>Why are you complaining about the dub, Anon?
>You don't even know if the original is good or not, you don't even speak Japanese.
>It could be shit for all you know.
Why is it common for ignorant retards to be incapable of TONE AND INFLECTION?
Why do you even talk to them? There's a reason why you're not supposed to be revealing your power level.
Tone and inflection is extremely hard to decipher in a language with a different word and sentence structure on top of the fact that ITS ANOTHER LANGUAGE ASSHOLE
>Why do you listen to Japanese music?
>You can't even understand the lyrics!
Its not just tone and inflection, most English VAs (at least in anime) are just awful
Well shit, this thread ended fast.
>Tone and inflection is extremely hard to decipher in a language with a different word and sentence structure
Get a load of this guy
because japanese anime voice acting is the pinnacle of serious acting and all about the delicate playing out of quality dramatics. it's on some bergman shit
I know someone who will not watch subs for any reason
he says he saw the first hundred episodes of one piece subbed and now will not even touch subbed
I have given him tons of reasons why subbed is superior. he just says he doesnt like to read
>ITS ANOTHER LANGUAGE ASSHOLE
Except after watching a lot of anime, you start to pick things up. It's what the human brain does.
I fucking hate Canadian VAs, and I hate them more when you hear the same assholes in half of the dubs.
That's what you get for trying to deal with retards. Don't waste your time.
That's actually true though. Go listen to mandarin sometime. If you spoke english that way, people would think you had Downs syndrome.
OP, if you want to pretend JP voice acting is better because you don't understand it, go right ahead. But you're still wrong.
>he doesn't like to read
How the fuck can a person dislike reading?
even worse he has a favorite book
The main reason I can't watch dubs, to be honest, is that I cannot stand the American accent. I don't hate America, but fuck it's really grating to hear the accent in an anime. No I'm not mentioning my nationality.
America is home to many accents.
>How the fuck can a person dislike trying to read text at the bottom of the screen and take in the on-screen action at the same time?
Fixed. Subtitles are a distraction from what you're actually supposed to be looking at.
And don't pretend that you can see both at the same time. You may take in the broad strokes of the image in your periphery vision, but you're not taking in the full scope of what's going on. You literally can't focus on two points at the same time, that's not how eyesight works.
Why prefer something that is not in it's original language?
That's like going to China for their McDonald's.
True, maybe it's just the accent of wherever all the VAs come from. Having never been to the US, I'm guessing California.
You must be terrible at driving.
>That's like going to China for their McDonald's.
To be fair, Western restaurants in other countries often serve food that is unique to that location, and it's also a more upscale experience as they're obsessed with everything American.
>I've met multiple voice actors at conventions and they are from all over the place. You simply don't know how to tell the difference from 1 place in America and another.
that's actually a better way to put it
but he was still a conplete dumbshit. apparently of he missed a name or a word, he would pause the scene and go back just to get it. every single time
holy shit fuck these captchas
Why prefer something that requires visual aid to help you understand audio?
That's like breaking your leg so you can run a marathon on crutches.
I love subtitles. I use them for things in English as well. I never miss a name or any dialogue.
Bad voice actors and bad line rewrites. No other reasons required.
>That's like breaking your leg so you can run a marathon on crutches.
I don't think so. I'm not at a disadvantage for watching subbed anime and I get a better experience.
>You must be terrible at driving.
Driving is almost entirely periphery vision. Your eyes are looking ahead, towards the horizon line and your periphery vision susses out what's important at each moment.
Except that there are so few good seiyuu's out there, that same problem exists in the Japanese voice acting too. And it doesn't help that most characters are walking cliches. It's painful listening to most dialogue. Cringe worthy just from the tone and inflection let alone the lines they have.
Dubs should be judged on a case-by-case basis. Some of them are awful, while some are really fantastic.
The same problem meaning the tone and inflection thing.
I see this argument too often but anime writers aren't stupid, you almost never see a scene with important dialogue over a heavy action scene because they want people to concentrate on the action instead of the voices. The only example I can think of is in the Tatami Galaxy. Most of the time it's just three or four frames of flapping mouths while they circle through the same expository dialogue a hundred times an episode. The medium doesn't understand show not tell at all so you have to be a retard to be unable to keep up with most plot points and if you can't read a sentence with a moment's glance before turning back up you really need to practice reading more often.
I was playing a game that uses subtitles and I found myself constantly reading them even though it was in english. Watching subbed anime has engraved into my mind the necessity to read them, I couldn't stop myself.
That's not just an anime thing. It's necessary for action to stop during dialogue heavy scenes because action distracts the viewers from what the characters are saying. All mediums utilize this.
>Your eyes are looking ahead
>Never checking your mirrors or anywhere else around you
Get off the road pls.
People act in dubs when they can't act in regular cartoons.
Prove me wrong.
And when they don't they fall apart. An example being the Star Wars prequels.
>Dubs should be judged on a case-by-case basis.
They are. 99% of them of them are awful. Other than special cases like Ghost Stories, they're still are inferior to the sub.
The only dub I've seen that I liked better than the original was Baccano.
Almost every single one is awful though. And almost every show I watch doesn't even have a dub to begin with anyway.
I have to add subtitles to everything now. Movies, regular TV shows, games, books.
Your eyes should be fixed on the frame at all times. The idea that "nothing important happens while people are talking" is a total copout. What about facial expressions during a heated argument or a similarly emotional moment? There can be plenty of important visual moments going on without explosions or gunshots commanding your attention away from the subtitles.
The fact of the matter is, if you watch anime with subtitles, you're getting an incomplete experience.
>not watching Cowboy Bebop dubbed
What kind of magic do you use to add subs to books?
Even that had a shitload of problems, mostly involving Todd Haberkorn's hilariously bad Italian accent and Lua. The problem with dubs is that even good actors end up held back by the shitty ones that are invariably cast.
stupidity, ignorance, or willful self denial
>People act in dubs when they can't act in regular cartoons.
Wrong. The only reason there isn't much overlap (there is some, but not a lot) between cartoon VAs and anime VAs is because cartoon VAs belong to a union and anime ADR is non-union work. Rob Paulsen couldn't voice a character in an anime even if he wanted to because his union contract would never allow it.
The only explanation I can come up with is that you're a slow reader because I've never had an issue catching facial expressions or other things happening while reading subtitles.
Luckily most anime directors couldn't use cinematography to save their life and facial expressions amount to variations of blushing and emoticon lines so you don't miss that much. Also you can watch at a longer distance or smaller resolution to solve the issue.
>listening to wooden dullards screech bad translations for 22 minutes
You should get that autism looked at.
Hey, I'm not saying listening to a shitty dub not saying all dubs are shitty is the complete experience either.
The only real way to watch anime "the way it was meant to be watched" is to learn japanese and watch it raw. But I don't care enough about the sanctity of anime to do that. And clearly, neither do you.
>But I don't care enough about the sanctity of anime to do that. And clearly, neither do you.
You're not participating in the DJT? Shame on you.
I don't want to learn some archaic fishnigger language just to watch cute cartoons, as I have no intention in living or working in that backwards country. If anime was produced by some other country with a language i didn't speak with the same genres and stories i would watch it in that language.
i try to only watch dubbed anime, because if i wanted to read, i'd pick up a fucking book.
>not watching these dubbed
Why deprive yourself? Glorious Nippon doesn't give a shit how you watch your japtoons.
Between reading subtitles to an original soundtrack and bisecting it so your eyes don't get tired, I'd go with the former for 'sanctity'.
Also, nowadays I just assume that subs vs. dubs comes down to how quickly you can read. I can read fast, so I mostly leave those who can't to deal with their disability as they will.
>If I read the subtitles fast enough, it doesn't count as a distraction
Sure. That's how that works. But please, tell us all about how you read words and watch cartoons better than most.
Don't be mad just because you read at a 5th grade level.
>less distracting than actors that are mediocre in the best dubs
Must we go over this again?
They aren't lying OP.
It took me about 3 years of watching anime without formal training to actually be able to pick out the words they're saying. Previously, it was just noise to me. 10 years now and I've got a significant understanding and can understand most of the more general parts of speech.
One thing though, I never thought dubs were better. Except Dragonball z, literally the worst japanese casting possible. I can't listen to granny Goku.
Anime dubbing is populated with people who have never acted a day in their life and get thrown strange and awkwardly rewritten lines.
>eyes get tired
I don't even notice that I'm reading the subtitles...
but most japanese voice acting is piss poor as well. It's just not so bad since it's not something you're used to. A lot of it's pretty ear grating, especially those high pitched cutesy voices the moeblobs spout out. Jesus fuck, that's some painful shit to listen to.
>I can't listen to granny Goku.
For me it's kid Trunks and Goten. They sound completely tone deaf to me. It's fucking torture to watch Dragon Ball Z subbed.
You must be new to anime.
The fact of the matter is that much of the dialogue in anime is too cringeworthy to hear said aloud in a language you understand. For some reason, it doesn't seem so bad when you're just reading it.
Also, as has been thoroughly noted, 99% of English VAs are shit anyway.
>from all over the place
The majority are from or currently reside in Texas.
Seriously? There is some great Japanese VAs. For example, Norio Wakamoto.. guys been doing it for ages though. Of course you'll get random voice in the crowd guy with a shitty voice, and some with a completely grating voice like whoever plays fucking Cecil from Wizard Barristers. However, every form of media has a considerable amount of garbage in it.
At least it's not a pile of heaping and stinking shit like dubbing. It's a real industry in Japan and not just a niche market like here.
I said most, not all.
Bang Zoom is in California, Sentai/Funi are in Texas. Ocean Group is in Canada.
I like subs because I like to watch things as they air. Also I like specific VA's voices. I usually watch scenes over again without the subs if it gets really action-heavy. I used to watch every KLK episode twice, but now I usually just rewatch favorite scenes.
Also, it's just way easier to accept people saying dumb shit if it's not in English. I listen to non-USA pop music and I never look up the lyrics because they're fucking garbage. Still like the music though.
>Not being able to read fast enough then look at the pretty pictures.
I noticed this the other day but subtitles seem to stay on longer than when they're actually spoken.
We should watch all soap operas dubbed in Japanese, it'll surely make them better.
Also, a lot of dubs - especially these days - are recorded in Texas, while most US cartoons are recorded in NY or LA. There are plenty of cases of VAs moving from Texas to LA and expanding into cartoons and video game work (examples: Troy Baker, Laura Bailey, Travis Willingham, Spike Spencer, Amanda Winn Lee).
I'm tired of all the characters putting "yknow" in between sentences.
Thing is, after watching anime for a long time Let's not forget most of us are fucking learning it it becomes easier to decipher TONE AND INFLECTION.
All in all, you're a retarded dubfag and your argument doesn't hold up, like most.
The Trigun dub was fucking terrible though, no one should watch it.
dub was an abomination where the voice director tried to get the cast to mimic the tones and inflections of the Japanese vocal performances EXACTLY, even though THEY ARE SPEAKING ENGLISH, and as a result the entire cast sounds like alien freaks. Unfortunately because the show is so "wacky" nobody seems to have noticed that they're not supposed to sound that way.
The rest are decent to good; I'd add Gunslinger Girl, Kimi ga Nozomu Eien, Death Note, the second dub for Akira, Steamboy, The Sky Crawlers, and Panty & Stocking. I also liked the dub of the original Eva series, but it tends to be extremely polarizing so whatever.
Pretty much this. japan is a shithole, learning their language in order to watch their shows is just risible.
dubs masterrace: ∞
Great dub. Way better than the retarded gook slurring.
One argument that I never hear brought up in these debates is that hearing something spoken in your native languages produces an immediately different emotional and intellectual response than hearing something spoken in a foreign language, and reading something as opposed to hearing it produces yet another different set of responses. People process information in different ways, too - you may think about something you heard in a different way than something you read.
Watching stuff in a foreign language that was intended for an audience of native speakers always feels kind of weird to me, and even with subtitles I always feel like I'm missing a critical component. Sometimes with dubs I feel like I'm able to experience a certain immediacy of the material that's closer to what the creators intended in terms of audience response.
That just means you lack mental dexterity.
As someone who can pretty much go either way on the dub/sub divide, I tend to think of it kind of like seeing a theatrical production. Watching a show subbed is like watching a recorded performance by the original cast and crew, while watching it dubbed is like attending a live production of the same show - the same material - as interpreted by a different cast and crew. Neither option is "perfect" (i.e. attending a live performance with the original cast and crew), but each has its own advantages and drawbacks, depending on what the material is and what I'm in the mood for.
No, not really. This is just a fundamental fact about the way people's brains process language and information. We respond to written information differently from spoken information, and we respond to speech in a language we understand differently than speech in a language we don't. It's not a question of which is better or worse, it's just a statement that they're different. I really don't see how you can argue against this.
Because this shit right here is unacceptable.
Yes, really, it's just you. If your brain can't adjust, that's your problem.
> watching moeshit shows dubbed
This is the wrong way to do it. Only sci-fi and action shows get good dubs. And OCCASIONALLY comedies (e.g. Cromartie, P&S).
There's so much worse out there.
But that scene topped fucking Kokoro Connect's dub
Nah, I don't think you even understand what I'm saying.
Nah, I understand what you're trying to say perfectly fine. Again, it's just you. Train you brain or something and you won't be missing the 'component'.
Why is it common for ignorant retards to not know that tone and inflection differ across different languages?
I understand what you're saying but the main reason /a/nons will disregard an english dubbing is just because of the acting quality, regardless of how it is compared to the japanese acting quality its shit entirely to OUR ears
It's just the old 'ignorance is bliss'. I don't have much knowledge of what classifies as bad jap voice acting. I've heard some examples that to my ears sound pretty shitty, but to a native japanese speaker may be considered perfectly fine.
I think anyone who spends a lot of time watching the medium is able to destinguish crap acting in japanese, but of course its rare because of the size of the industry. ADV or Funimation etc aren't going to be pumping ludicrous amounts of money into their dubs because its still niche in the western world.
Yes the directors have western sub fags in mind when making a show. They are literally catering to YOU, anon.
A lot of them are do video games. And isn't Hauko's english VA in Rick and Morty now?
Yep. Kari Wahlgren, Steve Blum, Troy Baker and Laura Bailey (among others) do lots of US cartoons and video games in addition to anime. And pretty much every voice actor who's ever recorded a part in an Atlus game has done anime at some point.
Also: even David "Solid Snake" Hayter used to do anime.
>Studio Ghibli films
But Disney started pushing their shitty child actors/singers into dubs of Ghibli stuff.
>ADV or Funimation etc aren't going to be pumping ludicrous amounts of money into their dubs because its still niche in the western world.
>Implying /a/ still wouldn't kick up shit with a high up, english voice talent.
There have been few anime with notable english voice actors, not that it matters in the slightest.
These threads are so pointless, no one's POV is going to change after reading this thread.
>Anime dubbing is populated with people who have never acted a day in their life and get thrown strange and awkwardly rewritten lines.
But that goes for anime in all languages.
When was the last time Ocean was relevant?
>B-b-but subs distract from the action!
Let me guess, you couldn't read fluently until the age of 8.
And not true.
Eric Vale is always going on about 'you should be learning to act, not voice act'.
I get the feeling he would drop anime in a heart beat if something live action came along.
More like people would think you have a rage problem. A normal conversation sounds like a heated argument.
Also not true because approximately 100% of voice actors working in anime have majors in theater, drama or something of the sort. Just look up, like... literally any interview with a US VA ever where they talk about their background or credentials.
They are literally just as qualified for the job as their Japanese counterparts.
>Why deprive yourself? Glorious Nippon doesn't give a shit how you watch your japtoons.
I watch both but seriously fucking this.
Acting superior and entitled is dumb. I swear I remember some director saying at a con something along the lines of 'it's a visual medium, I would rather you watch the show'.
Nigga can you not even speed read? I don't even notice my fraction of a second glance at the subtitles any more.
But thats not true.
Hate the dubs all you want but stop making out like they haven't studied theatre or been in plays.
I mean fuck, I saw Mary elizabeth mcglynn in an episode of quantum leap once.
I think you think my post meant the opposite of what it meant.
Yes I just noticed that once I posted.
Just call me a faggot so we can get on with it.
Several directors have said stuff to this effect. Miyazaki said something like this. Oshii had this shtick once about how "a true translation is an illusion" so he doesn't mind people watching his films dubbed into their own language, and personally attended recording sessions for the first GitS dub; Nabeshin has said about dubbing his shows that "as long as people find it funny, that's all that matters"; ShinichiRO Watanabe has outright praised the cast and dubbing for Cowboy Bebop; Seiji Mizushima was palsy with the cast and director of the Fullmetal Alchemist dub and attended a bunch of conventions with them; and Hideaki Anno - I don't know if he's ever made any actual statements about his stuff being dubbed, but he heavily policed the scripting, casting and translation process for the Eva dub and personally directed a Japanese dub of some English show a few years back, so I don't think he's too averse to it either. In fact, the only anime director I've ever heard of having said anything negative about foreign dubbing of his work is Satoshi Kon.
So yeah, the notion that dubs are some ungodly perversion of the creators' will is just plain false. Most of them, especially nowadays, are made with the creators' blessing.
Someone was ragging on FLCL up the thread and I can't be assed finding the post. But it's worth mention on the audio commentary the director was talking about having involvement with it and down right praising Kari Wahlgen as Haruko.
I don't watch dubs for anything as I am not American.
That was me, actually. I know that Tsurumaki was involved with the FLCL dub but I still think it was terrible and he was just wrong. Ironically for reasons stated in this thread - how could he be expected to accurately judge the performances of actors whose language he didn't actually speak?
Then how could you?
That's... my entire point. I can't. All I can tell you is that, IN ENGLISH, the vocal performances in FLCL sounded weird and awful.
I imagine that most people who watched anime for over a decade know Japanese at least on an elementary level.
Thats your opinion
Western cinema and has all ways been relatively big in japan. So by that logic your average Japanese person would be able to tell the difference between decent and bad acting. So if we come full circle it's safe to say that Tsurumaki knew what was up.
But they dub everything into Japanese.
>not watching glorious western cinema in it's original language the way the director originally intended.
>Being this baka
>Japanese dub of the Simpsons
>All voices sound like shit
>Except Lisa, who's kawaii as fuck