I wish Shoko was my wife.
What the fuck man
Fuck you Okouchi
>Dead thread because it wasn't about Saki
Dead thread because the show ended a month ago.
wow she looks really weird in that picture
its probably the eyelashes.
>she became a bakemono and wanted to go halfsies with new bakemonos in the end
Why couldn't she stay loyal to a single person, ideology or species?
Did you not enjoy my story, Gaijin-kun?
If it was Saki thread it wouldn't be dead because Sakifags are full autism.
Because she's an actually interesting character who has more to her than one-dimensional loyalty.
Haruto was the traitor.
>being a traitorous whore is more interesting than loyalty
Shoko is more Tamaki + Shirley than Ohgi.
Shirley stayed loyal to Lelouche to the bitter end.
Not a good idea.
She tried to fucking kill him.
She was merely tempted to kill him, he was unconscious and she had a gun, if she tried she would have succeeded.
She tried and failed because she has shit aim. Lelouch was also very much not unconscious.
That time was a suicide pact.
Which is in no way "loyal to the bitter end".
Following your beloved to the afterlife is almost being too loyal.
There's a difference between following and taking him with you though.
She didn't want to die, Mao had done some magical geass mindfuckery to convince her he did.
Sure, let's just make shit up now.
This thread is now about Saki and how Shoko is inferior to her in every conceivable way.
diaper wearing autist
No you Bakemono. Give me my Shoko back.
Shoko looks bustier than normal.
That's fine anon, no need to fight over anyone any more. The show has ended Shoko won.
Mao manipulated Shirley's disoriented feelings into wanting to kill Lelouch. In the same way Dorssia and ARUS (with some generous help from Haruto's incompetence) manipulated Shoko's ignorance into losing the blind trust she had in Haruto.
Biggest Bitch of the Season Award, yes.
Shoko is great. Remember when that attention-whore Saki hijacked Haruto and posted some crap on his not-instagram or whatever? Shoko not only trusted Haruto, she immediately knew he would never post crap like that and never doubted him for even a split second.
Fuck S2 for forcing such a shitty "betrayal" just for the sake of shitty melodrama. And fuck Haruto for not trusting her with the truth in the first place.
You mean Best Girl of the Year Award.
I daisuki her eyes.
>and never doubted him for even a split second.
S2 showed the downsides of her blind faith in him.
Well, yes, her only fault was trusting a faggot boypussy like Haruto in the first place. If only she was childhood friend to someone more manly and reliable, like, say, Yuusuke, things wouldn't have to be like this.
Post all Shoko's reaction faces you have.
>Shoko not only trusted Haruto
Well, sure, she didn't trust him in the right moment though.
That's my specialty.
Man, I love Shoko.
Why did S2 had to give her a different personality?
I'm looking for something to pick it up.
Is Valrape any good? I liked Code Geass.
Because S2 is rushed as shit.
Even if it wasn't rushed she'd have a different personality.
If it wasn't rush, they wouldn't have to take the shitty shortcut to conclude the story with something stupid like Bakemono incident.
Because of character development.
It's a good mess with an inferior MC.
Dead thread because OP is a retard.
Saki a Slut
I am pretty sure she fucked Audrey and then fucked their children once they reached the age she looks
Watch S1, then just imagine your own fanfic for how S2 should play out.
S1 was fun because of Saki being a cunt and L-elf being L-elf
S2 was less fun due to people keep dying because of Haruto and Shoko's brain problems.
There was no character development. There is S1 Shoko and then there's S2 Shoko. There's no transition.
S2 was less fun because VVV fails hard when it tries to be serious.
They needed someone to be a cunt so trash characters like Thunder and Haruto could look good before they died.
There was a time-skip in episode 13.
Not to mention that S2 Shoko existed since episode 11.
We should talk about cumming on L-Elf's ahoge instead. Smearing semen all over it and rubbing it in his eyes.
I'd rather talk about biting his juicy neck instead.
Shoko was herself until episode 21 when she suddenly dropped down to the level of the rest of the student mob breaking everything they established about her before then. There was no logic to it. She felt 'betrayed' because of lies and some random cave promise that we're supposed to believe was her only reason for living, but none of it was built up.
We saw nothing of nothing of her thoughts, development, or conflictions. All of the drama was awful and poorly handled, leaving everything up to us to desperately grasp and try to make sense of. The least they could have done is shoved the promise in during S1 so it didn't come out of nowhere, but it's clear they hadn't thought this far ahead back then.
>and some random cave promise that we're supposed to believe was her only reason for living
We're just supposed to believe it was important to her, nothing more.
>There was no logic to it.
There is, it was called Last straw.
>when she suddenly dropped down to the level of the rest of the student mob
It was established that she was susceptible to peer pressure.
The "random cave promise" was the basis for her blind faith in him.
>breaking everything they established about her before then
She was always like this.
>There was no logic to it
>She felt 'betrayed' because of lies and some random cave promise
Confirmed for not watching the episode.
>none of it was built up
Nevermind that, did you even watch the show?
>We saw nothing of nothing of her thoughts, development, or conflictions
Confirmed for not watching season 1.
>leaving everything up to us to desperately grasp and try to make sense of
By us you mean you desperately grasping for straws when it's obvious what happened.
>The least they could have done is shoved the promise in during S1
>She was always like this.
Not really. Not at all actually.
Very little and poorly portrayed.
>Confirmed for not watching the episode.
That's exactly what happened though.
>Nevermind that, did you even watch the show?
>Confirmed for not watching season 1.
S1 has nothing to do with her actions in 21.
>By us you mean you desperately grasping for straws when it's obvious what happened.
We can make guesses, but there's chunks of information missing that prevent them from being anything more. Just like the idea of her becoming a pilot as atonement is also just an assumption with nothing concrete backing it.
>Not at all actually
>That's exactly what happened though.
Not it wasn't.
>S1 has nothing to do with her actions in 21.
That shows how much you know Shoko.
>there's chunks of information missing that prevent them from being anything more
>the idea of her becoming a pilot as atonement is also just an assumption with nothing concrete backing it
Of all the reasons she could have to become a pilot you picked the less likely of them all.
Not that guy, but breaking up other people's points to just to make a different versions of the same old "do you watch the show" question does not change the fact that your argument is shallow.
> She was always like this.
No, she was shown to make surprises but those were situational comedic gags, not compromising her core character of friendship and loyalty. In fact, none of other characters is shown to have fundamental reversal of their characteristic.
> There was.
The logic of that "betrayal" was pointed out exhaustively by Shokofags against Shoko-haters, and VVVfags against VVV-haters many times. But it does not change the fact that logic is implicit and was not properly laid out by the writers. The biggest let down was the abrupt ending that did not close or straighten any previous implicit lines of logic.
> Confirmed for not watching the episode.
> Nevermind that, did you even watch the show?
> Confirmed for not watching season 1.
These a bad no-argument response I've mentioned coming from you. What people are angry about is Shoko's portrayal in S2. Her thoughts and development was given fine in S1, but virtually none in S2 except the few last eps. This is because of her serious lack of screen time in S2.
> By us you mean you desperately grasping for straws when it's obvious what happened.
"Gasping for straw" is what gives you the implicit "logic" for Shoko's betrayal actions that you strongly proclaim to know in your earlier point.
> They did.
The promise was mentioned to be a prominent driver for Haruto's actions, not Shoko's.
Thanks anon, anymore?
I'm not going to waste my time on arguments when the other guy isn't making an effort to watch the episodes.
She was shown surprising others when Haruto was involved in one way or another. She offered independence while Haruto backed her up in the VVV. She stood up with jingle bells because she knew she had his support even if everyone else was against her so she tried her best to hold it together. But pay more attention outside of those moments, remember before the independence when Moses took Haruto hostage? She thought Haruto was mad at her for her yelling at him earlier (when he couldn't confess). A tiny misunderstanding that neither of them bothered to clear (Haruto thought it was clear but Shoko thought he was mad at her) led her to think something else. Sounds familiar? Also, remember before the election? Shoko wasn't going to run until everyone (Haruto included) pressured her to do so. And remember when Haruto killed her father? It was the first time she didn't have Haruto's support (so to speak), she was powerless and all she could do was watch. Remember she almost gave in until her father told her not to, it wasn't a decision she made herself. Shoko always had an insecure side and Haruto's support always made her feel more confident and resolute. But apparently the only thing everyone remembers from season 1 is jingle bells.
You're complaining about my lack of elaborate replies and now this is too long so it continues in the next post.
Lack of screen time has nothing to do with her character when what she turned into is consistent with season 1. In my opinion of course. It would be great if they had more episodes to show Shoko fidgeting with her skirt like in season 1 before making a decision but it doesn't change anything else to me in her character. If anything I'm glad it turned into this and not her miraculously saving the day.
Shoko did what I expected her to do under those circumstances. She said earlier she wouldn't let her feelings get in the way of her duty as the prime minister and she did exactly what her father told her to do. ARUS president made a proposal that would save her friends and she thought he would keep his word. Haruto disappointed her but she didn't do it out of spite, she did it because it would save everyone else. Also, she was pressured to take action so her decision was influenced just like what happened when her father was killed. Her actions are logical and make perfect sense with what I knew of her character.
I think you set your expectations way too high for Shoko and that's why you sound disappointed.
>The promise was mentioned to be a prominent driver for Haruto's actions
>remember before the independence when Moses took Haruto hostage? She thought Haruto was mad at her for her yelling at him earlier
And she still gave her best to convince the others not to blindly believe ARUS despite thinking Haruto was mad and wouldn't back her up on this one. You're grossly exaggerating her reliance on him.
>Shoko wasn't going to run until everyone (Haruto included) pressured her to do so.
This is wrong. She wasn't going to run because electing a new PM meant admitting her father was dead and needed replaced (watch her reaction when she first hears of it over the loudspeaker). It wasn't until her talk with Haruto at the shrine when he assured her he was alive and promised to save him that she was finally able to put her mind at ease and move forward while thinking of what was best for the students.
>It was the first time she didn't have Haruto's support (so to speak), she was powerless and all she could do was watch. Remember she almost gave in until her father told her not to
It wasn't a matter of not having Haruto's support. She's a normal teenager, not L-Elf. She tried weighing her options to come up with a way to save everyone, but in the end she ran out of time. At no point did she almost give in. Though her failure here is likely what caused her to see giving up Haruto as a 'necessary sacrifice'.
Her deciding to trust ARUS who she knew was scum needed to be better executed to be believable, but otherwise I agree.
Yes, Shoko is reliant on Haruto's support. She admitted as such in S2. But she does not completely dependent on Haruto in her decision making process, which is what you seem to imply here. You said her surprising actions involve Haruto one way or another? The two most prominent interactions between her and L-elf (rejecting his empire plan and shoving Jellybean), between her a Akira (helping Akira overcome autism in ep 12) did not involve with Haruto. Shoko's extending friendship hand to Marie was also not about Haruto. Thus, Shoko's core character is not about "muh Haruto" but friendship and loyalty as I've mentioned. Even the fact that she participated in the election at all is less about Haruto but more about helping and protecting her friends.
In addition, implying Shoko's total reliance on Haruto but giving them barely meaningful conversations, while having Haruto successfully hid the Kamitsuki fact from the would-have-been total fixated eyes of Shoko on him would not give praise to the writing of the staffs, if indeed that's what they were going with.
The lack of screen time has everything to with her character because we don't know under her prospective how much she has changed and what direction has she changed into. Since when did her new-found sense of responsibility supersede her friendship loyalty besides that last couple eps?
> If anything I'm glad it turned into this and not her miraculously saving the day.
I'm fine with either Shoko saving the day, or Shoko's blindness from the truth and not being able to do anything. However, what I'm NOT fine with is the way that misunderstanding and the eventual "betrayal" came about, as well as the resolution afterward. As I've said, it did not go according to Shoko core character or it did not explained and laid out clearly enough.
> Shoko did what I expected her to do under those circumstances.
Those are reasons why most people don't understand Shoko and hate her deeply. I remember making the exact same argument you did here. But these are implicit point that need to be inferred; and when you've created a character that need so much effort to defend, unless everything clicks in a straight forward way or your character is part of a masterpiece, you've done something wrong as a writer. Take L-eft for example, his character is laid out in a cohesive, and well-rounded manner. Thus, he takes minimal effort to defend and he is well-loved despite that fact that he is an anti-hero selfish asshole to other characters.
I did not set my expectation too high for Shoko or any other character. I expect minimal attention and care for her as a main heroine, which imo most people agree she was neglected and poorly handled.
You said the promise was mentioned in S1. I inly remember Haruto implied there is one when he jumped into Hito to avenge Shoko's death, and when he completely fixated on her in ep2.
You can't compare L-elf with Shoko, one is a protagonist and the other is a supporting character. I'm fairly sure there are many who would disagree and say L-elf wasn't laid out as perfect as you make it sound, mainly his supposed relationship with Haruto.
Somewhat unrelated and generally speaking, Valvrave has always been about reading between the lines, things were never spelled out and many important details were deductions that turned out to be true. I don't know if it was due to the lack of time or poor planing but being open to various interpretations even after the finale is what makes the whole thing interesting to me. I would have hated it if they put an end to the questions I have now and gave closure to some scenes simply because they wouldn't do it the way I want them to.
Shoko is the main heroine. That fact has been advertised well enough in the show's OP/ED and various promotional materials. S1 Shoko was focused enough to be in the main character status. S2 was where they drop the ball on her. I didn't even have to mention L-elf. Even the once completely irrelevant Satomi got a whole episode dedicating to build his character and relationship with Akira.
L-elf's character is not paragon of story telling, but you can tell he is the most beloved and cared character of the show.
Shoko is a case wasted potential. Her S2 appearance makes me think she was only there as a plot device. Haruto ate her deathflag and her character at same time. The fact that she turned into Hito pilot feels like a cop out rather than any effort of character redemption. The staffs of this anime does not know how to write a genki girl. These are the type of girls that are strong, independent, value friendship the most, and are easy to make mistake based on rash decision. Looking another Sunrise show Love Live, that's the correct way to write a genki character.
>Of all the reasons she could have to become a pilot you picked the less likely of them all.
It's the only reason I've seen brought up and discussed in these threads. What other reasons are there?
I'm genuinely curious since the show offered no explanation at all.
Not him, but I think atonement is more from the audience's assumption than about Shoko's actual reason. More likely, it's out of necessity due to lack of man power and she realizes Haruto martyr sacrifice was so that he alone bares the curse. Shoko shares the same concern toward her friends as Haruto. That's why she follows his path.
I don't think it's a wrong assumption. She's shown to be frequenting his memorial even 200 years in the future, so the guilt is clearly still weighing heavily on her mind. Taking it on herself to continue where he left off after his death wouldn't be hard to believe if she wanted to make it up to him, herself, and everyone else. Perhaps on top of what you mentioned as well.
Unfortunately there's no way we'll ever know for sure though.
To lighten up the mood. Shoko foreverrrrrr.
That Shoko died in the first episode.
Just how many Shokos are there?
She didn't die until she was gassed in episode 12.
But then who was shota?
Shoko and Akira's kid.
L-Elf x Shoko confirmed.
That has always been true anon.
I don't like Shoko but I sure as hell would fuck her. She was really cute and probably fucks like a lynx.
L-Elf is dead
So, is this a Shoko thread or a VVV thread?
Shoko is VVV.
thunder-kun is in a better place now
It's a dead thread.
Shoko is my waifu.
Audrey is my waifu.
This really is just like summer.
Except, back then, you know that you have to endure for only three months for the inevitable continuation and all the while waiting for the ongoing chapters of the series.
Yep. Now all we have to wait for is the inevitable death of these threads and the lack of anything else VVV related in our lives.
Being the heroine (love interest) doesn't change the fact she's a supporting character.
>the guilt is clearly still weighing heavily on her mind
She didn't look remorseful in the slightest.
>that specific American history
We could also speculah during the break. Now all we can do is argue over whose interpretations of the shit ending is right.
>she was shown to make surprises but those were situational comedic gags
>but those were situational comedic gags
>situational comedic gags
HEY GUYS, LET'S START A COUNTRY.
HEY GUYS, MAKE ME PRIME MINISTER, I'LL THROW A FESTIVAL ON THE MOOOOOOON
>not entirely fucking relevant to the entire plot of Valvrave
>but those were situational comedic gags, not compromising her core character of friendship and loyalty
Of course they didn't compromise the core of her character, that IS the core of her character.
>mfw I still haven't watched episode 24
I don't know if I ever will.
I want an ova of L-elf's and Shoko's wedding.
I want an ova of L-elf's and Haruto's uncensored honey moon.
I want a doujin of their wedding night.
I want an ova of pic related