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Would you watch an anime that chronicles world war 2 through the eyes of japanese soldiers? Im not talking about lolis replacing grown men like girls und panzer and Im not talking about light comedy. I mean graphic depiction of war with the MC and his friends being mere teenagers drafted into the war. Would you watch the anime if it takes turns in POV by switching to Americans, Russians, and Germans as the series progresses?
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>>100828361
> Im not talking about lolis replacing grown men
no
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>Im not talking about lolis replacing grown men
Then what's the point of making it an anime?
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I don't think anime is the proper medium to depict gritty real life war scenes.
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No.
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>>100828361
This thread is now a focus on ww2 with lolis
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>>100828407

Pretty much.
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No. Japanese people can't make war anime.

They can make anime about the aftermath of war, but not about combat.
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>>100828469
I would so watch this.
Rommel and Hitler-chan absolutely have to get their episodes or a spinoff.
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>>100828469
>dat uniform
Can you spell sniper-bait?
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Japs did horrible things to China and SEA in general. I think they are too ashamed for making something related to WW2 that isn't based in blond western girls.
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>So I'm basicly gonna take your nip money and make a show about how much nips suck and try and sell that show to the nips

Who would fund this shit?
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>>100828563

Yanks nuked cities full of innocent civilians and they are not ashamed about anything.
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I would rather watch an anime about that Japanese Russian PoV and his experiences in Russian prison camps.

There's a website about him and his experiences now with drawing he did, but I don't have the link now because I was stupid and didn't save it.
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>>100828621
Wasn't there an anime about Hiroshima? Forgot its name
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>>100828621
If you're going to complain about the yanks killing civilians, why focus on the nukes when there's stuff like the bombings of Dresden and the firebombing of Tokyo?

The nukes where nowhere near the worst thing that happened during the war. Not even the worst thing that the Americans did during the war.
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>>100828639
Oh fuck I remember that.
It was a movie.
The name escapes me.
>>
>Cocky assholes who suck up to their commanders
>Perform war crimes because "Fuck you, we're Japan"
>Think they can slap the US without consequence
>Proceed to get anally raped for a decade
>US offers to lube, they reject because "Fuck you, we're Japan"
>US drops two fat loads on them and they collapse
>Start killing themselves out of shame
>Decades later, blame the US for everything
I don't know why it became anal sex halfway through.
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>>100828361

Letters from Iwo Jima was a good movie and popular in Japan despite being an anti-war movie at heart.
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>>100828407
>>100828494
>anime is only for childish or perverted content

Seriously? You're on /a/ and you're spouting normalfag-opinions? Not that I disagree that majority of the output aren't those things, but you can easily put out serious grim-dark stuff with the right character design, art-style, and direction.
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>>100828667
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfJZ6nwxD38
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>>100828757
Nice, that was it.
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>>100828716
>>anime is only for childish or perverted content
>normalfag-opinion
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>>100828655

>We saw terrible things: cremated adults shrunk to the size of small children, pieces of arms and legs, dead people, whole families burnt to death, burning people ran to and fro, burnt coaches filled with civilian refugees, dead rescuers and soldiers, many were calling and looking for their children and families, and fire everywhere, everywhere fire, and all the time the hot wind of the firestorm threw people back into the burning houses they were trying to escape from.

>I cannot forget these terrible details. I can never forget them.

American = monkey same
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>>100828677

This is what happens when you let your government and high military command be taken over by jingoistic retards.
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>>100828716
I'm with him, actually.

I've seen anime tackle heavy themes, have mature plots and be overall excellent, but I've never seen anime represent a battle well, let alone a war. I'm not sure exactly what prevents them from doing so, but realistic combat is one of those things anime absolutely cannot do.

So while I think that anime can put out serious grim-dark stuff, I don't think anime can put out a serious war movie on par with what the US, the Russians or the Germans can put out.
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>>100828361

>Anime about actual things

No one but /a/ will like it.
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>>100828361
Why not a lone wolf loli sniper surviving the war
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No, I'd rather have a Blackadder goes forth anime with lolis.
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>>100828361
If it's done well I would, but I'd rather watch something about lolis.
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>>100828716
Anime is primarily a lighthearted medium. There is nothing "normalfag" about stating that fact. Sure it can produce more serious stuff about real life, but it is not its prime material. A "war anime" would either fail because:
1) The fact that you have cartoon characters instead of real life actors would detract from the realism of the war
2) Any fantasist or less than serious take on it would completely nullify the whole point of making an anime that you want to be as historically accurate as possible in the first place

That has nothing to do with misconceptions of anime. If anything, it's normalfags who'd not understand why there can never be a GOOD anime adaptation of topic X or Y. Some things are better left to history books and documentaries.
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>>100828815
>jingoistic retards
You mean people like Patton and MacArthur, or maybe people like Churchill?
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>>100828801

How does American war crime in any way mitigate war crimes committed against Asian populations by Japan?

The fallacy behind that reasoning is it's tantamount to arguing that war crimes somehow offset each other. It doesn't, both sides are responsible for their own actions, but it's erroneous to just subtract both sides of the ledger and say that no one has to take responsibility.

Even if it did, the only war crime that would be offset would be the ones committed by the Japanese against Americans, and vice versa. Japanese war crimes against SEA and China would still stand
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>>100828386
>>100828402
this is why anime is shit
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>>100828856
A thousand time this, General Mel-chan going "Baa" in loli voice would be hilarious.
The ending is also going to be a thousand time worse.
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>>100828407
just think beserk but without the fairies and silver haired faggots
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>>100828938

The important modifier there was "retards". Individuals can be jingoistic and still be successful and competent in many respects.

Patton was successful, so his failing (being jingostic as fuck) didn't screw over an entire nation and its population.

Most of the IJA command was jingoistic and woefully incompetent.
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>>100828981
Yep, guess it's time for you to find a new hobby and leave /a/ forever.
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>>100828716

>Anime
>Serious

At that point it'll barely be anime. I mean, a typical anime will have an ultra powerful MC with a fuckton of harem sluts and all that retarded shit. While anime can be good without those things, the painful tropes still exist everywhere
>Any anime battle
>HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
>IMSOFUCKINGPISSEDHOLYSHITO
>Some stupid superhuman shit occurs

Granted just because it hasn't been done before it doesn't mean people shouldn't try, but is there anyone out there that does shit that isn't moe anymore?

Dat Hitler yuri end tho
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>>100829016

I guess a better example would be TR, who was arguably the most jingoistic President, but he was highly competent and helped begin the transition of the United States into a superpower.

It's a fair criticism to say that TR's jingoism was objectionable and wrong, but probably unfair to say he was a moron.
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>>100828927
>Anime is primarily a lighthearted medium

No it isn't. There's nothing about animation as a medium that makes it inherently specific for any one thing. There are so many varied techniques you can do with animation to tell all kinds of stories. It's just that there's no demand for serious war stuff.

>drawn images can't properly depict realism

Are you serious?

And a good war story doesn't need to go the purely realistic and super historically accurate route either. It could take a surreal approach to better show the emotional warping of soldiers and the madness of war.
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>>100828927
To add on this, the only anime that subverts this rule in my mind is something like Grave of the Fireflies, except it doesn't focuses so much on the war itself, and is more of a great drama film. Thing is, it's a great film "despite" being anime (or because in this case, since you're able to relate to the kids better), but it didn't NEED to be anime in the first place.
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>>100829016
>IJA
Actually, the IJA lost most of its political power very early on in the war due to the defeats suffered at the hands of the Soviets, which almost directly led to the IJN gaining enough political traction to get their budget increased and their plans approved. I don't think they ever recovered.

Still, it's unfair to call the IJN leadership woefully incompetent. Their plans were well though out and their operations were decently planned. Calling them incompetent does a disservice both to them and to the US forces that defeated them.
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>>100828361

As much as I want it to happen, it wouldn't because of
> Im not talking about lolis replacing grown men like girls und panzer and Im not talking about light comedy.

There wouldn't be an audience to make this. Anime now is little more than SoL and "cute girls doing cute things", it would sell like shit, and would only lose money. For this to happen, I'd have to win something big and fund it myself.

>>100828832

It can depict combat pretty well, if it tries. I recommend watching "The Cockpit" on YouTube to see what I'm talking about.

>inb4 tumblr

Google image search brings it up...
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So is this thread actually telling me that Animu is now just a medium used to pander to otaku and to monetize original contents more? So Anime is now just limited to shitty LNs and anything that has moe and uguu?

I think having a gritty war anime is indeed a little too much for anime but if what I'm asking aboe is true, then that's just sad.
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>>100829182
>tumblr
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>>100829188
No one has said that. You're dramatizing and spinning this into a false "anime can only be X" argument. We only said an war anime film wouldn't be good.
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>>100829188
>monetize original contents more

Yes, sadly that's how businesses work.
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>>100829210

Here, have more.
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>making an anime about the darkest times in human history

japan is stupid but no THAT stupid

I'd probably watch it though
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>>100829188
Absolutely correct, anime is dead, you should get out before you are also dead.
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>>100829182
>>100829272
It's the quality that pisses me off about tumblr gifs the most. It's quite shit.
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>>100828938
They were hawks, certainly. But none of them had the disregard for foreign powers and their own governments that Japan's military command had. Japan's military took advantage of their nation, getting into wars to force the government to increase funding, or face a coup.

An anecdotal tale from the strike force tasked with attacking Pearl Harbor was that enroute, the crew had privately agreed to ignore a ceasefire order from command if the US agreed to non-aggression demands. Rather than turn back without attacking, they planned to attack anyway, claiming that radio trouble prevented the order from being received. They cared about nothing other than the glory of personal achievement.
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>>100829092
A limited budget and an inherent lower fps don't add up when you want as much realism as possible. Otherwise we'd have 20-minute sakuga anime. Maybe there isn't anything that animation as a TECHNIQUE can't depict, given enough time and budget, but anime as a MEDIUM is not the most appropriate. Why do you try so hard to debate this? It's not pointing a shortcoming of anime, simply saying it's best for some things, and not so good for others. Like every medium.
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>>100828677

I sure hope you're not implying the Nagasaki and Hiroshima bombings were actually necessary in any way.
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>>100828361

I think it would be awesome if done right
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>>100828984
>Baldric is the ditzy, airheaded loli
>George is the genki-girl with a kansai-ben
>Darling is the meganekko student-council archetype all about RURRRUS

Blackadder would be... You know what, I think it'd be funnier if he was just kept as his original self. Maybe even have a live-action figure interacting with 2d lolis, or have him rotoscoped to show that he's really the only sane one of the bunch and clearly not fit for his world.
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>>100829341
I try so hard for the same reason you try to debate it the other way. I just don't see it the same way you do, and I strongly disagree with the view that you need to have a realistic style to have a strong emotional effect on the audience.
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>>100829333
>disregard for foreign powers and their own governments
That's basically MacArthur's entire character summed up in one sentence.

Its a good thing Truman booted him off when he did because it's not at all clear if he would be able to do that if he had hesitated a bit more. It's entirely possible that had MacArthur gotten his way, we'd have had a repeat of Japan's trajectory during WW2.
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>>100829092
if you think like that
put Harem, cutegirl doing cute things, insert any of you think shit of anime to the other medium
hell fucking no, you won't see any idiotic but funny scene like punch in the face by your harem, or slow motion ripped cloth in battle, or even the goddamn fucking beach episode
stop pushing your shitty mind when from the beggining it's not fit for it, you can fuck another medium for this.
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>>100829385

Why are the men so fucking happy in that picture?
>House is burning down
>Fuck yeah

>>100829092

Anime as a whole has really failed to be realistic lately, but it probably can be done, although realism is not something I personally think would be necessary.
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Why even have a discussion about it. Zipang is already pretty close to WW2 through Japanese eyes.
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I wouldn't like it unless it had Gundams
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>>100829446
Consider it this way: when someone asks a question like "would you watch an anime about X?", the idea is that there is something more entertaining or "better" that would result from it being in an anime format. I wouldn't watch an anime adaptation of Letters from Iwo Jima, because it is already good as a live-action film, and it would be not so good as an anime.
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>>100828981
Are you implying that replacing the cast of anything ever with little girls wouldn't make it infinitely better?
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>>100829524
See that's the thing, I think both live-action and animation are neutral grounds for a war story. While I wouldn't really care to see an anime version of Iwo Jima, had it originally been an anime (and done competently), I also wouldn't care to see a live-action version of it either.
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>>100829347
The US had three options:
- Accept conditional surrender from Japan, allowing fascist powers in Japan to remain and eventually return, causing further atrocities in the name of Japanese imperialism
- Carry out a land invasion, which "would cost at minimum one quarter of a million casualties, and might cost as much as a million, on the American side alone, with an equal number of the enemy", as a conservative estimate (modern historians believe the number would total over 3 million dead, 22 Japanese for every American)
- Use nuclear weapons on two cities, after announcing which cities they'd be and releasing treatment information for radiation sickness (confiscated by Japan's military), resulting in ~250k dead (many if not all preventable)
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>>100828469
Now, think about that again and imagine cute loli Nazis get thrown flames at by flamethrowers, bombed, head-shoted with all the visual effects of brain splattering, mutilated with guts out of their disemboweled cracasses, etc.
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>>100829333

Well an embargo on oil and iron in the midst of war is basically is an act of aggression altogether. I'm not justifying Pearl Harbor bombings, but it's hardly an example of the US moral righteousness vs. Japanese wickedness. There was mutual antagonism on both sides.
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>>100829637
>here is FUCKING BOMBS
>yes we were just at war but don't worry we won't backstab
>here's radiation treatment from glorious US
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>>100829188
Even if it wasn't, I doubt there are any creators gutsy enough to really take on Japan's involvement in WWII. A lot of the time it feels like there's a lot of dancing around it.
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>>100829737

kawaii
BDs when
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>>100829464
Except it's not MacArthur, because when Truman ordered him to lay off the Pacific, MacArthur obeyed.
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>>100829637
>releasing treatment information for radiation sickness (confiscated by Japan's military)
>(many if not all preventable)
do you really think amerifat has that kind of information?
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>>100829390
>Blackadder as Blackadder while the rest is genderbended
There's so much potential for him to comment and retort on everything, like how surreal his situation it. Would be hilarious.
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>>100829182
>The Cockpit
Yes, that's pretty decent as far as anime goes. Personal opinion here, but I don't think it's very good in the grand scheme of things (war movies, that is).

Anyway, that's not entirely what I meant when I said that anime can't depict combat. When I said that, I was thinking about a war movie in the style of what OP is suggesting (not necessarily World War 2 because that's a bag of worms I'm not willing to tackle), something like The Pacific or Stalingrad (1993, not that 2013 abomination) or Full Metal Jacket, with larger scale combat and battles, focusing on the unit and not individual stories in a narrow frame. And I'm sure animation as a medium is capable of doing it, but I don't think any current Anime studio can pull it off well enough, without falling into their usual tropes of unrealistic battles and tactics (LoGH, mecha anime in general, etc), cute girls or out of place girls (GuP, Upotte), special snowflake MCs and supernatural powers (First Squad), or a multitude of other shit infesting modern anime.

To summarize my point: Can an anime in the style of a war movie be made? In theory, yes, animation as a medium can provide for it. Can it be done in the current anime market? I don't think so. And if it was done, I'd rather seen an anime adaption of Come and See than an anime adaptation of Band of Brothers. I think current anime is more suited to that style of grim dark.
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>>100829761
>just at war
The information airdrop was several weeks before the bombing, so the civilians had time to evacuate (Japanese military threatened death for anyone who evacuated), and medical facilities knew how to treat those who stayed behind (Japanese military confiscated and suppressed that information).
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>>100829833
I apologize for my fellow American.

>>100829881
I don't know, that FMJ anime sounds pretty damn nice.
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>>100829881

Like I said, there's already something pretty close. Watch Zipang, I won't spoonfeed again.
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>>100829956
Zipang is shit.
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>>100829907
Oh yeah shit I totally forgot, if we warn them about bombings then we aren't at war. I forget which part of the Bullshit Convention that is. And I'm saying the Jap military/leaders/etc wouldn't take handouts from the country that just whupped their ass.
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>>100829744
Both America and Japan had imperial ambitions in the Far East. The oil embargo was merely a reasonable response to Japan's war with China threatening the US's position in Southeast Asia. Yes, neither countries are moral beacons, as is the case for any major power in the age of imperialism, but Japan is clearly the aggressor as far as WW2 is concerned..
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>>100829833
They were the only ones in the world who had detonated a nuclear weapon at that time. The knowledge they gave to Japan's academia (or rather attempted to give) contained everything they knew about the the weapon's effects, and their best hypothesis for treatment. They didn't want a bloodbath; they wanted their boys home for Christmas.
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>>100829771
>I doubt there are any creators gutsy enough to really take on Japan's involvement in WWII

There is only one man we can count on.
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>>100829968
You're missing the point: the airdrops were before the bombings, before Japan had surrendered. There was no "just at war" or "aren't at war", because they were at war.
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>>100828361
I thought there was a Miyazaki movie about this. It caught some flak for portraying Japan and the Zero in a sympathetic light.
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>>100829637

Yes I know, I've heard the ultimatums since I was a kid. Japan was in rough shape and would have surrendered regardless. The first option is funny though. It's as if WW2 brought an end of fascism. The US government has since aided fascism as long as it can be controlled and in their interest.
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>>100829498
no idea
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>>100829833
The effects of radiation on the human body were fairly well understood (by scientists, if not by the public in general) thanks to the enthusiastic efforts of the French and other such promoters of the miracle of Radon.
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>>100830049
>at this point in time there are fucking bombs
>speaking from a future point in time, I say that we were recently at war but etc etc

Sorry for the mixup.
>>
I'm not sure they would want to risk pissing of America and France And UK
Despite what /a/ likes to think the anime industry is relevant outside Japan
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>>100828856
>>100828984
>>100829390
>>100829854
Where do I submit my funding?
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>>100830137
I don't remember the last time an anime ever affected anywhere but the anime community besides maybe Miyazaki.
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>>100830137
>the anime industry is relevant outside Japan
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>>100830105
GotF is more of a SoL film, albeit a dramatic and depressing one.
There was little need for incredible animation and the few shocking shots are very brief.
(If you were responding to the realism part)
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>>100830174
Tripfag General
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>>100830103
>would have surrendered regardless
lolno. The plan in Japan before the bombings was to order every Japanese citizen to lay down their lives in defense of the emperor, should a land invasion occur. Think children going up to American soldiers, and detonating a grenade; housewives rushing Americans with kitchen knives. "Even one dead American is an honorable act".

>>100830124
I forgive your poor wording.
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>>100830199
I posted the BFG pictures
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Would /a/ watch a SOL about a revolution?
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>>100830211
Even though I said "were" and not "are" I accept your forgiveness.
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>>100830256
There is already one about the French Revolution, which is as dramatic as you can get while staying interesting.
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>>100830256
http://anidb.net/a4396
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>>100830256
Did you not watch Valvrave or something?
It was truly revolutionizing.
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>>100830256
Which revolution?
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>>100830256
It's called Sekai Seifuku
Yes. I would watch an anime about pretty much anything at this point.
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>>100830281
>>100830288
>>100830289
>SOL
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>>100830211
>Think children going up to American soldiers, and detonating a grenade; housewives rushing Americans with kitchen knives. "Even one dead American is an honorable act".
While the invasion of Japan would prove costly in terms of manpower, I don't think that particular scenario would come about. You overestimate the resolve of the untrained civilian to face death.

Also you're forgetting another reason for the bombs, which is arguably more important than avoiding unnecessary causalities. Soviet forces were already on their move to Japan, and were in the process of liberating and "liberating" land lost during the war. The US had a lot of motivation to end the war before the Soviets got to the main islands of Japan to avoid another split like Germany and Berlin.
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>>100828361
> world war 2 through the eyes of japanese soldiers

Would be an awfully short series, considering the starvation, lack of supplies, and materiel facing most garrisons from 43 onwards.

Are you going to show a bunch of scared 18 year olds hiding in a cave, being bombarded by battleships and harassed by dive bombers and strafing fighters until they finally break, banzai charge, and get cut down by a hail of machinegun fire?
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>>100828639
barefoot gen?
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>>100828469
>Whirlelwind in the background
>Early war panzer gray, not dunkelgelb based tri color camo

This bothers me more than it should.
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>>100830338
>the resolve of the untrained civilian to face death
Vietnam? Iraq? Indoctrination removes a lot of hesitation, and Taisho and early Showa were indoctrination central.

>end the war before the Soviets got to the main islands of Japan
That, and a bit of posturing to keep the Soviets on guard in the following years. Not purely altruistic, but better than the victorious Triumvirate handled Germany.
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>>100830211

Right, still within the ultimatums, either force or a conditional surrender. We're not supposed to think there was any other way. The US was eager to occupy Japan and beat Russia to the chance.
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>>100830347
Sure, it could even be about one such young man who survived a banzai charge but losing an arm in the process...And then returning to post-war Japan to create some of the most beloved children's manga series of all time
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>>100830478
>Vietnam? Iraq?
Nowhere near as bad as you seem to think. Especially not among civilians.

The problem with those wars is not "civilians attacking trained soldiers," it's: "enemy soldiers look like civilians."
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>>100830505
Yes. Congrats, you are the last one to figure that out. Assuming the US wanted the most peaceful way to end the war, what is you solution?
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>>100828361
I'm waiting for an anime depicting SS soldiers in 1945, fighting just to kill as many people as possible because the war is lost and there's nothing left for them.

Fun fact: The last Germans to give up defending the Fuhrerbunker were French from SS Charlemagne who held until May 2 to prevent the Russians from capturing it on May Day.
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>>100830539

An unconditional surrender.
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>>100830620
>were French from SS Charlemagne
Probably because the French are hardcore motherfuckers.
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>>100830660
I shouldn't have assumed /a/ wouldn't be smart with me.

What was the quickest and most public-friendly way for the US to win the war?
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>>100830537
>Nowhere near as bad as you seem to think
There's a reason zero-tolerance perimeters were used. Go read some literature from those wars, and you'll find a disturbing amount of civilians doing suicide attacks. Sometimes it was ideological, fueled by the belief in a glorious afterlife; sometime it was under duress, with opposing forces threatening civilians into compliance.
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>>100830537
The thing about Japan during WW2 was that the propaganda constantly lied to japanese civilians that if they were captured they would be tortured, raped, and murdered by "barbaric whites" I'm assuming that many japanese had the mindset that they were going to die whether they fought or not and decided it was better to die fighting
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>>100830753
>disturbing amount
Disturbing as it may be, it's not particularly large.

It especially wouldn't be particularly large in a war like World War 2.
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>>100830793
That was true of every war propaganda. Hell, in the case of Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan it wasn't even fake propaganda. People still surrendered just fine.

Even in countries with extensive propaganda and indoctrination efforts civilians have functioning bullshit detectors.
>>
>civilian casualities from invasion of okinawa alone is almost as high as atomic bombing death tolls, higher if Japanese soldiers are counted as well
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>>100830844
You're underestimating the societal bias in Japan towards obeying authority.

>Emperor Hirohito personally found the threat of defection of Japanese civilians disturbing. [...] At the end of June, Hirohito sent out an imperial order encouraging the civilians of Saipan to commit suicide. The order authorized the commander of Saipan to promise civilians who died there an equal spiritual status in the afterlife with those of soldiers perishing in combat. [...] By the time the marines advanced on the north tip of the island, from 8–12 July 1944, most of the damage had been done. 1,000 Japanese civilians committed suicide in the last days of the battle to take the offered privileged place in the afterlife, some jumping from "Suicide Cliff" and "Banzai Cliff".

That is one case of dozens.
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>>100830111
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demon_core

>Allowing them to close completely could result in the instantaneous formation of a critical mass and a lethal power excursion. Under Slotin's unapproved protocol, the only thing preventing this was the blade of a standard flathead screwdriver, manipulated by the scientist's other hand. Slotin, who was given to bravado, became the local expert, performing the test almost a dozen separate times, often in his trademark bluejeans and cowboy boots, in front of a roomful of observers.

Science!
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>>100830999
The Demon Core is some scary shit, spook/10 would not test
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>>100830741

I already said: A surrender which allowed the Emperor to remain.

>public-friendly way for the US to win the war

Funny phrasing, considering the subsequent wars and how they were handled.
>>
>>100830980
And I think you're overestimating it.

Sure, there would be civilians who'd follow the orders, but it's foolish to state that housewives would rush armed soldiers with kitchen knives en-masse, of their own free will.

Most US casualties from the invasion of Japan would come from regular soldiers and conscripts pressed into service (like the Volkssturm in Berlin), in heavy urban combat. Most Japanese civilian casualties would probably come from shelling and bombing.
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>>100831084
I'll rephrase the question to avoid cheek:
What would be the quickest and least deadly way to prevent Japanese war crimes from continuing, under the (correct) assumption that those crimes would continue until Japan was forced into unconditional surrender?
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>>100831117
>but it's foolish to state that housewives would rush armed soldiers with kitchen knives en-masse, of their own free will.

No, they'd probably commit suicide for bullshit honor out of fear that every American was here to gangrape them.
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>>100831084
And how would they force Japan to surrender without the atomic bombs? Keep in mind that emperor was almost killed by his high-command in order to prevent his surrender.
>>
>>100831161
>fear that every American was here to gangrape them
Well, if the invasion of Japan had come to pass, I'm sure there would be plenty of gangrape to go around.
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>>100831117
Several thousand were willing to hurl themselves from cliffs in the belief of an afterlife. What's to say they wouldn't be willing to hurl themselves at gunfire?

>>100831161
Totally wouldn't happen. /s
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>>100831046
It's just a little bit of radiation, I'm sure we'll be fine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhJpTmPfF6E
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>>100831225
>Several thousand
That's a tiny amount, all things considered. More people were lost to rounding errors.
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>>100831270
>I'm sure we'll be fine.
And they were. Mostly.
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>>100831160

You're just asking a loaded question now, though I'm guessing you don't realize it.

>under the (correct) assumption that those crimes would continue until Japan was forced into unconditional surrender

Why?
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>>100831211
Rapes happen in every war, but the Americans in WW2 weren't going around massraping as the Jap propaganda would have you believe.
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>>100831274
>Civilians wouldn't willingly run to their deaths - they have "bullshit detectors"
>Civilians running to their death did happen, but not in any meaningful number
>Thousands of deaths in the span of a week isn't a meaningful number
I think my "bullshit detector" is having a solid positive here.
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>>100831331
Well no, but with the added stress of heavy urban combat, massive losses and general chaos of a mainland invasion, rapes would most likely go up.
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>>100831363
No. It isn't a meaningful number. In fact, you'll find that the vast majority of Japanese civilians in contested areas didn't run to their deaths, even when specifically "invited" to do so by their beloved emperor.
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>>100831301
>Why?
Because that was the Japanese mentality. "Radiant", "superior" Japan, which was destined to overcome any foe. The US had Japan figured out when they rejected all conditional offers of surrender.
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>no lolis

Yeah no, fuck off.
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I'd watch it.
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>>100828469
Those don't even look like German planes. Nice try.
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>>100831635
I recognize that loli Adolf, good taste, anon.
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japan was and still is one of the most nationalistic countries in the world. they would not surrender for anything and you're retarded if you think so.
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>>100831757
>they would not surrender for anything and you're retarded if you think so
>they would not surrender for anything
>for anything
Sure showed them.
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>>100831635
$100 says she'd be voiced by Kugimiya Rie and her boyfriend would be a teenage Japanese boy sent to a military school in Munich to learn from German generals.
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>>100831788
Even the Emperor has a breaking point.
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>>100828856
Take my shekels already!
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>>100831830
We obviously found it. What's your point?
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>>100831891
I wasn't the person originally arguing with you over it.

The firebombing of Tokyo didn't stop their resolve, and they even hesitated after the first atomic bomb.
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>>100828639
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfJZ6nwxD38
nightmare fuel
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>>100831940
No, they tried for a surrender that didn't fuck them up the backside. It wasn't unconditional so we dropped #2.
>>
What contributed more to Japan's surrender, the bombs or Russia declaring war on Japan? Do you think they would have surrendered without the bombs?

Undoubtedly they realized getting occupied by both Russia and the US would be much worse than just the US.
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>>100831996
>didn't fuck them up the backside
Correction: they tried for a surrender which kept the Yokusankai in power, and allowed them to keep their ill-gotten holdings in China. Which would be like accepting a German surrender on the condition that the Nazis remained in power and France became part of Germany.
>>
>hurr anime isn't a good medium to depict war n real life gritty violence
>what is Jin-Roh
>what is War in the Pocket
>what is Grave of the Fireflies

It's been done, and done well. Quit sperging out because someone has the audacity to suggest that anime try to appeal to a larger audience.
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>>100832058
Wasn't Japan nuked once it already declared capitulation? I always skipped history lessons back in school, so I might off by a mile. Pls. no bully. ;_;
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>>100832134
You clearly know how to google history better than me, so you win. I'm off, 'night, /a/.
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>>100828976
>>100828801
>>100828655
>>100828621
>the war was horrible, oh those terrible yanks!
We could have opted for a land invasion of Japan, and lost literal hundreds of thousands of soldiers.

Or we could have let the Soviets take it, and watch as they decimated what was left of Japan.

Or we could have dropped two nukes.

Your call.
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>>100832058
The bombs. They were a clear indication that the US could kill anything, anywhere in Japan. No walls of civilian bodies to go through, they could kill the emperor and military high command directly. America was bluffing "We'll kill you (yes, you) next week if you don't step down."

>>100832199
Japan offered several conditional surrenders leading up to the bombs, but only agreed to unconditional surrender after the second bomb had dropped.
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>>100832199

2 times. If not why they need the second one? Or I paraphrase, they would have neither the reason nor excuse to drop the second one.
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>>100832203
>Soviets
This is really what it was all about in this case. The cold war didn't catch anyone off guard in 1946.
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>>100828361
Nobody cares about the BAD GUYS
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>>100832998
There wouldn't even be bad guys since
Side A thinks Side B are the villains while side B thinks Side B are the villains
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>>100833375
Except Side B (The Japs) are on the same team as the Nazis
>>
If you replace them with Empire of the Rising Sun with NANOMACHINES, SON everywhere and lightsaber-wielding railgun-shooting banzaaaaai samurai, yes

Of course they'd fight electromaster Russian lolis and timetravelling Western wimmenz
and crystaltek Atlanteans in SEA
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>>100833507
How dare you imply that Senator Armstrong is Japanese or has anything to do with Nippon
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>>100832058
I was interested, so I looked into it some more. After the first bomb was dropped, Japan believed that the US did not have many more. They had their own atomic bomb project and knew how difficult it was to create them. Many downright refused to believe the reports. They had no plans to surrender. Two days later, the Soviets invaded Manchuria. At this point they decided they had to end the war as soon as possible and called an emergency meeting to discuss how they would surrender. During this meeting they received reports of the second bomb being dropped.

Later that day they were told by an American pilot they had captured and tortured that the US already had 100 atomic bombs and that Tokyo and Kyoto would be bombed in the next few days. They seemed to believe him and were scared even more. Interestingly, the second bomb dropped actually was the last one they had, and another wouldn't be created until 11 days later. That bomb was really planned to be used on Tokyo.

So In conclusion I'd say the bomb and the Soviet's declaration of war were both enough to convince the Japanese to surrender, but it seemed like they were scared of the bomb more thanks to the false report of 100 bombs that would be dropped on their most populous cities.
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>>100833723
Interesting post /a/non, thanks.
>>
>>100828361
You mean Letters from Iwo Jima: The Animation



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