We just maxed a thread with shitposting for the most part, let's not do it again.
Didn't we have this debate a while ago too? I want to say someone else in the anime industry said pretty much the same exact thing a while back. Maybe it was just a random discussion on /a/ though.
The problem with Scotland is that it is full of Scotts, in a similar manner the problem with the anime industry is it is full of anime fans.
I don't like the Ipad either.
The problem with the industry is that Japan doesn't care about money.
Why should I care what that washed-up old fart thinks?
He hasn't made a good movie in a long time.
>What is "The Wind Rises"?
The Wind Rises was really good. Saw it recently in theaters. Just throwing that out there, there isn't much worth debating in this thread.
An awful movie.
Torrents when???? I FUCKIN WANT TO WATCH THIS.
In what sense?
This isn't news at all.
Remember his friends with Anno, for fuck sake.
He should go cry on /v/ They'd love to have that problem.
Unless by otaku he mean all the faggots who essentially come here to fap be it literally or in escapism . Maybe he should get into non-visual animation then. Or perhaps less time fucking around making movies and more time with actual humans and researching human nature?
Because he's actually relevant to the industry.
>According to the recent retiree, anime suffers because industry staff is made up of otaku who "don't spend time watching real people" and are "humans who can't stand looking at other humans."
>"humans who can't stand looking at other humans."
But humans are fucking shit.
If it's possible to make money doing a different kind of anime, then its the studios' fault for not doing it.
If the way they're doing it now is profitable enough, then he's just mad people are making money off something he doesn't like.
The feeling is mutual, faggot.
>little anon thinks when Miyazaki refers to otaku, he's referring to /a/
>Blames industry problems on the consumer not the industry
What an old ass bitch
the animators are otaku. The business men in charge are just catering to consumers.
It's almost the same shit that major record labels say about piracy.
>It's the fans that are killing the industry, I swear!
>But humans are fucking shit.
Yes, Let's represent dogs in animu as animals that can fly because, you know, real dogs are shit and pretend is a real representation of life and that we know all about dogs.
>Because he's actually relevant to the industry
Maybe 20 years ago when it wasn't as apparent that every movie he makes has the same themes
>muh infinite stratos
It's funny how alike Gene Simmons and Miyazaki are. They're both butt-boiled that they aren't as relevant as they used to be so they blame everyone else but themselves for their lack of success
gene simons is just an edgy faggot whos money allows him to have such opinions
>hayao miyazaki is just an edgy faggot whos money allows him to have such opinions
He's referring to nothing outside of "people I don't like" and practically preaching his own choir of elitists.
Just like miyazaki
But you see, I think he has a point. Anime nowadays are made to pander to otaku unlike it was back then which are simply made to tell story.
You can blame the creators for actually making them but in the end, it's about money and where do they get it? From the consumers. That's why they have to pander to them.
No the issue with the industry is that the otaku market is niche and kills any hope of creativity by having it not sell. Normalfags who could breath life into the industry and cut out due to the fact they don't buy blurays and they aren't interesting int SoL and VN adaptions.
Get the fuck out.
He is completely right. Without the otaku to pander to we'd get decent shows instead of all the moegarbage we get these days.
There was a lot of pandering "back then".
The Wind Rises was the most acclaimed and successful film (live-action or anime) in 2013 in Japan.
Miyazaki is still a respected figure and has authority to speak on the state of anime, regardless of your opinion of him.
No, anime has never been mainstream outside of children shows.
Anno hates otaku as well. Noriko Hidaka has said she would never marry anyone in the anime industry (though she was responding to Anno asking her to marry him).
/v/ thinks that every anime before Kyoani was like Cowboy Bebop.
If blurays were meant to be bought, they wouldn't cost hundreds of dollars.
>unlike it was back then which are simply made to tell story.
It's so cute that you believe that.
>/v/ thinks that every anime that isn't SnK or Cowboy Bebop is made by Kyoani
Is what you meant.
You need to take your nostalgia goggles off and stop pretending you were born in the wrong generation.
>Miyazaki is still a respected figure and has authority to speak on the state of anime
And that's just the problem. He's like a washed-up rock star that shouldn't be making the rounds anymore, but is still able to because of his influence.
>unlike it was back then which are simply made to tell story.
Well actually, without the otaku to pander to we'd get no shows because nobody would buy the goods that fund them.
This isn't true. What IS true is that a lot of the more memorable anime from that time period had a story to it, but there were more than their fair share of SoL and plot-less anime out there.
You're free to believe that. But please don't base your argument on the fact that he hasn't been "relevant" in years/decades, since it's factually wrong.
i seriously doubt you'd like anime industry built around normalfag tastes.
>actually screencapping and posting (likely your own) forum posts here
Please kill yourself.
Stopped reading there. Should have stopped the moment I saw it was a forum post.
>Normalfags who could breath life into the industry and cut out due to the fact they don't buy blurays and they aren't interesting int SoL and VN adaptions.
You wanna try typing that in English?
I gave this shit forum post a chance and I've read it, just to not automatically discard it.
I regret it.
I fucking wish i was as eloquent as that guy. English is not even my first language.
I'm not saying he hasn't been relevant in years (I'm not the guy you were originally replying to). I'm saying it's the fact that he IS relevant that is the problem. Whether he is relevant or not should be based on whether his films can be unbiasedly praised as good films. And that can't happen. His films will always be praised simply because "he's Miyazaki".
>Anime nowadays are made to pander to otaku unlike it was back then which are simply made to tell story
You should probably read up on a topic before you start arguing on it. There are countless anime and Manga from "back then" (I assume you mean the 80s and maybe even the 90s) that feature fanservice and pandering.
The only people who think anime was any better or "different" "back then" are people who grew up on toonami shows and never bothered watching any other older anime.
Okay I'm so sorry for implying there wasn't any pandering back then. That came out wrong. I'm not wearing any goggles either. I'm shitting on the current situation rather than basking on the state of it in the past.
What I'm saying is the situation now, the pandering, is more obvious than anything else. A lot of shows only exist for this sole purpose almost devoid of any sensible plot.
When I said stories, I was thinking mostly of Miyazaki shows. So I guess that's explain the lack of thought in it. But then again, compare the Miyazaki shows to the ones we have right now, considering Miyazaki was pandering to anyone, the former at least had substance to it.
I'm not saying at all that it wasn't happening back then. But right now, it's something like a law that needs to be conformed to.
>every movie he makes has the same themes
Almost every anime made now has the same themes, along with the same character archetypes and the same paths for plot development.
"miyazakis opinions on everything are worth listening to" said nobody
it's pretty well known that's he's a prick
Miyazaki have almost right but the biggest problem is the Japanese society itself.
The reason is because most of them is pretty shy and like to avoid social contact with strangers. That is why japan got a lot of otakus because lack of social contacts.
Miyazaki as an artist is a great person.
Miyazaki as a businessman can keep his fucking mouth shut.
I don't want to hear it from someone who literally consumed all of DISNEY's lies and allowed DISNEY to keep Ghibli films in the backrooms, out of the reach from mass Western exposure and safely tucked away from DISNEY's and PIXAR's own dominance of the Western market.
I understand you need to study real physical materials and things you want to give the feel of to make a good animation that seems like it has real properties, but what exactly is the problem of not studying humans if you don't really wish to create humans? That's a stupid question I realize, but it seems to me that animated characters have a base fantastical quality, perhaps approximating humans more realistically will devalue some part of the medium.
Ah sorry this is really stupid, but I want to get it off my chest.
People always will bitch about something. Change is never excepted.
every film he makes is about a little girl who goes on an adventure and flies. Anime has much more variety than his films.
Can you explain why he isn't relevant of apt to speak about the state of the anime industry and its shortcomings?
The pandering isn't any different. a pantload of shows from the 80s and 90s had over 20 tons of tits and ass. people just don't talk about them anymore. The same will be true for the fanservice anime of the present. No one besides a small minority will be talking about shit like Ladies vs Butlers 10 to 20 years from now.
So therefore Miyazaki is no better than the rest of the industry
Quick google of the wall of text guy.
Also he comes to /a/ and says /co/ has better taste in anime.
>What I'm saying is the situation now, the pandering, is more obvious than anything else
This is more of an issue of exposure. Back then, all the pandering was done through OVAs while the big shows were day-time children shows. When stuff like EVA started selling just as much, there were more late night TV anime.
I hate the fact that fucking retards like him come here. What happened to this place?
Don't forget the tree hugging. Also I wonder if Miyazaki is a lolicon considering all the little girls and panty shots in his films.
>the situation now, the pandering, is more obvious than anything else. A lot of shows only exist for this sole purpose almost devoid of any sensible plot.
Yes, and it's pretty much always been like this. What is your point? Because I'm not seeing any valid ones.
>This just in: old guy complains about things changing.
Wow, never heard that one before.
Again, I'm not saying he isn't relevant. Re-read my post.
Because opinions don't matter. Follow the money and let the old man flail at his humanity and ignorance thereof.
and an anglophile
It became popular. But it's okay. This is why we are so strongarm about newfags. Despite the few that get in, we keep most of them out.
>K-ON! doesn't have mass appeal
Isn't that normalfags the anime?
Name one recent original anime that can atleast be said that has as much substance as most Miyazaki films. That's my point.
If you want non-pandering shows just do them.
It's not like pandering shows always sells 10000+ copies.
And if the stories lack human-like interaction it's the author fault for being a stupid faggot.
I'm not saying I want it to be centered around them. I'm saying it would be good if they have some influence in it and if anime were more accessible. The current 1am time slots and high price for BDs sustaining consecutive seasons is only good for creating a lot of one thing. If X sells over and over again then the studio has no reason to make anything other than X and since they're on monetary constrictions they never even bother to try creating Y.
SoL means slice of life and VN means visual novel. At the moment the industry is very very stale because these are the bulk of whats selling and thus where most of the focus is. Not that theres anything wrong with SoL series and VN adaptions however the term "too much of a good thing" fits the bill right here.
Both /co/ and /v/ have better taste in anime than /a/. Just like /a/ probably has better taste in videogames and maybe comics/cartoons.
Why does he not like the fact that anime has become a niche? Its like James Naismith complaining about basketball becoming a pro sport.
>Talking shit about the keions
My bad, I read too quickly and thought you omitted a "not."
Surely there's some artistic worth and merit to be found in his films if they're so universally popular and critically acclaimed.
Or do you really believe people keep watching the latest Miyazaki because well, it's Miyazaki and not because they acknowledge them as great films?
There is a lot of recent works, that don't aim to comfort neckbeards and their desires.
He's the type of retard that floods this place now. The kind that complains because there aren't 5 Cowboy Bebops every season and that anything that isn't SnK is "moeshit", and that everything needs to pander to their specific taste.
1. You're wrong.
2. Stop abusing the spoiler function you stupid faggot.
Normalfags are people who put living normally on a pedastal and normal things as if they're the magnum opus of what life has to offer - to the point where they hate things they love and would discard them to be normal.
/v/ is/was filled with them as shown by comments about their feel threads when /q/ was still around.
tl;dr normalfags are people who are desperate to seek approval. K-On isn't exactly the type of anime to which people who seek approval would show off about. Something that is genuinely designed to appeal to a wide range of people, like SnK, would be more normalfag.
The issue with this is that Miyazaki is for one someone who isn't opposed to change and thus sees the current situation for what it is. And two most people would generally agree that the industry has indeed gone downhill.
K-On is shit.
Okay a) VN adaptations are dying off because they've burnt through pretty much everything worthwhile and b) most adaptations nowadays are light novels, many of which are mediocre harem SOLs. They're going to burn through those soon too, and it's more Kadokawa Shoten's fault than the audience.
Now that isn't true. /v/ likes shit like SnK and Cowboy Beebop which are both pretty much just mediocre.
>Surely there's some artistic worth and merit to be found in his films if they're so universally popular and critically acclaimed.
Oh, of course. I'm just saying that they're overrated and that the worth is blown out of proportion because everyone (even Hollywood) sucks his dick for being so successful.
>Or do you really believe people keep watching the latest Miyazaki because well, it's Miyazaki and not because they acknowledge them as great films?
I can't speak for every person on the planet, but yes, I do think there are a lot of people (particularly foreigners) who watch his movies just because he's Miyazaki. Parents show their children his movies because of who he is and his reputation. I can say that from experience. My first anime was Totoro on VHS when I was a kid.
21st century I guess.
He's right, otakus are fucking faggots with shit tastes
Then do me something, Name me old original anime that have at least be said as much substance as most Miyazaki films.
I can only think about Evangelion and maybe Gundam.
The industry hasn't changed.
I meant more that K-ON! is popular because it appealed widely, even to non-otaku. Hell, my family doesn't even watch that much animu and they love it.
I think it's okay for fun.
Refute me, then.
You just made it incredibly easy for them.
Not that guy, but no, it's not a bad example at all. I'd also throw in Steins;Gate.
Well yeah when you have a bunch of socially inept nerds that eat pandering meme-filled shit all day and build an industry around them of course its gonna be a shitty industry.
Protip: Everything "panders".
>it's something like a law
Yeah, and of course everything conforms to it, the law is "Make sure your products have features that appeal to your customer". It is called the Entertainment BUSINESS for a reason, they are selling the product and the products are all designed to "pander" to one potential market or another. You only notice the pandering because it is not appealing to your taste but it is equally true of the pandering garbage that you watch as well. I could rag on you for not knowing what the words and subject you are talking about are too, but it's not necessary; the point is that people want their entertainment to appeal to them so other are not (and have not been made), you are just very myopic on this entire issue.
He's half right though. /a/ is full of entitled scum who cry when they can't get their subs for oniichan anime #65 on time.
Lain is one. And yes it has changed but I'm not saying from good to bad but rather, from bad to worse.
>a pantload of shows from the 80s and 90s had over 20 tons of tits and ass
And a lot of them had interesting plots too. It's not even the tits and ass that is the problem. Anime now is much less varied than before. There are a lot less sci-fi and fantasy shows in general and the settings plots and characters all are too similar.
What you gonna do about it Miyazaki, Retire again?
>This article was very poorly translated from Japanese.
What he actually said was about animation. Animators no longer spend time watching real humans move (because they hate humans), so they don't really animate it realistically anymore. It didn't have much to do with otaku.
While it is actually pretty decent in terms of character development, he did say "original".
Madoka is a great example and that guy's just being a faggot because he can't think of a rebuttal.
There's no point in naming specific shows because regardless of what I suggest you'll shoot them all down because of you stalwart defense of you stance on the topic.
But if you really want me to name off some shows from the past ten years that I personally believe to be outstanding examples of quality storytelling then I will. In my own opinion I would list off these titles
And just recently Kyousougiga
That's just off the top of my head. Of course feel free to berate me for my "taste"
Maybe something like Yamato or VOTOMS. Most other stuff were manga adaptations, like Rose of Versailles or Harlock and Galaxy Express.
The reason why he enjoys that success is because he plays off of themes that are universally understood. This is why he does so well in movie theaters across the world.
That and his movies are also a great chance for the entire family to enjoy the experience, not just the kids (and not just the adults).
Its gone downhill the same way its worldwide growth and Japan's national economy has gone downhill. Anyone alive for the last 20 years knows the anime industry is far from its zenith. But these dire circumstances cannot be pinned on one or two things. Its the overall picture of today's economic reality combined with past mistakes of the industry as a whole which has compounded the dire situation the industry finds itself in today.
Yes, otaku have become the primary demographic. Yes, otaku have reduced overall creativity. But the flip side is the otaku base is so strong that it can support an industry that did everything possible to torpedo its long term growth. That is a blessing, no matter how shitty it smells.
Hi /v/. What happened this time, got your Recommendation/Cowboy Bebop thread deleted?
So thats why Shaft exists?
Madoka is a bad example because it can fit the definition of otaku-pandering blobshit.
You can't deny Madoka is just a fertile womb for all kind of fap material. On the other hand, works like Ookami Kodomo are not.
the difference is that Kiss was never good.
He said it wasn't mainstream though, which is incorrect.
But of course it is anon! SnK and Cowboy Bebop are leik the best animes ever and literally everything else is just moeshit. I watched like 20 animes and those were the best ones.
They're also the people that keep your chinese cartoon studios from going bankrupt.
Funny thing is, ImoCho just got knocked back in timeslot and nobody here has even mentioned it. /a/ has always discussed action shows just as much as SoLs, but you've only been here since SnK so the fuck would you know?
Good point. But their still both being bitches
ANN is just Sankaku level inflammatory shit now. Seriously, what the fuck.
Either way, stop the fucking bitching. Pandering or not, anime has always been, and will always be, shit. Shut up and learn to deal with it.
It isn't a stable base. It only works because the generation before the otaku had a lot of wealth.
Everyone in the industry can see the brick wall that's ahead.
Steins;Gate isn't original, but if we are talking about good anime from the 21st century, whatever be it source, why not add things like Tatami Galaxy and Jinrui?
Or maybe Aria and Kino to Tabi?
There are a bunch of recent great stuff.
I would say anime hasn't declined, it has gotten best.
We still some really good titles each year, but now we get even more disposable stuff, so it may looks like it's bad, while it just got more stuff released.
How is S;G not original? Honest question, because I haven't ever seen anything like it.
Right. I'm saying it's not a good thing to simply ride on that success. Granted it's a hard thing to shake off, you just have to be weary of the reviews and praise that people give his movies, because many of them are likely biased.
I see you are new to the internet. Did it just get installed in herkaderkastan this week?
Anyone here thinks Miyazaki looks like a Japanese version of Col. Sanders?
Anime has been shit since 1964.
>implying back then it was any better
>implying it is always other studios fanservicing
>implying the entire appeal of drawn compared to filmed material is not how clean and young the women look and round and well defined their curves are how big the eyes without mascara and tons of makeup like on 3D actresses
>expecting fans not to sexualize
old dirty hypocrite
>it can fit the definition of otaku-pandering blobshit.
>hurr anything that appeals to anyone is pandering
The show was not made with the express purpose of fanservice, and you're a retard for defining anything that some group likes as irredeemable pandering. Fuck off and stop degrading what little intellectual dialogue is happening ITT.
/a/ also cries about not getting subs in general. Kill la Kill and SYD are the latest.
>ImoCho just got knocked back in timeslot and nobody here has even mentioned it
There was at least one thread about that, but it died after a few posts.
I think they mean because Steins Gate is based off a VN.
I never noticed that before, but wow, yeah.
Defensive babies crying when I call them out. I know more Japanese than 99% of this board and watch more anime than both of you.
I see you are a retard with shortage of proper arguments.
It's more like Steve Jobs complaining about linux. He's barely in the same market. It's like saying "why doesn't everyone make stuff like me" when he's dominating and everyone else is carving out that niche.
A lot of mass appeal stuff is already done in games, live action, and western imports while he doesn't seem to realize he's the 800 pound gorilla exception making an ass of himself.
>I meant more that K-ON! is popular because it appealed widely, even to non-otaku. Hell, my family doesn't even watch that much animu and they love it.
Oh, that's my mistake then. I thought you were misjudging the original definition of what a normalfag was.
>ImoCho just got knocked back in timeslot and nobody here has even mentioned it
But it was mentioned though.
They are keeping the studios from going bankrupt because the anime industry trapped itself by gradually pandering to them until it became entirely dependant on it
>How is S;G not original?
It's a VN adaptation. He was referring original content.
Woah, I haven't been in a thread with good taste in yesrs.
That is how the industry is. Otaku make anime to be consumed by other otaku because otaku are the only ones buying it.
This is somewhere were 5000 copies selling is actually seen as a feat.
Even when non otaku stuff comes out(some noitamina shows) it sells like shit. Anime is just not mainstream. The animated film market manages a bit better.
Now with this I can agree.
Sometimes the way they stand or the reactions just don't look natural.
It's an adaptation from a visual novel. I think he meant an anime that wasn't an adaptation from something.
That's some pretty stupid reasoning if you're right.
Oh boy, looks like he was right.
>Madoka was not made with the express purpose of fanservice
Well, who is to blame for the industry not re-attaining some kind of golden age? Super artsy and creative works tend to be ignored by otaku (fujoshi, female otaku, etc) and they never find any audience from the general populace either. Ghibli has a built-in generational fanbase than ensures their works NEVER go unnoticed, but with the move from a handful of network television stations to cable, satellite, and digital TV, it's really no wonder nothing else outside of old wholesome anime ongoing since the 70s can retain an audience. You've got an Attack on Titan every so often, but no one ever notices Flowers of Evil.
Are you two even trying? Just stop. It doesn't matter who's right, you're just embarrassing yourselves.
At least Miyazaki had complain unlike Yamakan when he goes and tries to say the same thing
Do you think Miyazaki would ever sign a print of this picture?
Did Christian Bale ever sign as "dubsguy"?
Say that to my face, fucker, not online and see what happens.
>Normalfags are people who put living normally on a pedastal
Eh, you won't find an accepted definition on /a/. I've seen people accuse others of being normalfags simply for having a degree, well paying job, and a good social life.
However, I do agree that people looking to conform solely out of a desire for acceptance need to re-evaluate their lives.
This, and it aired just last season.
nice maymay, you sure told him
Then fucking sub Glass no Kamen desu ga. If you're talking about people who cry "WHERE ARE THE SUBS?" after 12 hours, then you must have no qualms for people who've been waiting for this show to be subbed since last April.
Dude, nice meme. Did you make yourself?
>I've seen people accuse others of being normalfags simply for having a degree, well paying job, and a good social life.
What are you trying to say here? That's the definition of normalfag.
And what is the flip side of that coin?
The much-derided otaku have bought the industry precious time to correct its course and expand outwards. The industry has one last chance to find the correct path to becoming a global industry that can rely on dependable, constant worldwide sales.
>>because it can fit...You can't deny Madoka is just a fertile womb for all kind of fap material. On the other hand, works like Ookami Kodomo are not.
Like I said, I see you are new to the internet.
I'm so glad I only read manga
The anime industry died for me 5 years ago, it saved me a lot of disappointment, that's the only thing you get by watching all that escapism expecting actual story.
Who cares? If they're good, they're successful. So if 'too much otaku' means poor anime, maybe somebody makes one without otaku, and that's good, and then everyone follows suit because it sold well. That's the standpoint of the free market. Until then, don't fix what ain't broke.
Listen, Anime, just like videogames will ALWAYS be a degenerate man-children hobby. There's just no way around it, anything that takes us away from the harshness of reality will always be deemed detrimental to society.
I'm not saying there isn't a bit of a problem with otaku, but there's a even bigger problem with "normal" idiots. Do you seriously want every anime to be like Aku no Hana or something?
Kyousougiga is actually a great example because the whole fucking show is symbolic of different elements of Buddhism. And it's not just psuedo-DEEP crap, it's actually well executed.
also now that I think of it it's actually very Miyazaki-esque.
He's just mad he didn't come up with the masterpiece that is Oreimo. I can't blame him, it's the best anime released so far.
Aaaaand still no proper argument. Makes me wonder if you are even trying to come up with something and you're just buying time with more and more shitposts.
>I can't refute his argument so I'm just going to quote him and laugh
You're defining anime with absolutes, and pretty much saying that anything that even might appeal to x audience is pandering, even though Madoka, while it does have fanservice here and there, is an excellent example of storytelling and is very character-driven, and also appeals to a pretty wide audience in Japan, from what I understand.
Basically your argument is "if otaku like it then it's shit", and that's idiotic.
>you just have to be weary of the reviews and praise that people give his movies, because many of them are likely biased.
I agree, but he's also pretty consistent with critics. And they love taking down a great when they can.
>so they don't really animate it realistically anymore.
Since when did ghibli anime ever have characters move realistically? Even in Miyazaki movies the character animation tends to be mostly ass.
miyazaki doesn't sign anything
>What are you trying to say here?
That it's not the same definition as what I quoted?
But manga is what fucked up anime the most. It's where it come from.
And they're just as bad as the people who universally praise him. Basically, I'm saying that universal praise/criticism based simply on who he is is not good and is sadly very common because he is as popular and successful as he is.
You spelled LN and VN wrong.
"The problem with the ocean is that it's full of water"
Why do people take miyazaki seriously?
Okay you guys, I'm out for work. I was the guy saying Miyazaki has a point.
Again, I'm not saying he's right all through out. Not at all. I said he has a point. Otaku pandering right now has become more tangible that it actually has a say on what's going to happen to a story. Remember that one LN where the author had to retcon the heroine being mindlessly raped? While it's true that it's unecessary, the fact that he had to change that part shows how much grasp the "otaku" right now to the industry.
Of course you guys are right too, as much as it would go. Paranioa agent was cool. Paprika and the likes from that same guy. I'm surprised noone said anything about Garden of words though because that's the first thing that came to my mind when I tried to refute myself.
What I'm saying is it's just worse nowadays. That's all. Arguing further would just stick me deeper in the proverbial quicksand so I'd leave it to you guys.
This is why I hate Miyazaki.
He reminds me of Yamakan: both are drama queens.
Is he talking about physical animation or about character and personality?
I think this guy meant how anime fucked up VNs.
>we'd get decent shows
We'd get, children shows and more stuff like One Piece and Sword Art Online.
Do you really want shounen action and family anime only?
Like it or not, what he says it's true. Anime is just otaku pandering, that's why 90 % of the shows every season are a fucking copy paste of the previous, with always the same pandering and cliches.
Investment doesn't work that way. Entrepreneuership doesn't work that way. You supply demand.
They do not have the excess resources like the US oil and auto industries to reshape a culture such that it generates demand. The otaku have barely funded them enough to survive.
what an asshole
>anything that takes us away from the harshness of reality
Normalfag had it worse.
>ANY form of entertainment in general
Let's face it. There is no "normal". There are only try-hards acting edgy and pretending to be "mature" to feel good about themselves because they think they're better than everyone else.
Fuck that shit.
>Remember that one LN
Yes it is, if the it hasn't got so off-character after episode 6 or so it would be a 10/10 to me, but suddenly everyone started acting like bitches.
I couldn't get over it even when the reasons were explained, I'm waiting for the blu-ray release to rewatch all of it without having to wait a week for the episodes and reformulate my opinion on it.
And I'm still mad they didn't use the OST of the original OVA.
Is that bad, though?
All this talk about Miyazaki got me thinking about Satoshi Kon, for some reason. Now I'm depressed. Why did we have to lose him? He was so amazing. Goddamnit. ;_;
Oh and Kyousougiga was great. Totally missed that.
Atleast they aren't Tomino. This guy went full retard with latest "pornography" argument dissing Isayama. snk a shit
He seems to be talking about physical animation. he says "animating people" rather than "writing people."
As in, if Miyazaki puts a bad movie out in theaters, they will enjoy tearing him a new one with their reviews.
>the mighty have fallen
>not the miyazaki we once knew
>is this the end of a great legacy?
Manga fucked those up to. All those stupid ass clichés and emo melodrama come from manga.
Worldwide fans wont pay the 6000 yen for 2 episodes that anime needs to be profitable and sustainable. They make a pittance from licenses and royalties, and what an American pays for 12 episodes (60-70) is about one sixth of what a Jap will spend on one series. Without that massively high price, the late-night and OVA models just do not work.
The anime industry would be better off if ACTA, SOPA, or TPP passed. ACTA is still waiting for a Republican Senate majority so that it can be ratified in the USA. TPP is the other variant of ACTA and it is undergoing negotiations right now. In some ways, it is the 2nd attempt of ACTA but without the EU involved in the first round. If TPP passes, then the EU might be forced to join just because of the membership in TPP. ACTA's main problem was that it tried to get too many of the big players to ratify it on the first round, thus protests in europe had a chance to take off (unlike the USA where protests were small) and mostly found heart with the EU protests.
I agree with a lot of what he's saying, but I'm also glad that Japan caters to such base desires. American shows are terrified of being sexist or racist or whatever ism can be attached, and anime studios will never give a fuck.
The problem is Japanese society. Stuff like Otaku would never exist in 'Merica like they do in Japan
That is the only way they are going to survive before the otaku drive dies out.
Such is the way of mass media.
Yeah, but there still were a few songs from the ONA in the TV run. I personally think the OP was GOAT also.
>What I'm saying is it's just worse nowadays.
Which is wrong because back in the day shit like this was being thrown about left and right.
Looks like someone's bitter because he didn't get an Oscar.
>don't spend time watching real people
Sorry, If you want it be close to realistic then don't bother to do animation and just do live-action or Drama instead.
>humans who can't stand looking at other humans
He isn't even Otaku and talk like he knows everything. I watches anime because real people are boring as shit and I expected something that reality can never offer not something boring shit like Win Rice that not neccesary to be animation and should just be live-action instead.
This Miyazaki guy is very Sly, he always wants attention from public by saying someting stupid just like Yamakan
>The anime industry would be better off if ACTA, SOPA, or TPP passed
>Nu-uuh! You're doing what I am doing!
There is much more to the anime industry than the lifeless otaku he is talking about. And why do people take the opinion of an acclaimed director who made many successful animated movies when he is talking about animation? Gee, I wonder.
but he did, he just wasn't there to recieve it.
I think Miyazaki would like Aku no Hana.
>lack of success
but Miyazaki is VERY successful even today
Well, I find it boring that we have 20 shows every season that are basically the fucking same, but if you find it amusing and enternaining I don't mind. I still watch some of them.
>Adopt Criminal Sanctions:
>Adopt criminal sanctions for copyright infringement that is done without a commercial motivation, based on the provisions of the 1997 US No Electronic Theft Act.
Jesus fucking Christ, how mentally ill do you have to be to think this is a good idea? This is legitimately scary.
funny thing about that is that it's not even true
One guy on mangafox spread the rumor yet there is no actual evidence while looking at japanese reviews of the book.
Precisely my point. You can count on reporters to take a shit on the popular the moment they see a chance.
They came from manga, but they were mastered and overused by anime.
The OP is great, I still don't know when the ED will be released, though.
>lack of success
I seriously hope you are bait.
Read threads before forming opinions and especially before posting stupid things.
Hes an acclaimed director talking about big business. He has been a failure at big business within the studio, and his only constant success at big business outside the studio is appealing to the Japanese public and artiste hipsters overseas to watch his films. There is no reason to heed his words when he talks about why something is or is not making money.
This. Also, his outlet for gathering attention is clearly wrong. He should follow Jaden and spout nonsensical wise-ass line over twitter.
Well, if you really like anime, you'd always find something that would suit your fancy.
I'll just treat you like a piece of shitty copypasta bait and move on.
You're right. Here in murrica it'd have to be as vulgar as possible. Add tits and sex. Oh and there has to be a gun.
Success does not equal relevance. Just because he is successful in the west doesn't mean he's relevant in the current anime industry.
>Even when non otaku stuff comes out(some noitamina shows) it sells like shit
I agree, you fuckers ruin anime. The japanese version of you is worse. Want to know why I stopped watching anime after 10 years? Because after a while you realize it's the same fucking show every season. Why? Because it's what you want, and it's what makes the industry money. You created this cycle of shit. I hope you all rot in it.
Anime would be nowhere near what it is if the only fans were recluses who watched anime alone and fapped on figures.
Just like how movies will cost 40 dollars a ticket in a few years like Lucas and Spielberg predicted.
I can only imagine how Miyazaki's follower count would skyrocket on the first day
Seriously, why are you even here?
"artiste hipsters overseas"
Yeah, his films get overseas nation wide releases because >hipsters
Be. Less. Dumb.
Gee and the comic industry is full of nerds. Gee that's a shocker.
>but it's the same fucking show every season!
You. It's people like you I loathe the most. Do you ever crawl out of that well, you toad?
anon, why? I agree to an extent that madoka magica was a work that was eye opening but... anon...
Oh god I just finished that, so mad.
did you come from /v/ just to make that post? That's embarrassing.
You didn't watch pre-2000 anime except for the one listed at the /a/ wiki.
You should know that, by your standars, anime was shit even back then.
And I'm not saying it's a flawless media, but you're expecting something that it's not there.
And the comic industry would be dead if it wasn't being propped up by studios who want the IP for movie purposes
I wish people hadn't forget what it means, his movies are mainstream as fuck, it's far way from being hipster shit, they are distributed by the largest entertainment industry in the world for fucks sake.
>You should know that, by your standars, anime was shit even back then.
Was it ever. There is a mountain of terrible anime stretching through the 90s. Why does no one seem to remember it in lieu of MUH COWBOY BEBOP, because it's bad and therefore forgotten.
You should learn something about Miyazaki's relevance in Nippon before judging it. In the west only otaku and some hipsters care about it. In Japan Miyazaki is God. A recent survey stated that 90 % of japanese people have at least watched 1 film from Ghibli. He's the most relevant director since Tezuma.
Its following the steps of the video game industry. REPENT /a/.
Sounds to me that the issue is basically
>The industry doesn't cater to my tastes
>So it's DEAD
If you want to change it so much, vote with your wallets. If you can't/won't, then accept it's not being targeted at you. Simple.
Satoshi Kon's films in general are better than Miyazaki films. Though Miyazaki has some pretty good ones too.
I'm pretty sure there is a good amount of variety. SnK is nothing like KlK and those are both the biggest shows.
How about Haruhi not getting S3 then because Aya Hirano a bitch or any of your favorite shows not getting another season because no one bought them?
This isn't quite true. The big groups like Marvel, DC, Image and Dark Horse would be dead. Things such as indie and noire graphic novels, as well as webcomic and comic strips would still be going on.
thats like comparing fruit to ice cream
Nice bait meme.
people say movies have gotten worse, but you don't realize how many bad movies we forget about because they are exactly that; bad.
His works are also considered as an art form by some.
If that was true there'd be some loudmouthed 3dpd begging for dosh to make videos about how anime only panders to men and not GUURRLL GEEEKS.
Seems like he's mainly talking about a quality problem of recent anime (which could lead into why a marginalized audience is affecting the business if you wanna argue that).
I can understand his conclusion, though I only slightly agree with it because I do admittedly watch some moeshit.
Damn, now there was someone whose presence is actually missed more than ever today.
Anime which break the mold of Fantasy/romance/adventure/ are never made nowadays. Kon was actually pushing for a more respectable and experiental anime scene/
Thanks, it's great short hand.
Don't forget that Gene Simmions' son literally made a comic which copied panels from Bleach and thought he would get away with it.
He's right. Anime writers can't write characters and as a result, they wwrite all characters as one of the few presets, like "shonen lead" or "tsundere". Also, they mostly have awful and unbelieveable dialogue.
>The problem with the TV industry is that it is full of shitty reality shows
>the problem with the publishing industry is that it is full of writers who can't write for shit
>the problem with the video game industry is the constant recycling of the same games
Who even gives a fuck? Even with all the shit that is produced every so often something amazing comes out. To complain about the lowest common denominator and saying it is ruining the industry is fucking retarded.
Didn't we just have this fucking thread
Everything that's been said has been said already
This is why these threads are pointless. People tend to forget mediocre media works and remember popular/good ones instead. Of course, this gets retards going about the 'golden age of X' forgetting the fact that there was just as much trash back then as there is now.
And then at the end of the year we always get quite a few good movies that will eventually gain longevity. This happens every single year, without fail, without end. Sure there's a lot of terrible films, but we also have more multiplexes and more screens that allow more films in general to be made and exhibited.
There has always been shitty movies.
There has always been shitty anime.
There has always been shitty TV shows.
There has always been shitty video games.
There has always been shitty books.
But do you know why you never here about them?
BECAUSE THEY WERE SHITTY
no form of media is getting worse. They've all been filled with shit before and still are.
>writers for thousands of years can't write characters and as a result, they wwrite all characters as one of the few presets
Fixed that for you.
I definitely agree with his complaint about MCs that are just not human. Every other one reminds me of playing Star Ocean Last Hope.
>>The industry doesn't cater to my tastes
>>So it's DEAD
Considering his films are selling, even now, like hot cakes in Nippon, I'm sure he doesn't give a fuck about the industry's tastes. He's just exposing an opinion, a bit flawed, yes, but I repeat, he doesn't give a shit about the industry because he already is in the Top.
Miyasaki looks down on your autism
Still not hipster. Also, fucking everything is considered art by someone, Piero Manzoni sold 90 cans of his shit by the price of gold because some people think it is art.
People just want scapegoats to feel better about themselves.
On /a/, it's otaku.
On /v/, it's dudebros.
Zeus is a motherfucking Gary Stu!
naruto is considered art by some people also. So is jackson pollock. Calling something "Art" doesn't mean shit.
>kill la kill
ok there, such a credible poster.
I was talking about the anons posting in this thread. Miyazaki even has less of a right to complain since everything he puts out is idolized by normalfags.
>Remember that one LN where the author had to retcon the heroine being mindlessly raped?
Yeah, that is only a problem with those damn otaku. That would never happen anywhere else.
He's right, though. One look at fanfiction should tell you why this was a mistake and what is in store. Just look at the absolute crap that is coming out in recent seasons.
Naruto is "art"
Art doesn't mean good art
>Piero Manzoni sold 90 cans of his shit by the price of gold because some people think it is art.
It's still shit, though.
This is a problem that encompasses all fiction, not just anime
>Abe Administration, the Iraq War, and the iPad, for which he compared the gestures to masturbation.
What does this mean?
>'golden age of X'
god I fucking hate those fuckers. Its the reason I really love /mu/ and /a/
Exactly. Just because it's art doesn't mean it's good. i.e Deviantart
And the best animation in Ghibli movies tend to be outsourced to TMS (as late as The Wind Rises, by Atsuko Tanaka, Hiroyuki Aoyama & Kazuhide Tomonaga; Takashi Kawaguchi (who has been freelanced since 2003 was also stationed at TMS for this) also worked on Isao Takahata's Kaguya-hime no Monogatari as well) anyway.
The only way to stop this mess is to being back the blue & pink rabbits and only TMS can do this, I don't care how many road blocks Warner Bros & Amblin make, just make sure it's done at least $8 million US dollars per episode so that the animation can be as beautiful as it can and that it go's to TMS' A-Unit as well.
>idolized by normalfags
Yeah. And what's the problem? You can't enjoy something because some normals find it good?
>Implying /a/ doesn't idolize the 90s
He hates everything, anon.
Japan has serious censorship problems.
Decent variety this season. Everyone should have at least 3-4 shows they are following.
Next season looking amazing.
I don't think you understand what I'm saying.
Perhaps you should follow the quote chain before shitposting.
/a/ is pretty staunchly against nostalgiafaggotry. It kills interest boards.
There was fan service before, there were a lot of copy pasted plots before. I think his main point is the new focus on sex. Anime is sexualized to a point that many shows appear as fetishistic or soft porn. This significantly increases the barrier to new consumers, because you normally appreciate the sexual undertone after you're already a fan. There are too few "entry level" anime nowadays and this is slowly killing the potential consumer base.
You can be an anime fan without being an Otaku.
>Miyazaki says these people don't observe others
>the otaku abandon society because people are shallow, and it becomes more apparent with age
>complains about devices and concepts that panders to the same people he "observes"
>thinks we are the problem when in fact some of our ideas are the exact ones he would like to enforce
It's pretty much showing that he doesn't even know the audience. The way he's generalizing otaku is exactly the problem the people he thinks we should "observe" hold.
Every problem you can generalize on any group of the human race can be easily twisted onto the other side. Humanity is easily turned like that. Now if he can make a dark work and show that to little kids AND take back what he said, maybe I'll listen.
Guy is a fucking hypocrite.
The golden age of anime is now
Not in Japan
Non-otaku anime fans are just about meaningless considering how much less they're willing to spend on anime-related products.
>Works by Umetsu
You were saying?
Here we go
I think he's being ironic?
After all /a/ generally hates Ghibli.
Now I am generalizing of course but you have to agree Miyazaki has a habit of being a bit hipster and elitist.
> I think his main point is the new focus on sex
It's like Deja Vu.
There was always shit and there were plenty of issues in any form of medium in any time. But I don't think that means that the issues of modern anime is something that should be given a free pass or is exactly the same as that of the issues of older times.
If there is one characteristic that I think is fairly dominant this generation is the sort of integration of visual novelization of a lot of shows.
>More harem shows that are actively using visual novel cliches (even acknowledging it) and languages
>LN adaptations are becoming more popular than ever and many of them have strong VN flavors.
>Some LNs authors have been scenario authors (IS, Jinrui, etc.) while developers like Type-Moon and Nitroplus (Butcher) have gained major attention.
This is a fairly generic assumption at this point. However, I do think that many shows (not all) have kind of lend itself to the more character-driven, game-like aspect of VNs.
I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying it's the same shit over and over again. It took almost a decade to realize it, that I was skipping episodes because I knew what filler bs was going to happen, and then I started skipping whole shows because I saw it last season -the characters just had different hair colors.
It was not the same 2000 and pre2000, not because it wasn't the same shit over and over (in different phases, depending on where the money was like the almighty Eva copycat phase), but because you didn't have this many shows per season. The anime economy is many fold larger than it used to be. Look at motherfucking Danny Choo. WHAT THE FUCK DOES HE EVEN DO (aside from SEO online affiliate marketing BS). Now you have Hollywood style anime which wasn't always the case. It's author X gets commissioned to write a story pandering to demographic Y, publicists and producers are already invested in the anime before the book even hits the shelves. Marketing team does their job, ads/paraphernalia/etc. Boom, make millions. There was a time, look it up if you don't remember, where there is a studio full of degenerates who lock themselves in, and come out with straight to video content, hoping someone puts it on the air. Studios like this can't survive anymore, unless they are Miyazaki status.
You hate me? Think I'm whats wrong with anime fans? Motherfucker try to imagine how much hate I have for you and what you have done.
I'm not some kid mouthing off what I read somewhere, I am the VHS generation. I've been saying ever since Kyoani stopped being famous for Full metal panic and the moeblob took over.
Yea but, they are the ones who come up with new ideas and don't try to put their waifu into everything
haha i love cherry picking quotes and strawmans my favourite 4chan arguments :_)
You are on /a/, people fear that by liking what normals like they will come here and talk about naruto, so it is a sin to like popular shit, regardless of it's quality.
I know I do, alot of TMS' masterpieces came from the 90s (thanks to Warner Bros).
>you hate me? Think I'm whats wrong with anime fans? Motherfucker try to imagine how much hate I have for you and what you have done.
I told you /a/
I warned you
The signs were all there
Shingeki No Kyojin's record sales and massive western appeal even way before the dub
Massive influx of tumblr, reddit, SJW feminists into the anime community, including some into /a/
KyoAni falling to the fujoshi/Feminist groups -- the studio known for otakupandering, just made 10x what it made on otakupandering by fujopandering
Crunchyroll growing by leaps and bounds
Even toonami coming back and getting pretty solid ratings
Oh, and now Space Dandy airing on toonami BEFORE it does in japan?
Anime is becoming the "i'm such a nerd xD" thing to watch
Anime is becoming video games
And Crunchyroll is your Consoles, SnK is your halo, Trigger is your EA.
Once they saw how much money they could make by pandering to fujoshits and normalfags (SnK, Free, etc) and how much the otaku $ had dried up, there was nothing you can do
Not Even Japan Is Immune To Capitalism
Not even Japan can stand against the Jews
It was a fun ride /a/.
>I feel that otaku have already become common to all countries. In Europe, in Korea, in Taiwan, in Hong Kong, in America, otaku really do not change. I think that this is amazing. I say critical things towards otaku, but I don’t reject them. I only say that we should take a step back and be self-conscious about these things. I think it’s perfectly fine so long as you act with an awareness of what you are doing, self-conscious and cognizant of the current situation. I’m just not sure it’s a good thing to reach the point where you cut yourself off from society. I don’t understand the greatness of society, either. So I have no intention of going so far as to call for people to give up otaku-like things and become more suited to society. Only, I think there are many other interesting things in the world, and we don’t have to reject them.
>However, I take offense when otaku are criticized by non-otaku. Stupid idiots, I think, [criticizing] though you don’t understand anything (laughs). There are truly many people who don’t seem to really understand. I know these things without being lectured to by these people. It’s like, why now? But saying those things is still better. There are many who completely missed the mark. When people don’t even try to understand speak about otaku as though they were far above them, I think: what stupid people.
- Hideaki Anno
As I said, It's my opinion. I never said I thought it was objectively true.
>implying we care
No, that's just the author being a lazy faggot. And the ones who pay for it to be animated use it as an advertisement for when something new comes out.
>I'm saying it's the same shit over and over again
That's called TELEVISION!
Anno is truly the hero we need. How can one man be so based?
>Protests against nuclear power
He is an idiot, just like every other hippy that complains about something he knows nothing about.
Sorry if this hits you anons real hard but Miyazaki makes a point. What certain people are is this: loathing human beings who claim no one can understand them. So now they choose to communicate less, become misanthropic, and celebrating their idiocy. Perhaps this attitude is a form of creating some sort of identity- especially in this world where people crave identity. Funny thing is people take pride in the misanthropic nature. This is further catalyzed by their shit taste in anime- liking shitty fanservive anime that are utterly moe cliche shits. Those who look down upon that taste are automatically hated upon. Why? Because apparently they don't understand the angst. They are too close minded. The otaku culture has fostered so much narcissism- so much misanthropic attitudes- and so much terrible anime that I find Miyazaki's point to be a piercing sword crashing onto the delusions of the otaku community.
Good god is it better now.
It's sad to know that merchandising is so damn important to anime, the quality of the shows would probably be better if their popularity was the only relevant part. But no, let's make anime to sell key chains and dolls instead.
Cherrypicking that people were deluded 20 years ago as well.
Yeah but I think the difference here is that the market of anime itself did not scale well as it grew older. Ultimately Japan is loosing more and more dosh since its still the same stale shit. Miyazaki is just having a tantrum but the industry needs new opportunities to expand that's why all bigwigs on Japan loved SnK. Money.
You forgot one thing.
We are not /v/. We tell those people to fuck off.
/v/ laughs at the idea of doing that.
He's not against otaku, he's against the industry being full of them. The anime industry is a massive cyrclejerk and that's not healthy because it's always about the same themes. Lack of originality and repetition of the same ideas, at most.
>the otaku abandon society
There are lots of Otaku who don't. Don't project your NEET state into others. He's talking about the industry, anyway. I'm sure he understands that all the hikikomori problem is a consequence of the rotten and savage capitalism system.
Literally all anno is saying there is
>I am the only one qualified to critique you. Other people can't, but I can. Get a job you fucking NEETs
that is his entire argument
he's an egotistical dick
either everyone can criticize otaku or nobody can
>No MFM threesomes
Why is current anime so shit?
Based be master Anno.
>blaming the (arguably) only thing that is keeping the industry alive on a large scale
He should be thanking all the okaku out there for the continued support, not blaming them.
Yes, that's what I was thinking of. Can't say I blame them. It sort of like how musicians come to hate fans over time and actors as well. You get into a creative profession because you want to create something, but eventually you aren't able to make what you want to make anymore because you have to consider how it's going to sell. Instead of making what you want to make you;re making what will sell best and it becomes a chore. Although I think it's more the fault of the studios/labels/etc. for telling authors/musicians/etc. what they can and can't create than it is the fault of the fans.
I don't think you understand what Market Forces are if you think some turbonerds on an internet image board can stop them.
that or you suffer from massive USI, like, /g/ tier, USI.
Try to fap to the stuff on the the left, then on the right (exclude hentai). Report results.
You do know there are still tons of Haruhi source material out there right?
>However, I take offense when otaku are criticized by non-otaku. Stupid idiots, I think, [criticizing] though you don’t understand anything (laughs). There are truly many people who don’t seem to really understand. I know these things without being lectured to by these people. It’s like, why now? But saying those things is still better. There are many who completely missed the mark. When people don’t even try to understand speak about otaku as though they were far above them, I think: what stupid people.
This is an important point. The problem with Miyazaki is that he doesn't understand otaku or how the free market works. He has this 'Olympian View' where he is sitting on a throne and looking down at anime fans and judging them by his own views. It makes for a very myopic and ignorant viewpoint.
What's up with the Japanese and egoism/pride anyways?
>The problem with the game industry is that it's run by old school gamers
Yea, /v/ would love this problem.
you had me until
>Trigger is your EA
really? a rag-tag group of ex-gainax members notorious for making edgy, ecchi toilet humor cartoons is the equivalent of EA? really?
The problem with the anime industry is that Miyazaki is still somewhat influential.
He's allowed to though because he's based. Miyazaki is not. Anno is looking out for us as if we are his children. He's saying "no one can criticize my children but me". He loves us and wants us to succeed in life, so he wants us to quit being NEETS, But at the same time he doesn't appreciate others being mean to us. Just like a good father.
>I am the VHS generation
Stopped reading right there. You are so full of shit, that you can literally fill an entire football field with that much feces. face the facts, you are expecting something that doesn't exist. You are expecting some coming-of-age, ultimate, gratifyingly and satisfyingly show that will blow the your expectations out of your fucking mind.
You know why you enjoyed it back then? Because you didn't give shit about "Oh, it's all the same, it's shit, it's not a master piece". You are what made /v/ exactly how they are now. participating in pedantic and petty little arguments, while abandoning the concept of "enjoying".
You question, instead of experiencing, THAT'S WHY you can't enjoy it.
>it's always about the same themes. Lack of originality and repetition of the same ideas, at most.
It's all about cycles. I could probably lecture you on mecha/moeshit/etc., but I would like to believe you already heard about it on /a/ enough.
Trigger Is Your Valve.
>massive western fanbase
>advertises on twitter constantly
>browses /a/ (confirmed T v A poll)
>huge $ jewbux from kikestarter
Valve is a much better analogy, ill edit that, thanks anon!
See what I said in >>101235574
You're only justifying what I said. In any case of serious generalization, the sides are going to make stupid claims that the other side doesn't understand and make stupid points. It's all the same shit.
Pretty sure every serious writer in the anime industry thinks this. Adding Miyazaki to the list of commentators isn't going to fix the problem, though. Only a bottleneck effect (which is happening) followed by an ET-style crash can fix the industry. Things have to get a shit ton worse before they get better. Seriously, this is such a common and obvious complaint at this point that even the Japanese government is in on it; the industry is fucked and everyone knows it.
Stop bringing your shitty vidya discussion in here, I don't care about faggy games.
Already did. Great both ways.
right. that's definitely the problem.
Anno doesn't give one flying fuck about you and just wants you to buy his merchandise and BDs and go see his films. He's the closest thing to a japanese jew there is.
You can enjoy some pandering shows and still be critical about all being a pandering cyrclejerk without any real alternatives.
And why advertise it now, instead of waiting for something new from him? Why make an anime of something that not even the author is sure when will it continue, when they could be pushing more franchises with that money?
Manga is okay, but anime is 90% shit. Every time I read those season previews I die a little inside.
That's irrelevant. There's nothing NEW, that is the problem, the company is not going to make what they consider to be worthwhile sales of the material.
>everyone knows it
It's usually bitter failures like Yamakan who spouts those things.
You will understand one day my son. You simply need more time. I do not blame you. I blame myself.
Stop making something you want to sell then? If it's that important then you should make what you want and deal with the money factor some other way.
Assume the anime industry is now comprised equally of Otaku and normalfags. Japan now has a broader audience to sell shit to. How does it work out? Does it work out?
Why would you act like a critic on a show that's created for you to have fun?
Are you Gordon Ramsay or something?
and how is that bad? I've never understood why people hate valve.
>This thread again
Hurr durr old times, muh audience, animator budgets and FREE MARKET >>101230585
Actually, come to think of it. I'm half surprised that anyone here is bothering to disagree with him. Even moefags should realize that their stuff lacks widespread appeal.
We get three Narutos, 2 Bleaches and 5 One Pieces littering the airwaves.
faggots who buy merch get to decide where the market goes, deal with it bitches, when was the last time you saw normies support their "hobby"? FREE MARKET, your tears are delicous, threads like this make me happy, stay mad guys.
RyanSaotome is an obnoxious weaboo nigger, prove me wrong.
>Even Japan's government knows that the Japanese have awful taste
Having opinions about a show and expressing them is a form of criticism. You don't need to have a fucking diploma to do that. I'm the first who enjoy fun, but it's good to care about the future of the industry from time to time.
>Anime is dead!
>Pimple-faced, lame teenagers now are talking about the "cool cartoons" with the girls with big eyes, talking about how they loved Street Fighter II and Fatal Fury. The internet used to be real cool, but now we've got a buch of morons coming from all the mass media attention to the internet.
>Same thing is happening with anime. The mainstream society is out to kill everything that is good, capitalising on all that's great. Fuck. It sucks. I don't want to wave around 9000 messages, most about mainstream topics, non-anime, Sailor Moon, etc. Where the fuck did otakuism and anime obssession encorporated with sexual perversions and frustrated computer geeks? Now a bunch of fucking jocks are laughing at Ranma. Motherfuckers.
>I'm pissed off. Anime is dead. So now, all you fucking lamers, enjoy it. But I spit on Sailor Moon. And I HOPE that maybe a little bit of anime can be saved. Fuck the world.
~ Nihilis595 , posted 17 April 1996
Because if there was ever an anime valve it would be the most turbo-entry-level-but-good thing ever, you'd be literally overflowing with tumblr, reddit and normalfags within the day.
>either everyone can criticize otaku or nobody can
That is very poor logic. Also it's Anno.
Thirdly, that's not what literally means, so you have to be in error about that as well.
So what you're telling me is a new season of Haruhi won't sell because there's no new content?
Of course you can, I'm not saying abandon criticism, all together.
But blatantly hate on everything without experiencing it? Pure bullshit.
Ever hear of the Law of Attraction? Like for example, if you're convinced you made one mistake at work and that fear influences you into thinking you'll easily get fired?
It works like that, you're convinced that everything is all the same. That SOMEHOW, it could not be ever enjoyable and with doubt which oppresses the joy and fun in it.
Faggots who buy merch are ruining anime as a cultural export.
This. If normalfags got there way, there'd would be barely any anime made at all since the revenue sources would dry up.
the free market will fix it
in a few seasons from now, when every single show will be a harem with a NEET protagonist and loli/yuri fanservice, even otaku are going to get bored and they'll stop buying that shit
Like the music, movies, [add here] industries, the anime industry is just becoming better at making more money with less; targeting a specific demographic and milking it to the bone. It's whats wrong with the world in every sphere. Look at almost everything since the industrial age, it's not just nostalgia.
>thinking previews are accurate descriptions
Hey cool strawman guy is back! Not that that has anything with what i explicitly described as insanely popularly insanely well selling series and the death of long-standing 'male otaku only' studios like KyoAni, giving into fujoshi (Reminder : fujoshi = Japanese SRS)
Did those series sell 85k like Snk? :^)
Did they overtake normalfag anime cons like a metaphorical H1N1?
yes because he's "been there"
I wish I can shave her eyebrows.
Do you remember the songs "Video Killed the Radio Star" or "Radio Gaga"? Turns out that decades after, radio is still very much alive.
Same can be said to anime. It will not die even killed.
>My problem with American television is that it's just not racist enough for me
>the free market will fix it
Except the free market has shown that SnK and Madoka are by far the most profitable series of the last decade.
> targeting a specific demographic and milking it to the bone
This has been happening since the dawn of civilization
Of course, writers will dress up their harems to make them look like something else... like they've done for 20 years already.
Bakemonogatari, Madoka and Eva forever? This is something I can stand behind.
and suffering like a terminal cancer patient.
I don't think you understand what a radio star was
>He never listened to radio novels.
Unless we have 80 yo's on /a/, none of us were alive when TV wasn't the primary form of broadcast media.
People still need it in cars.
There are still radio dramas here. They're too dramatic, though.
By FREE MARKET are we talking about free market as in in the economy or are we talking about Free!'s, as in kyoani's, market?
>! Not that that has anything with what i explicitly described as insanely popularly insanely well selling series
You mean Pokemon, which was more successful than any "insanely popular" anime today? Looks like the industry is still standing, too.
>Fujoshi invasion! Did they overtake normalfag anime cons like a metaphorical H1N1?
Over the 30 years up to 2008, women have represented 71 percent of those selling dōjinshi at the Comic Market (men, 29 percent) and 57 percent of attendees (men, 43 percent) (Comic Market 2008, 21).
Yea, it's just going to turn into what the west is like with movies.
Fuck all sci-fi, fuck all fantasy, oh you liked that book here let us completely fuck it up for you.
No, a new season of Haruhi would sell more BD, but they don't care about those, they care about the LN sales. Hell, even if the author publishes a new one, I doubt we'll get a new season, until he either makes it regularly or he finishes it soon.
But what I can assure you is that a seiyuu's scandal isn't the reason.
No, it's Free and Tamako's Market.
No they don't. We've had auxiliary to tape deck converters for easily 20 years now. And now we can mix on the fly, so you don't even have to take the time to make mix tapes or cds.
I know but, surely you have talked to your grandparents or other older people about what it was like.
It won't sell enough in the right way, Kadokawa has no interest in it.
SUPERMAN WASNT THAT BAD
> We've had auxiliary to tape deck converters for easily 20 years now.
And most people still use the radio.
>implying I'm not a ghost of a war veteran born before WWII who now spends my time possessing animu characters.
Yes, all these times anons, I'm the one you've all been fapping at.
I think this is one of the first season that I've dropped everything. It's how shitty and repetitive it has become.
Miyazaki is a retard. If otakus were to suddenly stop watching anime, the anime industry collapses. The reason studios don't make normalfag anime is that they rarely make money off them, that won't change anytime soon.
completely unsurprising, considering the different vectors for sexual arousal.
? They've been doing this forever. The fuck do you think shitsekai yori, baccano, snk, ETC, are?
Hideaki Anno is cancer.
GHOST BLOWJOB WOO WOO WOOOOOO
Yes, you can just use your ipod or whatever, but some people like the programming on certain radio stations that come through the antenna, or the satellite channels.
How the fuck is that a strawman, you petulant little roach? The same shit has been said decades ago, and the same thing will continue to do so.
Let's use Miyazaki's example and produce "master pieces" of some imagination in the highest caliber. How are you so sure there aren't people complaining in the same exact way?
>Did those series sell 85k like Snk? :^)
>Did they overtake normalfag anime cons like a metaphorical H1N1?
How the fuck is this relevant? want to stop using emoticons to disguise your juvenile anger as well?
You shouldn't be calling him a retard, as you have demonstrated that you apparently can't even read.
>Over the 30 years up to 2008, women have represented 71 percent of those selling dōjinshi at the Comic Market
I'll ask you a very simple question : Why do you think most waitresses are attractive women?
Most old people. Fuck, even my mother only listens to the radio for NPR. When she listens to music, she uses an MP3 player. My 60 year old mother doesn't even use the radio for music.
ITT /a/ thinks it is the authority in what is objectively good anime.
meanwhile, a look at the catalog reveals that, what do you know, its true all along.
Ooh, an IS thread now THAT is objectively good anime!
He was making a decent point until
>KlK is an excellent show
Low powerlevelfags with shit taste are just as bad as "anime is only for self inserting" otaku. Too bad he doesn't hit that middle ground.
>ITT /a/ thinks it is the authority in what is objectively good anime.
Better than the nip otaku and normies like Miyazaki.
How many tens of thousands of BDs did the pokemon anime sell?
It sure would be silly if you conflated video games with anime
Because of the sheer fucking magnitude of the sales you fuck face.
Answer the question, how many of those sold 85k?
>Le fedora maymay
If you have something to say stop resorting to strawmans.
Otherwise, epic shitpost.
I'm not expecting some great show every season. I'm not saying way back when every show was like cowboy bebop and now it's all filth. Don't lump me in with some group of people who I have nothing to do with. My thoughts are my own, I don't participate in circlejerks.
I am saying again, very simply, that anime now has become so fucking corporate and therefore fans dictate so much of what is made or not, that most anime is made to consumer demand which results in the same money making show told 100 different ways. There are gems every so often, probably more often than before. YOU HEAR THAT? NOW THERE ARE MORE OBJECTIVELY GREAT ANIME THAN BEFORE per season. Obviously these great shows get on the air they are universally great and they will make money. The little guys, the straight to video content without prior investments and contracts up the ass. Where are they. How the fuck did Anno get away with the direction Eva took (respective to the time, it was a lot more shocking than now)? Think about that, can something like that happen today? NO IT CAN'T. You can't even dream of it.
Here's a question - how much anime do you think he actually watches a year?
Do you think he watched Madoka or Penguindrum?
Actually, has he ever produced a series, for which one cour constitutes 4.5 hours or so of animation?
What Miyazaki does is just a Japanese version of Disney. It has nothing to do with anime. That says nothing about the quality of his work. They're just separate things.
Just going to point out that your strawman doesn't apply since radio isn't dying due to shitty music.
omg, the fedora meme is my favorite :D
You know SnK is around 55k at the moment, right?
>Eh, you won't find an accepted definition on /a/. I've seen people accuse others of being normalfags simply for having a degree, well paying job, and a good social life.
It wasn't 2-3 years ago. Just another case of people trying to fit in diluting the meaning of a term by poor assumptions and comprehension. Monkeys being sprayed with water, basically.
Normalfags are/were people who, like I said, put normal activities on a pedestal at the behest of their own personal interests, damn others (or themselves) for not having normal interests, idealising typical behaviours, etc. Contrary to 4chan, where in the past, atypical behaviours, interests, etc. were of more importance because normal life has no relevance here - it was the place where you could talk about everything but your normal life because it usually wasn't interesting to do so.
Being normal is different to being a normalfag. You can be normal and not a normalfag if you're not constantly telling people to be more normal or boasting about how you can breathe on a semi-anonymous imageboard. Fuck, you could be outwardly normal and then the biggest lolicon mindbreak, torture, guro, futanari faceless bald fatman fetishist on the face of the Earth.
>Miyazaki is a retard
Yeah. That's why everything he says, even now that he's an old fag, it's relevant to the point that even in /a/ we passionately discuss it.
> The reason studios don't make normalfag anime is that they rarely make money off them
You can make non normalfag anime and still create good and different plots which sells a lot.
Madoka is the best and most recent example of it. The industry is getting fucking lazy, that's all about it.
People always react violently when something reminds them of their position in real life I suppose.
The fedora shaming was really a home run for SRS and tumblr. Not even the most turbonerds on 4chan can defend it, knowing what horrible shitbirds they are, they only deny "n-n-no i'm not a fedora" or try to pretend it doesn't exist.
The circle artists make and sell the doujins themselves. Do you think they fucking hire girls to do it? They don't have that kind of money.
Comiket has been female-dominated for decades. That poster is just another braindead retard who thinks Free invented female fans and gay things, just like /v/tards who think K-ON invented moe.
This guy is right. Miyakazi may technically make anime, but he's isolated enough from the rest of the industry that he doesn't have any credibility on these issues.
Anything 'grim' or with a DEEP story is normalfag.
I don't disagree with him, it's important to draw inspiration from real life in animation. Creators should also look beyond their industry for ideas and not be obsessed with pandering to hardcore anime otaku. Just aim to tell a good story, otaku pandering be dammed.
>Monkeys being sprayed with water, basically.
And like I said, the term 'normalfag' has lost all meaning on /a/. It's evolved into something different, sort of like 'waifu'.
Look man, VHS didn't kill television. I don't know why you thought radio would be different.
Right, that's why there's such a massive difference in women selling and women buying.
Oh wait, you probably are deluded enough to think women are the ones making porn doujins of all your favourite 2hus, aren't you?
What do you mean?
I just thought your memes were hilarious is all.
lol. /a/ thinks it knows more about animation than Miyazaki and probably Walt Disney.
Being here for several years, never once has any part of /a/ given that impression. I've seen rundowns because "muh NEET life > normalfag life" shit goes on quite often.
I didn't read it all but I think anime is going to get to a point like the modern comic book industry in the west. It will go from this mega merchandizing super selling powerful industry to a tiny speck because it becomes too "mature", too elitist, and too niche or specialized. Moeshit could be the end of the anime industry, just as "edgy grimdarksad" killed American comic books.
Epic, so you admit it is a reddit-tumblr maymay.
Keep fighting them for the win.
>he's isolated enough from the rest of the industry
How do you know that? He told you?
>Normalfags are people who put living normally on a pedastal and normal things as if they're the magnum opus of what life has to offer
Wow this is literally the worst, most wrong, most unintelligent defiition of normalfag i've ever seen on 4chan, and all to try and prove a point, and still done poorly.
Most anime creators actually have to be concerned about their bottom lines, they can't just blow millions on shows knowing that hipsters will eat it up anyways.
He held the company back for decades. Look at Frozen's success.
I see you've never taken psych or soc courses.
I don't see what good shows have got anything to do with hipsters.
Do you have shit for brains?
Pokemon was syndicated and had theatrical releases, had multimedia merchandising, and was a dominating widespread international cultural phenomenon that everyone and their mother knew about. The entire franchise made BILLIONS. BDs mean fucking shit in comparison. SNK is a drop in the pond in terms of total profits and cultural recognition, and is no different from any other fad such as Bleach, Naruto, or DN. Which also didn't kill anime.
How is this guy such a fucking goldmine? Every single movie he makes vastly outsell mainstream shit like dbz, one piece and pokemon. His movies have grossed like what, almost a billion usd worldwide?
Hes also the only anime creator to have oscar success. I dont get it, his films aren't bad but there not spectacular.
They spawned it, but nothing Peirces The Veil of Creepy Nerds better than the fedora meme. It's downright scary how effective it is
If that's the kind of biological meme weaponry SRS and SJWers have up it's sleeve, you won't win this War For The Internet.
You can see this on how absolutely **DESPERATE** /pol/ is and was to try and pathetically retcon fedora to me 'aa-a-a-anyone whos' an a-a-a-athiest" when of course the real meaning of fedora is creepy permavirgin mens right activist racist sexist 4channer turobnerd anime otaku NEET loser.
It had a very well-paced story, well-developed characters (outside of maybe Kyouko), and shitloads of pretty well-executed symbolism and references, not to mention some kickass art (even with all the delicious QUALITY of the original broadcast).
you realize that people like miyazaki and game devs are all too busy to spend all day watching cartoons and playing games.
You are correct. I don't have time for burn courses in my degree, unfortunately.
I can sympathize with him, in a way. Most fan service is shit compared to real porn that you can get in doujinshi to the point that it is more annoying than arousing. I'd rather they dial it back in the shows and leave the porn to the experts.
Oh shit nigga, the japs like something I don't like.
Want to know something else that sold tons? Gundam SEED Destiny.
But at what cost anon, AT WHAT COST?
Well it's always nice to give it's audience what it wants but sometimes, it becomes completely unneeded and very distracting.
Frozen was in production hell for decades and used some of Walt's old ideas when he wanted to make the movie decades ago but decided it simply wouldn't work out.
lol yeah bro
the power of memes is so incredible
fite da powa :D
You haven't answered my question yet.
How do you know Miyazaki hasn't watched some shows from nowadays? Did you read that? If so, provide link.
its the name. He makes one great film and everything he makes is automatically great
5 monkeys in a room with a ladder with food at the top. When one gets the food, all are sprayed with water and learn not to. One gets replaced and when it goes for the food, it gets beaten up. You eventually replace the others until they beat up other monkeys for going up the ladder without knowing the consequence of being sprayed by water. Similarly, things get diluted here and people use words without knowing when to use them.
Been here for almost a decade now, [un]fortunately. You need to lurk more and get a better understanding of how things worked in the past.
>any of your favorite shows not getting another season
Most of my favorite shows don't need a second season. The only thing I want is more Madoka and more Kino, and at least one of those has a decent shot of happening,
>8 buzzwords in one sentence
Just pointing out from the side lines how horribly you're losing the war.
SRS has made inroads and conquered parts of 4chan. Meanwhile, they sit immune from counter-attack.
>Comparing it to Hyouka, Paranoia Agent or Baccano
TTGL is the most overrated anime ever, it's a fucking mess that tells more than it shows, but the characters literally yell out what the story is trying to do so loud people believe it's well told. The first half was really good, though.
He built the multi-billion dollar company that allowed for Frozen's success and then went on to influence stuff like Astroboy. Guy was a pioneer; even the anime industry would have developed very differently without him, all the way from its beginning.
Buzzword more, maybe someone will bite.
> that anime now has become so fucking corporate and therefore fans dictate so much of what is made or not, that most anime is made to consumer demand
And the OVA market wasn't exactly this, too? You realize they were funded directly by consumer demand and failed otherwise? But then you talk about "the straight to video little guys" being free of corporate demand...I don't understand you. Which is the enemy? Consumer demand or corporate demand?
And Evangelion was also an EXCEPTION in terms of how it got funded and produced, and did a lot of things radical at the time, so don't use it as an example
he doesn't watch the shows like otaku do because hes a famous guy who runs a company. He can't spend all day ina basement.
>otaku is a buzzword
>NEET is a buzzword
>virgin is a buzzword
>sexist is a buzzword
>racist is a buzzword
>4channer is a buzzword
>turbonerd is a buzzword
>loser is a buzzword
>mens right activist is a buzzword
>creepy is a buzzword
>everything that describes the people I like and associate with is a buzzword
And yes, I'm aware this is television. It's basically all the shit you get with USA television networks.
Buzzword by itself is a Buzzword.
I can't believe there's someone autistic enough to relate websites to warring countries.
FUK THE KIKES
>Been here for almost a decade now, [un]fortunately. You need to lurk more and get a better understanding of how things worked in the past.
Not him, but I've been here since 05. Normalfag never meant what you think it does. Unless you can get up hard evidence, you have no argument.
If I don't like it, it can't be popular!
Although you probably haven't even watched half of his films
What do you think the W in SJW means, you colossal retard?
Christ, do you even know what is going on 4chan? Do you know why kinomod was de-modded, why rapeape (confirmed SRS plant) was made a mod? Why /co/ was overtaken and now is tumblr incarnate?
>that tells more than it shows
>implying that is an inherent problem
Don't a lot of anime directors respect Walt? I remember reading somewhere some of them cite him as their primary influence.
Please remember to report this idiot.
>It's author X gets commissioned to write a story pandering to demographic Y, publicists and producers are already invested in the anime before the book even hits the shelves.
What are you even talking about?
>You hate me? Think I'm whats wrong with anime fans? Motherfucker try to imagine how much hate I have for you and what you have done.
Confirmed for IRC, do not reply, let him rot.
Then how does he know what "the cancer killing anime" is?
>KlK is pandering
>don't bitch at me when you want your hobby to be accepted by normalfag
No, fuck this guy. Anime doesn't need to be talked and known and whatever.
Muh seckret club and all works for a reason.
He just has shit taste and I do agree that that there is too much pandering character wise for the viewer in terms of characterization and other nuggets such as fanservice, but he's a goddamn fool if he thinks that sinking into the abyss isn't a better alternative to idiots who don't know what is good and what isn't by their low powerlevel and taste.
For what, observing the situation as it occurs?
I'm not the SRS that is conquering you, i'm just marvelling at how hard you're losing.
>implying directors or producers don't watch anime?
Are you serious?
Besides, he's now retired and it's not like he spends all his time working when he's not into a movie project.
Anno doesn't like Disney stuff.
He doesn't make anime, he makes animated films for his own studio, and for Disney abroad. He doesn't compete against other anime for sales, he completes against "Despicable Me" and "Turbo". And yes, if you check the highest grossing animated film in Japan for any given year, its usually something from Disney, not an anime original.
Yep. He runs a company, making anime. I'd be far more inclined to listen to Alfred Hithcock on how to make a movie than to some random gaijin on /a/, many of whom can't even read moon. Miyazaki is an experienced professional; most otaku can't even qualify as amateurs.
It jumped the shark a little too much for me towards the end. I honestly couldn't have been happier with it before that. The characters, the "wanderers journey", a family trying to reunite, the supernatural setting, the mythological stories it drew from, the mellow feel and well placed visual metaphors and of course the great OST.
Really wish the pacing and feel didn't go that crazy at the end, although I did like the very end.
We kind of are just Western otaku, you know? We can deny it, but we are. So he hates us too. But he can go fuck himself.
pretty good pasta, I r8 it an 8, in future versions you could add
>PG-13 GITS movie produced by Steven Spielberg
>Akira remake plans unshelved because of SnK/Madoka's success in the west
I love every chance I get to post this.
The same way every person who says they hate anime and never watch it does.
Just remember to change the EA to Valve, as anon recommended above!
This article was very poorly translated from Japanese.
What he actually said was about animation. Animators no longer spend time watching real humans move (because they hate humans), so they don't really animate it realistically anymore. It didn't have much to do with otaku.
Low quality b8 m8.
>PG-13 GITS movie produced by Steven Spielberg
Wait what, holy shit.
I'm pretty sure everyone got that, it's a very simple message.
he sees the obnoxious faggots who are in the lime light all the time. Its like the opinion Americans have of anime fans. Their opinion is based on in depth looking, but what is thrown in their face.
It doesn't matter what I think about him. This is how all media works.
No shit anon, we all know this, we're just here to post about why your taste is shit and everything you like should die
directed by the guy whose biggest accomplishment is that he fucked Kirsten Stewart
it's ogre before it even began
can we get some proof on this?
You realize it'll never actually get made, like every single other anime Hollywood adaptation
One of the first documented uses of normalfag and it describes people mainly talking about boring and normal things, not the weird and wonderful. It is nothing about being normal specifically, more so if you read some of the posts in that thread, but the mentality of needing to talk about normal life on 4chan. You don't go to /a/ to talk about your real life, nobody cares about that blogshit. Do all your normal things, that doesn't matter so long as you don't discuss it where it isn't relevant.
Fuck, do you not even know what the -fag suffix is denotes? If someone is a [character]fag, what does that mean? That they are that character? No, it doesn't.
And so, you can fuck right off.
There isn't even an IS thread up right now.
/a/ discusses currently airing anime, just like /tv/ mostly discusses currently airing tv. No one says harem shows are deep or profound, but that's not why people watch harem shows. They watch them because the girls are cute.
No one is saying Miyazaki isn't good at what he's trying to do, but its outside of the frame of what most of us are interested in here. It might as well be transferred to /co/ or even /tv/.
Actually reading this thread, people need proof for it
like I do, which I doubt even >>101238052
can read Japanese
Surprise, surprise. In instant, /a/'s pseudo-intellectual babble about the otaku market goes down the drain because they've been arguing it around a mistranslated article.
>They watch them because the girls are cute.
I'm not gonna google it instead of you, but it's confirmed, to be directed by Rupert Sanders. Of course the project could go nowhere like the Akira movie, but like that guy said the Akira live action remake is also rumored to be "back on track"
That's my point it was radical, how it got started wasn't radical, it became radical.
>Which is the enemy? Consumer demand or corporate demand?
Both, but I can't blame corporations for trying to make money. I'm not screaming for socializing anime. I can blame the fans sucking on some corporate cock.
OVA means it never aired on TV. Nothing to do with what I'm talking about, which is anime that are not based off some book/manga/vn/loli figure/hgame/whatthefuckever which almost all of it is now.
What if I said you that Miyazaki's films are made for refined people with taste, and normalfags only like his films superficially?
Why are you even here?
Sorry, do you disapprove of me stating objective facts or something?
See, this is why I need proof. I don't believe you.
To watch the majority of anime that isn't based on 'watching because the girls are cute'
Not that guy, but if he did, I don't think he could make such a sweeping generalization. And he's ALWAYS been dismissive of "anime". You can kind his statements. I'm pretty sure if you showed him a genuinely good anime like Tatami Galaxy he'd think it was shit.
Why are you here?
I don't see anything in that thread confirming that normalfags they think are inherently superior or put 'normal' things on a pedestal. It's just the same jealous circlejerk you see of autists hating on people for blogging on 4chan, which is the original definition of 'normalfag' as pointed out in that thread.
Thanks for proving my point that you have no idea what the term means. Goodbye ~
I don't think it's creepy, therefore it objectively isn't.
I think you are lying, I doubt Rupert would touch it.
Haremshitters have by far the worst taste of all of /a/
Even studiofags who blindlly watch every kyoani/SHAFT/etc studio are better than them
I'm fairly sure he's talking about mainstream anime, though.
Miyazaki has been saying the stuff in the OP for fucking ever, even if it is poorly translated. He hates "anime" and doesn't want anything to do with the stuff.
Sorry bro, you'll have to show some evidence of your Social Capital in order to make that claim. Because That's How It's Decided What's Creepy.
>. It's just the same jealous circlejerk you see of autists
Sup, normalfag. Too much truth for you? People like you are/were part of the problem, by using terms like autist and nerd unironically because you think you're superior to others who don't have the same values. I bet you look down on people for liking lolicon, you sick fuck.
Suuure it is. Just like Cowboy Bebop and Monster and Evangelion and every other failed western adaptation project. This shit is going nowhere.
I know that, but that doesn't dismiss my point. You can watch shows and hate the majority of them.
The old bat is going nuts, all he ever made was disney wannabe remakes anyways. He should be ashamed.
>Miyazaki has been saying the stuff in the OP for fucking ever
More likle /a/ has posted it over and over since for fucking ever.
I meant the
You are a moron aren't you? I never mentioned ghost in a shit.
All his stuff is, is disney lookalikes anyways. But Japanese.
It's the Jews.
Am I missing something? All the post you quoted were originally referring to a mistranslation of the OP. Why is it suddenly about the opld guy in KFC?
>the problem with the anime industry is it's full of otaku
How does this has anything to do with anything. As much as I respect his work, and enjoyed pretty much everything he did, he's just an old person who has one of the most comon opinions old people can have. Thinks his generation was better, that now we are all just behind our computers, not dealing with humans etc - and that for this reason we can't do good things.
Which is completely stupid, NHK is amazing and was written by a neet. The real problem of the anime industry is the same than any big media industry, is that it's more a business than anything else. It's not creativity that uses industry to allow people to make a living out of it, but the contrary. It's less about actually expressing things, telling stories, and more about making money in the cheapest and easiest way possible. And it works on both ends, make the masses retarded to enjoy shit so you can feed them shit because it's less expensive and easier to produce than real food. That's why you will see paid critics and such.
It's cool Miyazaki retired, I hope he is happy with his "10 years of creativity" that he mentions in The Wind Rises, but his opinion on that matter sound seriously stupid.
>talks about Akira
>posts ghost in a shell
>disney wannabe remakes
Except Disney is the one known to be the cancer who actually make shit remakes of everything else. Are you even trying?
Never the less, it is the case. If you want to think its creepy, then do so. But the people who want things get them. It's not like otaku are snatching "mature" "sophisticated" anime away from fans who would buy it without a second thought. People who bought IS BluRays didn't do it with money they would have spend on, I don't know, Psycho Pass, or something. They wanted what they wanted and got it. And shows like Psycho Pass succeed because there are people who want to buy that.
I'll let you in on another thing - there were probably some people who bought both Psycho Pass and IS BluRays to fulfill separate interests. Some people, more than you'd think, can like different things.
And those same people are the ones who would make fun of others who are not normal. The normal people on 4chan of old would not talk about their normal lives, the normals of the modern age do. If you do not see that difference, you certainly aren't from 05. More likely, 06 or later.
Are you even trying?
>If you want to think its creepy
It has nothing to do with what i want or think, it's been objectively determined by Those Whom Hold The Power (Society) that it's creepy. So that's stating a fact, like "The sky appears blue"
We are coming to the end of this thread
We need a new thread
Who wants to do it?
And why should anyone care?
Holy shit are you actually taking offense to being called a nerd or an autist?
What is this like your 'nigger' or something? calm down there Sheldon. Didn't know you couldn't handle some banter.
The film, in English, is called Kamba the White Lion.
There has to be other things though. It's too easy to draw cute girls for that to be all you need. They need personality. Personality goes a long way. A girl has to be ten times more charmin' than that Arnold on Green Acres to sell 10,000 BluRays, you know what I'm sayin'?
OH MY GOD OF COURSE IT JUST HIT ME
most of you went to public schools and therefore were bullied like the nerds you are
that explains everything
that explains why /a/ is so manlet (average height 5'6)
that explains your violent reaction to being called nerds (it's just a word guys calm the fuck down)
you seem to be on Miyazaki's side, please join him and hate anime together
This isn't about stuff like NHK. The problem is unambitious otaku pandering moeshit, dummy.
>We need a new thread
He's basically going to be dismissive of anything with moe elements. But there are plenty of good series with moe elements. You think he'd like Joshiraku? I doubt it.
>They need personality.
What for? There are already established muh archetypes everyone's just pretty much copy pasting over every new character.
And you are a rich private schooling punk right?
>losing an argument
>you are on miyazaki's side, enemy of anime, hurr durr
Do you have a personality?
Anno has good taste preferring tex avery to disney
Grab me an /a/ poll, your ass isn't a good place to pull things from.
To equate vague social judgments with scientific facts is the height of foolishness.
>going to a shitty atheist public school full of minorities, angry bullies, and bitter bullied nerds
don't make me tip my hat at you boy
If you love anime so much why haven't you created any like Miyazaki? How much do you even contribute to the industry?
The sky appears blue is not a scientific fact, it's called qualia, something your precious science can never explain.
If fanservice is good, then I can enjoy it. If it's bad, I can usually ignore it. Very seldom is there a show that has blatant sexual fanservice at such an awful time that it pulls me out of an otherwise great engaging moment. The issue with KlK is that it's just bad, it has nothing to do with the fanservice.
Didn't even build a coherent sentence there boy.
I believe in god to and went to a public school.
Yet he did explain the reason why such unambitious otaku pandering moeshit exists. The market wants to make money and consequently there are people who buy it. So they mass produce generic shit. Consumerism. It's simple as that. One however cannot help but critique the demand for such generic moeshit. This demand coming from the Otaku community. It's the community that dictates the quality of anime. However to say it is their fault would be an oversimplification and extremely naive. Because when something innovative does come out and is well received the suppliers will try to copy what they did right and mass produce the same kind of thing. However these copies are no longer innovative and through time it degenerates into a form of shallow entertainment that serves no purpose other than to pander.
>Visual medium that has its own unique strengths
>Doing a shit job showing and instead telling is ok
It is most definitely an inherent problem.
Nope. If you've got 10 moe shows with their eyes on the prize, they gotta do something to distinguish themselves. Look at the sales for any given cour - most moe shows tank. You've got to either have personality, or ad in some other kind of fanservice, like "nobody wears pants and its WWII" with Strike Witches. Cute isn't easy to define. If they could just put moe in a bottle and sell it, you know they would, but they can't so they won't.
yeah I just took NHK as an example that you don't necessarly have to be outside living with other people to shit out something good.
The rest of my post was actually about the anime industry and these otaku.
Good job repeating something you vaguely recall reading on Wikipedia. The similarities are really superficial. The plots are absolutely nothing alike.
Though The Lion King is practically an adaptation of Hamlet.
>We need a new thread
yes, yes we do.
Isn't that word "manlet" like a /fit/ thing?
Hey you, go back to /fit/, we don't need any of your protein granola bars here.
Uhm no, disney copied it, stop getting so butthurt that I won and u lost
Good fucking god no
We already had like 2
I don't even like Daniel Dennet, but the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
WHy not 13?
Which "generic moeshit" is airing this season, anon?
I'll have to read through that after my chinese cartoon is done, thanks anon.
Practially all of it, it's not good anime
>No specific examples
>posting a youtube video hoping to explain things
please stop trying
Not that guy, but my guess is the absolute shit that Kadokawa (ASCII, etc) pumps out that now is the the pipeline for most late night anime. LN are really no different from shitty grocery store romance novels.
Perhaps you are different, but I tend to not enjoy shit.
DO you like Studio Deen?
it sounds like you do.
>but I tend to not enjoy shit.
But you watch anime and I bet you don't even watch films.
List them now, and how many episodes you've watched of each.
I watched Superman's remake, it was really good and true to the comic
so yes I do watch stuff that isn't shit like films.
>One however cannot help but critique the demand for such generic moeshit
Moe isn't taking the money away from "mature" anime. If it wasn't moe, it would be something else you didn't like that appeals to the demographic most likely to buy the product. You need to stop thinking with retard supply side Reaganomics thinking that supply creates demand. The world doesn't work that way.
Are you simply here to deny the existence of a well known problem- that extremely generic and overused themes are continuing to be prevalent in anime? (For example generic moeshit)? May not have been this season but let's not forget the Kyoukai no Shit that came out last season.
So now you may ask well what about now?
One possible explanation. KnK's ratings were shit. Moe generic shows in general has trash rating. So why continue an uneconomic strategy? That's in the mind of the anime industry. And so in time they will stop and end up finding some new trend which will replace the moeshit. It's how it always is. Remember gundams?
Well yeah, Noragami, Sekai Seifuku, Wizard Barristers and Gundam are all about cute girls. And SYD is basically nothing but cute girls. Literally nothing else there people like. Nope. Nothing else at all in any of these shows.
I watched 29 anime from this season. There isn't a single show I would call very good or mature. I enjoyed Sekai Seifuku, though.
But honestly, anime isn't really that far from Western cartoons (especially older CN shows) in terms of quality.
I really hope you're not talking about Man of Steel because the fight scenes were the only decent thing about it.
I specifically stated that demand dictates supply not the other way around. So thus one cannot help but critique the demand for shit anime. Supply doesn't create demand. I never said that.
>KnK was shit
>Sold better than most shows
>Shitposters are just angry about Free and can't come up with a coherent thought as to why it's bad
>Show had plenty of active threads with plenty of stuff to discuss in threads and no shitposting after the retards left, all very constructive
You're an idiot.
>SYD is basically nothing but cute girls
Are you really watching SYD at all?
Disc sales are not the only thing powering the anime industry. There are tons of different types of merchandise.
Also, not every attempt at getting a formula right will result in success. Of course there will be some who diverge but there is a well established market that can be satisfied with the right twist in the formula.
Nips loved SEED and are currently getting an HD remaster of it.
>I watched Superman's remake, it was really good
As I was typing that I thought "I wonder if anyone will miss the sarcasm here." Then I thought "No, it's so obvious."
The only other thread I have open now is the SYD thread.
Even if its true that this particular cour isn't so great, but 2011 for example was chock-a-bloc with great shows, and as long as those people are still working, there's no reason to think we won't see great anime.
That doesn't deny the fact that the suppliers (the anime industry) are only responded to the demand (the otaku community). If they like moeshit the anime industry makes more moeshit. It's how it works. A bit simply off course but that is what most of it boils down to.
>the incredibly dedicated fans are the problem
Yeah, no. That's just bullshit. The problem are directors, animators and producers who don't make what they want to make because they don't make the profits they want. If somethings good, it'll have a fanbase; it has nothing to do with otaku. They just use the "moeshit" as a scapegoat for their inability to make a good anime or for their greediness (we don't make enough money unless we pander).
You still haven't listed all the moeshit this season, anon. Do it now, your argument relies on it. If you say every show this season is moeshit, then say how each one is.
And this is my point, anime is a free market, and will be driven by the demands of the otaku.
You said, "The market wants to make money and consequently there are people who buy it."
Except "moeshit" isn't nearly as big of a problem as you think it is. There's one, maybe two "pure moeshit" (I hate you for using this terminology) shows per season, and for the most part they're enjoyable and don't even sell that well. The biggest sellers are blockbusters like Madoka or SnK that appeal to big audiences. The only real problem now is how the market is set up where shitty harems and romcom are adapted from shitty LN by the truckload because they have low overhead and make enough profit because they absolutely know people will buy. It's be nice for hte OVA bubble to come back, but that's gone. And while there are a few too many shitty LN adaptations but they aren't enough to ruin the industry. There are still plenty of other things worth watching.
>I watched 29 anime from this season. There isn't a single show I would call very good or mature.
I wasn't asking if you liked them, but which ones he thought were moeshit or not.
You don't understand. All those shows are essentially moeshit to him. I think he's using the word to apply to everything that he thinks is too "anime", or just anything he doesn't like.
Ah you exposed a problem I had ignored. That is true. Typically many people make moe shit and crappy LN adaptations as synonymous with one another.
you are an idioit.
There are people in this thread who seem to be so strongly against currently airing anime that I didn't have any threshold on "this is too stupid an opinion to be real".
Moeshit doesn't mean anything. I don't use this idiotic term.
Ignorant morons call everything moeshit - harems, romcoms, slice of life, ecchi, and so on.
Too "anime." What do you mean by that? If you mean: same personality characters, predictable plot, with the same basic structure then yes. You should stop consuming whatever shit is presented in front of you.
So what should we call these harems romcoms and slice of life? Bad anime?
What about NouCome? I thought it was a clever series that poked fun at tropes while still having cute girls, cut I'm sure some would dismiss it unfairly as just another LN adaptation.
And actually, isn't Spice and Wolf and LN adaptation?
Question for you then. If they are doing this for greediness then it would require a demand. Is that not true? So who should we blame here? Them or us?
"Anime I don't like".
Frankly, almost all series have cute girls.
Not all LN are bad. Spice and wolf, Baccano just to name two.
Dogs are cool, man.. what the fuck is your problem?!.. you're sick.
anime a shit
>don't watch anime
>still participate in anime discussions
Why do people do this?
Yes, it's also based around a cute girl. Must be moeshit.
There are good and bad versions of all those things.
Anon to be a true otaku you must learn every aspect of Anime and Manga. The Elitist and Limited vision of the White Knights is not enough.
I know that what you have seen until now are the basic pillars in which you build your culture. And then you use that culture to be cool, to get laid.
That is the ultimate goal of every White Knight. But does it work? No.
Learn the Moe side of Anime.
AHA! And finally the issue is ultimately exposed. This whole thread is one massive argument about, generally, two groups. One that hates these kind of anime and one that doesn't.
My fault for feeding the retard I guess.
>Ah you exposed a problem I had ignored.
No, I exposed the only problem in the industry and proceeded to explain that it isn't actually a big deal.
>Can't make an actual point
If you think we need more of what I said the only issue in anime is, then you're literally retarded.
I find it funny how you people claim that just because someone doesn't like romcom, SOL, and harems automatically hate anime when there are so many other genres (although have far fewer anime in them) of anime out there. Face it. You don't like people criticizing your tastes.
Ok I guess. But I really made sure to stick the sarcasm in there.
But I'm always amazed at how stupid some people are so I guess I can't fault you.
He also can't spell "idiot".
>>Code Geass >>Quality storytelling
Certainly not all the time, but there are parts where it does qualify.
I think I missed the closing part of the sentence. Drowsiness and all.
People who like romcoms, harems, slice of life anime, will demonize those who criticize them, calling them "anime haters"
Those who criticize these shows end up calling those who watch it "shit tasters." Those who criticize these kinds of anime are only people who want less of them and more of what they like because they are unsatisfied with the anime trend.
That's all it is.
It's the problem with this whole culture. It's even worse with visual and light novels. Otaku are hopeless fetishists without much interest in real culture.
Anime just follows.
It's often good when something is made for niche audience. But in this case the niche audience is even worse and more shallow than mainstream.
I'm the one who made the big post. I loved Noucome. The characters were all likable. The MC was actually a popular kid who got cursed by a curious God. The jokes were funny and the directing (especially episode 9) was great.
There are plenty of good harems and romcom, there are just plenty of shitty ones too.
Congratulations, Sherlock, nice exposition.
>will demonize those who criticize them
I think that's generally most of the time the person that offers "criticism", if you can call it that, just shitposts and uses buzzwords like "moeblobs", "haremshit", etc without actually postulating an argument.
Ouch. The truth hurts.
We need a new thread for this.
You belong in the first group don't you?
Actually it's because of the fact that they admit they hate practically all anime and that it's all shit.
I saw the lack of capitalization and stopped caring what he said because he couldn't be fucked to type like an adulte. Good catch.
Nope. I just said harems and romcom have the highest chance of being shit, but there are plenty I like, too. I just want less shit and a little shift in how companies market and make money.
Get some sleep or watch some anime, this thread isn't worth wasting time over.
What are your top 5 anime?
No we fucking don't.
>more anime being produced than ever
>more quality anime series per season than ever
>"moeshit is taking over the industry, there are no decent series anymore. The only decent anime in recent times was SnK. Remember the glory days of anime when there were quality titles like Cowboy Bebop, Trigun, Rurouni Kenshin, Death Note, and Outlaw Star?"
I will never understand these people. Even if there was supposedly only one "good" anime a season you'd have 4 great anime per year and that far outstrips the number of good series that were being produced during the "golden era of anime" (aka "cherrypicked series from over two decades of broadcasts and OVAs")
Nice assumptions. No, I don't really watch many romcoms because I think they're mostly boring because of the generally self-insert-y MCs that are typical of light novels.
I just think people that just shitpost about "bawwww moe exists" without actually legitimately providing any arguments about any specific shows and generally forgetting that there's been cute girl pandering since like, the 60s are annoying.
Sometimes you have to state the obvious to prove a point: all this arguing is just people try to prove they have superior taste. It's quite silly.
The only good anime are mature adult intellectual cyberpunk or deep philosophical avant-garde works of art. This applies to every single medium - any piece of fiction media that doesn't fit those two holes is cancerous pandering bullshit for the simpleminded masses that I am far above. I am not entertained by mere pretty pictures or basic desires. I require deep neurological stimulation, something anime simply doesn't offer anymore, ever since Kyoani made K-ON.