
This is something I cannot comprehend.
>>
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>>101372497
I really do want to know what would happen. Skit for Carnival Phantasm 2 please.
>>
Is this show worth it?
>>
>>101372943
Could be Mordred since she could pull off a delinquent Saber and rape her dad's wife
>>
>>101372943
Moedred's has daddy issues and authority issues so it's perfectly natural that she'd be the defiant type.

Also, how many Saber pictures does Tusia churn out?
>>
>>101372497
The unholy Golden Theater combined with the unholy voice of the wannabe idol, of course this combination of unholy concert is something no man need witness.

http://pastebin.com/4VKh5Xvn
>>
>>101372905

If Shirou and Run arrived a day or two later, Caster would have been licking your discharge of her gloved fingers.
>>
>>101373264

*Rin
>>
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>>101372905
Hey dad, mom wants you in her room, she's in some weird clothes that makes her almost naked
>>
>>101373739
Go to your room, son.
>>
>>101373739
No, no. You've got it the wrong way.
>>
>>101374168
Nope in Mordred's flashback she still prefers Morgan as her mother
>>
>>101374281
Well yes, but that's before the adoption and food.
>>
>>101374401
Mordred's wife is either Rin or Guinevere
>>
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>>101349318
This.

Gilgamesh rarely fights seriously against anyone which was his undoing against Shirou.

Gil took off the gloves against Iskandar from the very beginning. That's just how high Gil think of the King of Conquerors.

When you get the strongest and most proud and vain of warriors to recognize your awesomeness enough to consider you a worthy oppnent, you know you're a true Badass.

Iskandar rise, lived and feel like the greatest.
>>
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>>101374512
Mordred already has someone though.
>>
>>101374548

If Rider's Kingdom existed in Saber's time somehow, he would have tried to subjugate Saber's wouldn't he?
>>
>>101374916

Always trying to get at her Father with petty flings, she's gunna' get grounded again.
>>
>>101375124
I'd say that the knights of the round table would have been able to match Iskander's armies, when united.
>>
>>101375247

Oh he'd get his shit pushed in hard, but I reckon he'd still try.

God help whoever faces Saber's army with the KOTR leading the charge, as well as Saber herself, they're going to get rekt.
>>
>>101349318
>Ea at full power

LOL you didn't read F/HA did you?
>>
>>101375327
It's stated that there are people in his army stronger than even him, but that might just be postmortem.
>>
Him and Waver are a great duo.
>>
>>101375327
The best part would be when he tries to convince the knights to join his armies.

>FZ material:
Nasu: But, I was moved to tears by that last conversation with Lancelot. Nobody was at fault… Nobody was to blame!
Urobuchi: I think that’s the most heartbreaking thing about it, though.
Nasu: Ah, it really is.
Urobuchi: The scene would have been totally ruined if Alexander had barged in, huh?
Nasu: That’s Dead Weight Alex for you, lol
 He’d start his lecture with something like “Well, be that as it may…”.
Urobuchi: Sounds like something out of Hana no Keiji.
Nasu: Then, “It’s all your fault!” “And also, it’s your fault too!”
 “So, become my subordinates!”
Urobuchi: That’s exactly what he’d say!
Nasu: Of course, their response would be “What the hell is this guy going on about!?"
Urobuchi: Right, it’d be a total negotiation failure.
Nasu: And Alex would just tilt his head to the side and wonder, “Hmm, did things go poorly?”
>>
>>101375411

Then how did he convince them to join under HIS rule?

Does Saber have her raw strength as a Human?
>>
>>101375487
Because he's very charismatic, it only requires them to swear the oath to serve him to join his immortal army.

>Fate/Zero Anime Visual Guide I: There are a few Heroic Spirits among the King's Army that are even stronger than the King of Conquerors. However, due to the limit of the King of Conquerors abilities, he was unable to materialize their Noble Phantasms.("そんな中でも、「王の軍勢の中には征服王本人よりも強い英霊がちらほらいる」
「でも征服王の能力に限界があるので宝具までは具現化できない」など
小ネタもでてきたりで、楽しんで読めました。")
>>
>>101375481
>Nobody was at fault… Nobody was to blame!

Mmmmmmyeah, but in a more real sense, it was Lancelots fault.

Maybe not in the unique circumstances of the Fate universe, but definitely in the normal Arthurian legends. Though even in the Fate universe, I still think he overstepped his mark whether Saber was fine with it or not.
>>
>>101375487
Saber was probably all B or all A stats in life.
>>
>>101375487
Heroic Spirits tend to be stronger than they were as a servant, since the servant is only a fraction

The only exception is Saber Alter who is stated to be even stronger than in life
>>
>>101375672
Saber Alter is only more powerful, I wouldn't say she's stronger when she's lost most of her speed, agility, luck, instincts and finesse.

Also, some heroic spirits with low stats are probably stronger all around as Servants, since the passive boosts are good too.
>>
>>101375883

Like all Casters (that are not Tamano)?
>>
>>101375883
Stats don't mean shit when noble phantasms are broken as fuck.
>>
>>101375989
Yeah.

I'd argue EMIYA as well, though since he probably likes having a sturdier body than he had in life.
>>
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>>101373174
for a psychopath I find her very bute
>>
>>101376053
In that sense, Fate Saber with Avalon can beat Alter.
>>
>>101375411
It isn't exactly hard to be stronger than Alexander.

Only after he died, did he even get a semi Reality Marble which he didn't have when he was alive.

And he doesn't really have any close combat weapon that is famous or legendary so a one-on-one battle is actually to Alexander's disadvantage.
>>
>>101376124
It depends on compatibility. Avalon is a shitty NP that does pretty much nothing so no in this case Fate Saber will not win.
>>
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>>101375233
i think this one's a keeper
he's a necromancer with a sawn-off that shoots out skeletons
>>
>>101375883
A full heroic spirit is something that can't be contained by the Fuyuki Grail, which is why they are summoned into molds called classes in order to make it actually doable by summoning a maintainable fraction of them. This is one of the basics there, and the true heroic spirit in addition to most likely being stronger would have access to all they had in life rather than just one or two items.

>>101376124
Unlimited mana and near unlimited healing almost makes Alter unstoppable. Even against her normal self she could have a hard time against self-regeneration and the other attributes given to her by Shadow.
>>
>Waver will always continue to serve Iskandir in his army.
There was never a better love story told in the history of mankind
>>
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>>101376091
It's not her fault, no one told Lizzie that peasants and serfs count as people.
>>
>>101376259
>>101376301
Same tactic as against Gil. Avalon gives Saber a boost to mana and a passive regen.

Lure into Excalibur, i-frame through, blast away.
>>
>>101375247
Alexander's army only had quantity not quality.

The only opponents they faced were onlyhumans as well while the Knights of the Round Table have faced witches, monsters, demons, dragons, etc
>>
>>101376408
Gil got fucked over because Ea wouldn't stop spinning so he couldn't do anything. He would have won if he just blasted Saber with GOB as she came out of Avalon.
>>
>>101376408
Alter knows about Avalon so that trick won't fly so much, blasting away won't work as well against someone who can recover from it in almost every case aside from an absolutely fatal hit to the spiritual core since infinite mana means any other injury can be healed by throwing enough energy at it, it was never really stated if Avalon requires much mana from Saber since there should be no such thing as a perfect NP here, and still that shit just won't work quite as well in this case since against Gil it was something he couldn't see coming.
>>
>>101376259
It passively boosts her Mana stat so she can go from barely being able to fire one Excalibur to firing several without issue. It also heals her without draining mana and can heal pretty much anything, regardless of curses and such.

Deploying it costs nothing and gives her a free ignore-one-attack and even if the enemy knows about it, there isn't much they can do.

Shitty, my ass.
>>
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>>101376544
>>
>>101376541
Even if she knows about it, she can't rely on just Excaliblasting since Saber can just Avalon through those.
>>
>>101375124
Alexander would have gotten his shit wrecked by the Romans
>>
>>101371848
What would happen if Caster gets a hold of Len?

She's looks like a mini Caster.
>>
>>101376604
Non-canon shit.

Or is Rin solo-ing the war canon as well?
>>
>>101376544
Pretty sure being full on semen was more effective than the passive mana boost. Passive healing is useless when you're slashed in half and get your vitals destroyed.

Being inside Avalon means you can't do anything either.

Yes. It is shitty.
>>
>>101376717
Depends on if she has Zelretch Blade

It probably gives her some slight chance against most servants.
>>
>>101376664
All she has to do is hold her blade out and wait for Arthur to come out of Avalon and be cut in half, since she can't do shit as long as she's in Avalon.

Just hold the blade where she needs to re-materialize and she can't return.
>>
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>powerlevel bullshit

EVERY FUCKING FATE THREAD
>>
>>101376737
The healing is superior to Alters, since only destroying the brain will kill her. Saber got hit by Ea and survived.

And freely being able to ignore damage is useless? Have you ever played any fighting games with i-frames? Do you even understand how decisive an advantage it fucking is, being able to ignore one attack and then placing your own right after?
>>
http://yaraon.blog109.fc2.com/blog-entry-21637.html
What's it say, anons?
>>
>>101376827
So she gets right in her range and plunges her sword through Alter before Alter can swing.
>>
>>101376920
>Healing superior to Alters
Alter got cut in half by Shirou and still survived. Discussing healing is a moot point since no one is stupid enough to not finish someone off with a fatal blow.

>Saber got hit by Ea and survived
Surviving a cyclone bullshit proves nothing. Even Shirou survived that. I'd like to see her survive an Enuma Elish.

>Freely ignore damage the placing your own after
You can't do anything in Avalon and you're a sitting duck as you come out.
>>
>>101376932
Nothing of interest. It's just a post for people to speculate on what route the adaptation is going to end up being.
>>
>>101376985
They have the same speed value and Alter would see it coming ahead of time since Avalon is her own ability here, and SPD stat has been confirmed to be more DXT already in Fate. It's not raw speed but more dexterity and other attributes like that.

Alter didn't lose speed upon changing, and depending on how you look at it she lost a bit of skill at the blade at most due to rage. They both have regen, unlike Gilgamesh Alter knows how her own abilities work and wouldn't be caught with her pants down, and she knows how to counter it.
>>
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>>101376920
Only the brain or heart can kill Alter as well, and Arthur survived against Ea even before she got Avalon.

Just look at her surviving that shit just fine.
>>
>>101377135
>Alter got cut in half by Shirou and still survived. Discussing healing is a moot point since no one is stupid enough to not finish someone off with a fatal blow.
I'm just saying Alter won't win by attrition.

>Surviving a cyclone bullshit proves nothing. Even Shirou survived that. I'd like to see her survive an Enuma Elish.
Which she did, with Avalon.

>You can't do anything in Avalon and you're a sitting duck as you come out.
Bullshit, it's not a "sit still and do nothing" block. Saber could ignore Ea freely and came out running with her sword ready.

Saber is faster, has better instincts and has the means to win.
>>
>>101376259
>Avalon is a shitty NP

It's THE most broken NP.
>>
>>101377163
Alter is one rank slower and has lowered Instinct. Plus, no Luck.

And she did lose speed, she couldn't keep up with Rider in Crazy Train, with Shirou in SLH and she was running much much slower than Berserker and Shirou during Nine Lives Revolver.

Hell, in F/UC she's slow as fuck, only being a slight bit faster than Sakura who has no dash.
>>
>>101377385
CCC is the most broken NP

Next up is Amitra

And also Angya Manyu(CCC)
>>
>>101377324
The heart can be healed, Shirou survived Gae Bolg.
>>
>>101377324
Saber got up in a matter of minutes with Avalon.
>>
>>101377503
As we discussed SPD is more dexterity, and the reason she couldn't keep up with Rider is because Rider is infinitely better with Sakura as her master so of course the Super Rider will run circles around Saber if they have the same master. We saw Shirou say that himself in the temple when Rider fought TA, Rider's improved speed is incomparable to previously as she dodges hundreds of Assassins blades without a single waste movement or ability to dodge projectiles..
>>
>>101377616
She got up in a matter of minutes there as well. Did you think she was down there for hours?
>>
How would Alter know Saber has Avalon? It should have been lost, thus she wouldn't know about it.

Also, Alter's style is pretty much a simplified version of Saber's usual style, since she's just hitting harder, so wouldn't Saber be the one with the advantage since she knows Alter's style just as well?
>>
>>101377385
>Gae Bolg
>Fragarach
>God Hand
>Tsubame Gaeshi (Not an NP but still broken as fuck)
>Ea

What are these?
>>
Anybody know of somewhere to find F/SN's effect CGs?

I can find a lot of the regular CGs, but I can't find the ones for when a Servant slashes their sword and stuff.
>>
>>101377697
There's a difference between "getting up and barely standing to hug Shirou" and "getting up and continuing to fight with Gil".

>>101377656
Yes, her dexterity is shot to hell, but she's also slower.
>>
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>>101377554
Fucking BB and her 3Dprinter bullshit.
>>
>>101377730
>block, can heal regular stabs
>block, can heal damage to heart
>almost as broken, has other superior applications like against Gil
>block, can heal damage
>block
>>
>>101351224
No, Shirou goes in to clean the bathroom and she's in there, and then she basically tells him "don't mind me" and he's trying not to look at her and stuff, and then she helps him by cleaning the floor with her hair or something.

Honestly I don't know moon so that was just my interpretation of the scene. But they don't fuck in that scene. They fuck in an optional post-game Eclipse scene.
>>
>>101377730

Aside from a full power EA and God Hand which isn't offensive, how can the others even touch Saber through Avalon?

Especially Tsubame Gaeshi.
>>
>>101377386
Did you not read the VN? The reason why Saber was able to run out and hit Gil was because Ea was still spinning after the discharge and Gil couldn't move until it stopped spinning. Nowhere in the VN does it say that Saber is faster than Alter. Agility means dexterity, not speed.
>>
>>101377972
You are forgetting that Saber cannot do anything in Avalon either. Tsubame Gaeshi would lop her head right off once she comes out.
>>
>>101377984
Because Saber and Alter never appear at the same time. But she is shown to be much slower in comparison to everyone else. Slow. Ass. Tank.

And tough shit with Gil. Alter thinks she can end the fight easily since she has superior capacity, Saber pulls Avalon unexpectedly and attacks the instant it ends. Saber wins.
>>
>>101377900
Can't block Ea so easily, and using Avalon is not blocking.

It's shifting the user to a parallel dimension so they can't be touched by anything on the current dimension basically, which is kind of different from using a shield.

Tsubame Gaeshi is unblockable by Saber's own words, she could only avoid fatal damage because Assassin's blade was bent and thus all three strikes could not take place properly. If Avalon is a trump card (it is) then Fragarach will always activate before she uses it and shoot out Saber's heart so she can never use it to begin with, as shown in Ataraxia. Doesn't matter how great your shield is compared to God Hand as well if you have no way of damaging the guy. Excalibur might be able to take out three or more lives, but if you fail to take even one life you're pretty much fucked from that point onward since there is no route forward anymore.
>>
>>101378093

Doesn't Avalon only transport her to Avalon if needed, other times it just outright blocks everything else.

That and I don't see Avalon being so incompetent it drops Saber right into the shit like that, in my mind, she dodges and fucks them up on the way out.
>>
>>101378108
>She is shown to be much slower
Are you high? Or are you just wanking at this point?
>>
>>101378093
You think she can't move while using Avalon, that she's frozen solid? Nigga you dumb.
>>
>>101378144
>Fragarach will always activate before she uses it and shoot out Saber's heart so she can never use it to begin with

Avalon transcends the 5 Magics, Fragarach isn't doing shit.
>>
>>101378224
Rider, Shirou, catching up to Berserker.

And F/UC which you seemed to use earlier, she's slow as fuck.
>>
>>101378235
She's in another fucking plane. Nigga do you even Nasuverse?
>>
>>101378279
That's not how shit works here; even Lancer says it's the ultimate defensive NP that negates all advantages, and the only way around it is to not use your trump card. It doesn't matter how powerful your shit is, because it will never have happened to begin with due to Frag.

Frag reverses causality as a whole so that the opponent never used their trump card to begin with. Even if Gilgamesh was about to use Ea he would be stopped, because he never used it to begin with.
>>
>>101377984
>Agility means dexterity, not speed.
敏捷
agililty
nimbleness
quickness
promptness

It's all of those things.
>>
>>101378307
>Shown to be slower in F/UC
You serious?
>>
>>101378415
Yes, and how does that prevent her from moving to intercept blows?

>>101378420
Fragarch counters by piercing the heart, Avalon can heal that.
>>
>>101378464
Were you>>101376604?
>>
>>101378484
>Fragarch counters by piercing the heart, Avalon can heal that.

Except it can't counter that, because she never used it to begin with. If she goes to use it again to heal herself she'll be shot in the heart yet again. Any time she uses it even passively she'll just keep auto-dying.

Since even Godhand is considered a trump card. You seem to see this scenario from the point of her being able to use Avalon to overcome being shot, but that can't overcome the fact that she can never use it to begin with or else it'll keep being overwritten.
>>
>>101378535
>Implying that there's only 2 ppl in this thread.
>>
>>101378628
Causality attacks are shut out, the True Magics are shut out. All destructive interference is shut out and seeing as how Time Travel is neatly both the 2nd and as far as we know the 5th Magic, I don't see Fragarach being any different.
>>
>>101378484

Doesn't Fragarach only counter attacks anyway?
>>
>>101378765
Can't shut something out if you never used your shit to begin with. Avalon is only useful if you can use it, and you can't shut out shit if you never used it to begin with.
>>
>>101378783
Trump card moves. Though that seems to be bit hazy, since Caster's magic doesn't count, but broken phantasms do.
>>
>>101378783
Trump cards, if you use your hidden card you'll be destroyed even if that card is a shield or passive
>>
>>101378801
And Avalon protects from that, Gae Bolg is a causality weapon and it ain't got shit on Avalon, Fragarach is no different. In the first place, what is Fragarach countering?
>>
>>101378834
Caster's magic isn't anything hidden, it's not a trick nor is it a trump, it's just her normal attacks.

Archer's BP is his hidden form, it's his greatest attack and it's his trump card in battle.

Caster's trump is Golden Fleece, which she can't use.
>>
>>101378801
>Can't shut something out if you never used your shit to begin with. Avalon is only useful if you can use it, and you can't shut out shit if you never used it to begin with.

'you never used your NP even if you did' is causality rape and like we just said, Avalon is exempt.

Saber uses Excalibur.

Fragarach activates

Avalon activates

Fragarach tries to activate

Avalon doesn't care

That's my take.
>>
>>101378888
>Caster's trump is Golden Fleece, which she can't use.
How does that even work?

If Saber borrowed Archer Excalibur, would that make him immune to countering?
>>
>>101378880
It counters a trump card by not letting you use it to begin with and then shooting you in the heart. Saber uses Avalon to shift dimensions to protect herself, but before she's done this she realizes she never did it and her heart is gone.
>>
>>101378927
Avalon is an EX rank NP, Fragarach is D~A.

Greater mysteries always win over lesser ones, Avalon doesn't give a fuck.

Suck on some fairy dick, you leprechaun bitch.
>>
>>101378916
You're theory only works if Avalon activates to say "No, that doesn't work", but it can't activate since Frag already shot out her heart beforehand since it could never activate in the first place as her heart was shot out first. The sword will always strike first even if it moves last.
>>
>>101379011
It only wins over the lesser mystery if Saber's NP can activate, but before it can activate the trump card is detected and the sword strikes first. The shield can only block if the sword hasn't already struck, but the shield cannot block if the shield never went up to begin with.
>>
>>101379018
>but it can't activate since Frag already shot out her heart beforehand

This is where I feel the issue lies, you seem to think Fragarach warps causality to affect Avalon and we're simply saying it can't do that.

I'm saying Fragarach will unprecedentedly miss completely and Bazett will shit herself at the sight of it.

It comes down to basically, Avalon breaks the rules, even Fragarach's.
>>
>>101379063
To begin with a battle between Fragnarach and any other NP won't be a battle of NPs ever; unless it's Gae Bolg. It'll always strike before the opponent could have done anything because it will always have struck premptively, otherwise you could just block that shit with Rho Aias "Because higher Divine mystery rank".

It won't even meet another NP in battle, because before it could have been used it's already struck.
>>
>>101379011
Except EX cannot be compared with ABCDE because it's not a rank.
>>
>>101379063
That's only if Fragarach is used against Excalibur.

With Avalon, minor wounds won't concern Saber and she can freely fight without having to use Excalibur against someone like Bazett.
>>
>>101379145
And yet again that theory only works if Avalon activates to say "No, nothing can work against me anymore"; but that is not how Frag works here. It doesn't meet other NPs in battle, it does not cross paths with the other weapon to begin with, rather it has already struck before the opponent moved here which means Avalon could not have activated to begin with.
>>
I'm getting horrible Yugioh counter-Trap Card +5 chain flashbacks...such a pain to resolve
>>
>>101379180
But it's still a greater mystery. In the realms above magecraft, transcending even the Five Magics.
>>
>>101379191

>>101379166
>>
>>101379248
And Avalon does not give a fuck about causality or time travel shenanigans. As far as Fragarach is concerned, Saber does not exist.
>>
>>101379248

And I'm saying that's obvious causality tampering, which is nothing to Avalon.
>>
>>101379286
That doesn't make a difference, because it never activated to begin with.
>>
>>101379347
Time travel and causality does not work against Avalon. Dimensional travel, phasing, transliners and multidimensional communication is all shut out.

No sell.
>>
>>101379334
It can't stop the warping of causality if it never activated to begin with. The action never took place, before such an event came to pass the heart was already gone.
>>
>>101379421
And that's still not going to go through, because Avalon shuts it out like all the other filth not permitted into the fairy realm.
>>
>>101379412
It's not warping the causality of Avalon, since Avalon could never activate as the trump card could never be allowed to activate here to start with.
>>
Let's do this logically. Fragarach is said to be able to counter anything. Avalon was not written in the materials as an exception. Therefore, Avalon is not an exception. Simple. Now let's discuss if Shiki can kill servants.
>>
This argument is like a Fragarach chain all on it's own.
>>
>>101379166
Rho Aias is a physical shield, something that exists and happened.

Avalon isn't. It's not there, it doesn't exist. It shuts out everything that could harm it's wielder.
>>
>>101379489
Shiki can't kill Avalon
>>
>>101379527

Not even Ryougi Shiki?
>>
>>101379527
Can't touch it, can't kill it.

Also, Fragarach can't counter it.
>>
>>101379520
Avalon is a thing that happens, it's physically there as a sheath before it teleports Saber to her sacred realm in a pillar of light, it's not just a magic spell. However the sheath whether passively or actively will never have activated to begin with since it will be detected as a trump card being used, and before Saber can even chant the name to activate it she'll have already lost.
>>
>>101379614
And time travel doesn't work, since it's shut out.
>>
>>101379651
It's not quite time-travel, it's just already struck the heart before the NP took place.
>>
>>101379691
Which is time travel, since it's based on the activation.

No sell. Also, Avalon can just heal the pin point laser damage.
>>
>>101379724
It can't heal it if it never activated to begin with, which it didn't. Nor is it time-travel; Nasu agreed, don't bother him about it.
>>
>>101379788
Nasu hasn't agreed to shit.

And the healing is passive, activated with injuries. And Avalon still no sells it since it's not there for the counter to hit.
>>
>>101379691

But it goes through steps

1)Opponent uses NP
2)Fragarach Activates
3)Intereferes with Step 1, effectively becoming
0)Fragarach kills

Although as I've typed out, it still needs Step 3 and Avalon won't let that occur.
>>
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>>101379724
>Avalon can't heal if heart or brains destroyed
>Implying Fragarach is pin point laser damage
>>
>>101379788

In your case, Bazett and Saber are stuck as Fragarach endlessly negates Avalon from healing the heart, forever.
>>
>>101379839
Passive shit like godhand is also auto-killed
>>
>>101379842
And Avalon isn't there for it to target for step 2. Does. Not. Exist.

>>101379854
That's with Gae Bolg tearing the laser strike wide.

Nasu used a toothpick and some tofu to explain how the damage varied.



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