What the fuck man...
I just saw this shit in the theater in new york man. I Didn't even watch the sub, I fucking waited. What the hell did I just watch? Just one giant fucking filler episode? I mean, if I was supposed to just as confused as Shinji than god damnit Anno you got me real fucking good.
Not to mention the fucking autismal faggots who couldn't contain thier boners for Kowaru. I swear, everytime she got screen time, I hear this man child behind me squealing and pouring his love juices all over the floor. Thats gotta be the last time I watch an anime in the theater I heard from my friend that people watching the Madoka movie had it worse
I thought 1.0 was really good and 2.0 was interesting because of the differences. However it just seemed like nothing really happened this movie.
>everyones mad at me
>everyones a cunt
>Everything my fault
>Fucking Fuyutsuki dropping a bombshell over a casual game of shogi
>its REALLY my fault
>get lance and fuck shit up again
>stop 4th impact
And for alot of new characters and enviornments, and changes, they don't explain shit. Like at all. But whatever, im just a pleb. But the kowaru-fags were too much
>that fucking ending
I wish Asuka would grab me by the lip and yell at me....
>Asuka with Mari
>Shinji and Rei sacrifice
im ready Anno
hit me with your best shot
>egg shinji on to save rei
>fucking blame him for trying to save rei
yeah, nah ur a cunt Misato
You saw the dub, didn't you?
"Hey, don't look so sad.."
i did, ive, watch the first 2 in english just because it was available so why not continue.
How was Kaworu's VA? I've heard he's up to his fourth voice actor now?
The dub was fucking hilarious and sounded very cute.
I loved the way Asuka sounded when she went alll "Here we gooooooooooo"! Kaworu sounded like some fabulous disney character. The way Misato literally implied "SHINJI YOU FUCKING IDIOT" during pic related was simply great.
>"You're going to whine the world to death!"
>"After all these years, you're still the biggest brat I know"
The dub was gold. It's obvious the english VAs had a lot of fun doing it. Definitely provides a very different and interesting view on the film's seriousness.
I mean, it was alright, It got really good at the lance part, before that, his fabulous self was distracting me too much to notice his voice all that much. Sound track was godly though
I'm pretty sure everyone at the showing I went to thought it was shit as well, or at least couldn't take 3.0 seriously.
I couldn't blame them for laughing either. Several of the Kaworu and Shinji scenes were just hilarious.
>or at least couldn't take 3.0 seriously.
That fucking dub, I'm telling you. It's like the english voice actors themselves where poking fun at the film and situations themselves as they voiced the characters, Not to say the dub was bad, it's definitely worth watching. Changes the tone of entire movie.
op here, I laughed at the stars part when he was on his side when shinji when he looked over so i guess im just as bad
My friend next to me who already saw the movie kept saying "gay sex " loud enough for every one to hear every time we saw a piano in the movie.
his face when im watching the movie
>all that suffering
Spike Spencer's voice is fucking terrible its sounds constantly mocking.
Well yeah, he hates Shinji.
Why is it that gay=funny?
Nobody takes people who gets off to guys kissing seriously.
forgot to mention this
>he clearly wanted the d
>he wanted to ride the poop chute
>wanted to do the plumbing
its like watching a train wreck, the fucking sexual tension that would normally be there in any other show was absent there and it was fucking too much at some points. And his fucking choice of words between them were just fucking hysterical.
I fucking came when I heard this in the movie. Great throwback to the original series.
Gay means happy.
The faggots stole the word.
>I swear, everytime she got screen time, I hear this man child behind me squealing and pouring his love juices all over the floor.
that was me mate
The translation was weird because the subbed version was not funny. The choice of words + tone makes it more suggestive than it is.
Despite being discussed to fucking death, people still call Misato a cunt for her behavior relating to this movie and the one before it.
I don't understand for the life of me why...
I'm currently on the second part of EoE and I just wanted to ask, what is SEELE trying to accomplish? To be clear, Gendo is trying to cause the third impact, merge all of humanity into one entity in order to reunite with Yui, right?
I just heard the commander of the army, who I thought was sent by SEELE, say "Our mission was a failure". Assuming they're not with SEELE, what the fuck are they trying to accomplish?
Regardless of the gay duet, the piece was actually good.
It's probably because she didn't explain shit to Shinji.
Finish the goddamn movie.
>taking the role as a VA for a character you hate
>tfw all this hate for Shinji
No Gendo just one to meet Yui he doesn't care about the merge or evolution, SEELE cares about human transcendence though.
I don't agree with him, but yeah I'm not sure why he keeps doing it.
I was in New york not australia
She literally got mad at shinji for doing what he did in the last movie despite her telling him to do what he needed to do.
people who "hate" shinji and somehow still like evangelion are profoundly fucked up
Everyone hates Shinji. Anno does, Sadamoto does, Shinji's namesake does. Asuka's VA does.
It's hard not to hate him after 3.0.
Strings version best version
>scene of Kaworu's head exploding playing in my head the entire time I was listening to this
Feels good man.
another god tier song
Along with the rest of Japan apparently.
Thanatos best OST, prove me wrong
These and Ode to Joy were the only songs I really cared for in 3.0, which is disappointing; people were really telling me it was going to be god tier. It was good, but yeah, not spectacular.
SEELE and gendo both wanted instrumentality, but their motivations and ways to go about it differed
in the end gendo held all the cards and SEELE didnt much care for that since he was just going to do w/e he wanted, so SEELE moved against him
>>I'm currently on the second part of EoE and I just wanted to ask, what is SEELE trying to accomplish?
Trying to cause third impact on their terms, to turn the human race into a giant hivemind that they control.
Gendo is using third impact to reunite with Yui, possibly control the hivemind.
Rei rejects Gendo and gives control of the hivemind over to Shinji. In the second part of EoE, Shinji is deciding whether to join the hivemid or reject it.
when mari goes "hoooooleeeeeyy crap" i lost my shit
It's only funny when (allegedly) straight characters are gay.
Gays being gay = not funny
Unless they're fabulous. Then it's funny again.
>Didn't even watch the sub, I fucking waited.
are you saying that there's an english dub already?
>SEELE and gendo both wanted instrumentality, but their motivations and ways to go about it differed
they sure seem similar enough to me, i actually rewatched it about a month ago and i still couldn't figure out how their agendas differed or what the argument was about. i guess it doesn't really matter though
i loved it for what it was an experience and a great time
Most of the showings in the US/Can were the english dub
the English premier in theaters
It's in theatres right now, home release got delayed but it used to be set for late March I think
>people still call Misato a cunt for her behavior relating to this movie and the one before it.
>I don't understand for the life of me why...
She spent the movie pouting and posing wearing her stupid hat down low.
She's mad at Shinji for inadvertently causing 3rd Impact, even though she KNOWS that Shinji was being manipulated by Gendo and Seele.
14 years later, after realizing that Gendo and Nerv were manipulating her, the same way they manipulated Shinji. She still blames Shinji.
I don't know why people had a problem with her in the 2.22, though.
Are you a nigger ?
You type like a nigger.
I can't. I can't because it's the best. Good taste, Anon.
thats because it was never really explained why
there are theories about how gendos instrumentailty involved turning everyone into evas, and thats why in rebuild 3 theres all those dead evas around
all we know is that gendo only really wanted to reunite with yui, the whole turning everyone else into lcl like SEELE wanted wasnt a priority
forgot the pic
3.0 and 4.0 were supposed to release simultaneously with each other.
And the Rebuild movies are based off the 4-part Japanese theater system. The third part in the quadrilogy is always supposed a confusing mess.
What did you expect Anon-kun? No suffering?
Don't forgot, Shinji's VA thinks he's a crappy guy too.
The OST was great in my opinion, but each to their own
>not a moe girl who just happens to have a dick
I fucking hated 3.0 but this sounds hilarious
no sir, yuo are the nigger
We all know Shinji is best girl.
I'll defend Shinji's actions up until about the last 10 minutes of 3.0.
He's gone and fucked up by that point.
Why didn't he listen?
no sir, you are the nigger
>dont pull out those spears
>b-but i can change everything
>dont do it shinji
Wow I may have to watch a dub for once, this does sound pretty damn funny.
Who was the guy who did his PHD thesis on EoE? Was it his PHD thesis? Also, what was the course he was doing it for?
>its not your fault
>Dont pull that spears
>i gonna save the world
>Dont do it
Huh. I went to see it in a theater in New York last weekend and the audience was (surprisingly) pretty well-behaved. Mostly weebs of course, but they managed to not be overly obnoxious during the actual movie.
>I don't know why people had a problem with her in the 2.22, though.
It's always a wise decision to listen to space jesus even if he's trying to touch your bathing suit parts.
These SBaHJ Eva comics are solid gold.
Nah, that's just Shinji helping Fuyutsuki fulfill one of his dreams in one of the video games.
I gotta admit, I saw this last weekend and I let out an audible "Oh, snap!" when Kaworu's head blew off onscreen
It's not funny, it's just bad in 3.0.
All of 3.0 is laughably bad, but this is the most highlighted part of it, some kind of gay innuendo amidst the apocalypse, it's pure fanservice made for morons and retards.
The phoenix theater right? I wanted to go to that one but it was already sold out. So I we went to East Village Cinema uptown.
You mean Sweet Shinji and Hella Karl.
I got a whole folder of this shit from back in the eva 3.0 generals, was pretty good at first before it became the usual eva shitfest
Nah 3.0 just made makes it obvious that it's Adam and StEve now, not Adam and Lilith.
Well Kaworu will never ahead in life.
I went to East Village too. Was it the Saturday afternoon showing?
I dunno, maybe I was just seated near some well-behaved people.
The guy behind me was trying to hit on the girl sitting next to him after the movie, and then she mentioned she was in high school and he was literally like "Oh shit!" It was pretty great.
>However it just seemed like nothing really happened this movie.
Yeah it was a bore-fest like that, but it's just supposed to not be good. Not even joking, you have expectations for it to be great, like there's growing characters, and they're basically primed for suffering and develpoment, but BAM they skip all the good parts and hop straight to the gay sex. Leaving the impression that nothing really happened, nothing important at any rate.
Was it a pandering move, or 2deep4u? Either way the move is shitty and is only working as "postmodern art" or whatever the hipsters call it these days.
Shit these are funny
Just finished EoE. I thought that making a "What the fuck did I just watch" thread was basically mandatory or a rite of passage, but I don't feel the need to do it. I find it easy to understand due to how much I relate. What I'm confused about is the ending. Why was Shinji choking Asuka? Also, what was that conclusion? I assume, as clearly mentioned, that after Shinji rejected the choice to bring humanity into one entity, the world went back to the way it was except with only him an Asuka being alive in order to start the human race over again. Is that what's going on? They're the only two left and supposed to be the so called "Adam and Eve" of the new world?
That is fanservice made for morons and retards.
Nah they had a showing tonight at 7pm however that story is pretty fucking quality
No not really.
You want fabulous? I'll show you fucking fabulous.
>Not to mention the fucking autismal faggots who couldn't contain thier boners for Kowaru. I swear, everytime she got screen time, I hear this man child behind me squealing and pouring his love juices all over the floor.
Thank g-d tickets were sold out.
Kaworu is goddamn fabulous man.
I'm a little disappoint.
> mfw they cut it off after like 3 minutes
> mfw they didn't have it playing over the climax
Fuck Anno, fuck Rebuild forever
The concept? Not necessarily for morons and retards. 3.0's version? Definitely yes.
It's like... pure melodrama that exploits people's cravings for particular content, like male/male pairings. Just visit tumblr and you'll know what I mean instantly.
It’s not funny, just shows you how immature and annoying anime fans are.
Shut the fuck up and let me enjoy the goddamn movie.
This isn't true though, he's specifically denied it on multiple occasions and says he has a "love-hate relationship" with Shinji.
Which is pretty appropriate imo given that Shinji sort of has a love-hate relationship with himself.
>TFW no one wants to discuss with me ;_;
I'm not very good at file names.
Fucking phone messed up my post.
>TFW it's not actually a discussion with me
>TFW it's simply me asking to be spoonfed the storyline
He was choking her to see if he was still stuck in instrumentality or not. If he was, then she wouldn't have been able to resist him.
Look kiddo, that has nothing to do with what 3.0 shows of stargazing and all that.
Whatever subplots it has, it's not what it shows. Theory and speculation, or fanwank as it is now, doesn't change the focus of 3.0.
Now he's voiced by the guy who did Barry the Chopper in Fullmetal Alchemist. Dunno if that sweetens the deal or not.
It's ok. Here have the best part of Rebuild.
But maybe in his 'perfect world' he wanted her to resist him?
My rage will never cease.
She already rejected him outside of instrumentality, so probably not. Also, this is Shinji. He's terrified/frustrated with Asuka.
Man it's like a retarded Andy Warhol drew a cat.
stargazing is to fujoshit what pokapoka is to neckbeard.
Adam and Steve may not be a thing but Steve is still probable.
It wasn't great but I thought it was still a big improvement on the clusterfuck that was 2.0
He didn't. There's nothing Shinji loves more than a good old fashion case of domestic violence.
Not bad, definitely the best VA for him so far, not that that's saying much. He's no Akira Ishida though, his voice isn't silky or cool enough.
I didn't think 2.0 was a clusterfuck. It just had too much pokapoka kitchen shenanigans.
You've been trolled by Anno. Like most of us, who weren't around the be trolled the first time when the TV series ended, thought Anno could do no wrong.
Well, look at it now. He's trolled an entirely new generation of Evangelion fans. The third wave fans will hail this film as a masterpiece that the rest of us "just don't get."
I hope you benefit from this broadened perspective.
Even poka-poka has that character background for it, stargazing doesn't.
Fujoshit plz. Point is, they didn't make an entire movie just for poka-poka, and even something like poka-poka makes part of a character arc that ended too early since they wanted to have Kaworu for 3.0 in that particular way.
>You've been trolled by Anno
Stargazing was Shinji's idea which was foreshadowed to be an interest of his back in 2.22. Shinji had star posters in his room back at Misato's.
Nor should it.
I'm looking forward to the release of 4.0. As much for the shitstorm and discussion on /a/ and evageeks as much as the actual movie. I probably enjoyed the agonizing wait for spoilers the night 3.0 released a lot more than I enjoyed 3.0.
The VA they got for Death/EoE was pretty good though. It was the same guy who voiced Kaji in the original series, which thankfully wasn't too obvious.
Hate to say it, but you're semi-right, even though most people who watch Evangelion today also say they felt trolled. I know I did.
It's fundamentally different however, because minute for minute Rebuild is a much lesser version of the original. NGE does deliver as far as it's able to, not just pandering but makes for some genuinely interesting characters.
Yeah, see how hard you need to reach to justify that? That's not part of any character arc or anything, nor any ongoing development. It's really weak.
Who keeps making these? That's hilarious.
2.0 is the best Rebuild.
I laughed harder than I should've
No idea, but they make me happy.
So is anyone actually looking forward to watching 4 that isn't because they just want to see how it ends?
What a fucking train-wreck of disappointment and futility.
>Chicago doesn't get a viewing
Yeah, fuck you too Anno.
Yeah i dont care how it ends anymore, I just want to see the shit storm that it brings
Karl doesn't know how to be a pervert very well.
I'm not disagreeing with that.
I am disagreeing with you believing that Steve can't be a thing when the kid's triggered two impacts.
>4.0 starts to sort shit out.
>Whoa Anno breaking out all the stops. Holy shit this atmosphere, DEM GRAYPHIX.
>Two hours in, fucking gripping my seat.
>Cut to black.
>OUR EPIC CLIMAX WILL COME IN 4.5. DON'T WORRY, THERE WILL BE FANSERVICE.
There isn't an adequate reaction image.
I'm only watching 4 so I can understand exactly why /a/ is shitting itself when its released.
Don't you want his third impact inside you Anon-kun? Both your spears piercing your AT fields?
> It's hard not to hate him after 3.0.
That's because Rebuild Shinji is a different character from original Shinji. Original Shinji was basically a good kid with serious emotional problems, Rebuild Shinji is kind of a little wiener.
2.0 can't be said to be a clusterfuck, it's fairly straightforward, moreso than you can say NGE's first half was. If you pick up on anime reviewers who are 100% newcomers, you'll see this is a sentiment they share - they even find it less clusterfuck-y than 1.0, which at least I didn't find it that messed up.
3.0 on the other hand, that's a clusterfuck on so many levels. Unintentional, or intentional? Either way it's a clusterfuck where everything bends to meet some certain end, very obviously.
It's actually off my to-watch list, for many of the reasons I didn't get much enjoyment out of 3.0. Once I saw it, I could tell there'd be a lot of dumb quarreling and discussion, which I'm proven right.
People who championed the great multitude of in-depth characters in Evangelion, now dismiss the entire idea since their waifu is taken care of thus far, and others whose waifus lie in ruins dismisses everything.
It's deliberately bad, in a self-indulgent way. 4.0 can't do much to compensate for the steps 3.0 stepped over, the fanbase is bound to be either brainless or hateful as from this point of.
I saw mari and read that in Mario's voice
>I'm not picturing a fat Italian plumber piloting an eva
I'm looking forward to the inevitable internet shit storms mostly.
If 4.0 is even remotely half or 1/3 as good as EoE then I'll be satisfied.
Steve can be a thing, but all in all, why does it matter if it's steve or eve? It doesn't really matter conceptually, and so it brings nothing to the table so to speak. In fact it is most likely, and don't you deny it, most likely an addition to make for more "stargazing" moments if you will. More fanservice than plot/story.
The only thing I can see it doing, is make Rei do one less thing in Evangelion.
>I saw mari and read that in Mario's voice
Kaworu's face in the 2nd to last panel is fucking priceless.
I'll never recover if Anno has the balls to do this.
The only good part of 3.0 was the music and seeing Kaworu's head explode.
Anno doesn't care about Eva anymore, either he just wants it to become more of the soulless cash cow then it already is or he wants to ruin it to the point of becoming irredeemable.
>People who championed the great multitude of in-depth characters in Evangelion, now dismiss the entire idea since their waifu is taken care of thus far, and others whose waifus lie in ruins dismisses everything.
Eva was always about the waifus though. The majority of /a/ just sticks the to the 2deep4you act to make them look smart.
>4.5, coming march 2019
>If 4.0 is even remotely half or 1/3 as good as EoE then I'll be satisfied.
I doubt Anno even has the gall to even make something similar. He'll probably give us another CONGRATULATIONS
I think I'm the only one who misses the dubs for the original series - Shinji having a sense of humor, Asuka yelling German obscenities when she's angry, Kaji being flamboyantly suave superspy, Rei sounding like a legit alien, SEELE speaking with Eurotrash accents, Gendo sounding like an absolute BAMF.
It's like playing the newer translations of old RPGs like FF6 and Chrono Trigger. The translations are more accurate and technically proficient now, but they're missing some of the charm and personality that the old ones had.
I was wondering how they were going to handle the transition from "stupid Shinji" to "brat Shinji."
I kind of like the asshole line.
Say what you will about dubs, but Tiffany Grant is pretty good.
Everybody finds love in the end
I'll discuss it with you. For just this one post, because I'm going to go bed now.
>>I assume, as clearly mentioned, that after Shinji rejected the choice to bring humanity into one entity, the world went back to the way it was except with only him an Asuka being alive in order to start the human race over again. Is that what's going on?
They're the first ones back from the hivemind. Shinji rejected the hivemind, and in doing so gave everybody else in the hivemind the option of coming back to the real world, or to pass on.
>>Why was Shinji choking Asuka?
Who knows. Personally, I think he was confused and was thinking that he was still in the hivemind, living the scenario where he was arguing with Asuka and started choking her again. Asuka caressing his face brought him back to reality.
>The only thing I can see it doing, is make Rei do one less thing in Evangelion.
Confirmed Reifag. Your argument is now invalid.
And Rei is still important. 3rd impact wouldn't have happened if it weren't for her. She'll make a big comeback in 4.0. The Rei Q dud is just the calm before the storm of her return.
Then acyka calls him disgusting and he chokes her out fully this time
> Tiffany Grant
Only she knows what it is truly like to have Asuka as your waifu
>Anno doesn't care about Eva anymore, either he just wants it to become more of the soulless cash cow then it already is or he wants to ruin it to the point of becoming irredeemable.
No, he cares, I watched 3.0 and I can tell he cares. It's just that Anno might not be the man you think he is. 3.0 is from what I can tell, very self-indulgent and perfectly in thread with something that Anno (or his team) would do if they were to follow their own desires.
That's my image of Anno from interviews I've read, yours might differ. One thing is for sure, if he wanted it to just be a cash-cow, Rebuild would be very different.
>Eva was always about the waifus though. The majority of /a/ just sticks the to the 2deep4you act to make them look smart.
Not for everyone. I see a lot of people watching Evangelion, to be mesmerized by everything on the first watch-through. The waifu stage comes later for most, if only because of the culture surrounding Evangelion.
I recommended Evangelion a lot back in the days. Many didn't even think about who they liked most of the girls because they were all great in their own way.
Although by the end, it might be everything that's left, and this is why I'm saying self-indulgent when I refer to 3.0. Everything that's happened so far, even with recent versions, is more or less waifu-related.
That's true even for myself, because I actually like Evangelion but everything I see of Evangelion now, always boils down to waifus and so I'm practically forced to care. I always had my favourites in the cast, but at the moment it's important to see those favourites treated well.
What/who the hell is Steve?
>Eva was always about the waifus though
Not at all.
Only the fans believed it was.
Not him, but on Rei, she is less important. Weaker, and Rei Q isn't just a dud it's a bullet that worked and practically killed the character. There's no calm before the storm, the storm already passed and Rei is no longer a character worth paying attention to.
You know it to be true.
Sorry anon, but you're wrong about me being a Reifag. Argument stays valid. I want a serious reply. Rei is a different subject that's only tangentially related since we now have potentially, one more person that starts impacts - as opposed to just Rei in NGE and EoE.
You can't deny it makes for one less thing.
What I'm wondering about, and forget Rei, is what exactly does "steve" do, other than further fanservice for 1-2 characters?
I agree to be honest.[/spoiler}
I just want people to stop bitching about 3.0, it's making eva threads a living hell to browse now.
> Why did Shinji choke Asuka?
There really isn't a simple one-sentence answer for this. It isn't something that's hidden, it's something that's genuinely ambiguous. You don't need to be able to explain it logically - all it needs to do is make sense on an emotional level, and it does. Just... think about the themes of the movie, think about what thoughts and feelings are going through Shinji's head at this point in the story. And it'll sort of start to make sense, in a way. It's still cryptic, but... think of all the rage Shinji's been bottling up inside him this whole time. And compare it to the first scene of the film, which it mirrors, which also involves Shinji expressing pent-up emotions in the presence of an unconscious Asuka. Think about what's changed for Shinji between then and now.
Also, listen to this song that was cut from the movie:
It's Kaworufag lingo for Shinji and Kaworu being starcrossed time-transcendent gay lovers, soulmates and all that. Adam and Steve means they're the same, as in Shinji is elevated from normal relatable human tier to secret hidden god tier, as instead of or in addition to Adam/Lilith, there is now Adam/Steve.
Didn't you say that yourself though?
>Nah 3.0 just made makes it obvious that it's Adam and StEve now, not Adam and Lilith.
That means Lilith AKA Rei gets displaced, right?
>what exactly does "steve" do, other than further fanservice for 1-2 characters?
Atone for his impact fuck ups by rebuilding the planet, which have only been the basis of the last two movies?
So I don't know if I'm retarded but I don't know why everyone thought EoE was such a negative ending. I saw it as an extremely positive ending. Shinji finally realized how to live life and chose to go back. All was relatively well. Pic related is a very strong point for me. It relates to my and I'm sure a lot of others' situation. When you finally escape depression, you know what you have to do in life, you know how to go about it and you know what you have to do. You get the message and you push on forward but depression never truly escapes you. You're still not happy, you're still not pleased and don't know whether you'll ever be satisfied, but you're taking action. You're taking a step forward and experimenting to see how it will turn out.
Damn. God damn. Fuck this, I've had enough. I'm going to watch some normal anime Holy Jesus Christ. I've had enough for now. I watched ENG and EoE way too quickly.
You can't really stop it. This is what Evangelion is now.
>DONT CALL IT A GRAVE, ITS THE FUTURE YOU CHOSE
Yeah, but the fact that he makes impacts comes from the Steve thing, and even the atonement is contrived to the point that it's not the impacts that are the key, but the atonement as part of "service" to some fans.
EoE is a bittersweet, but ultimately hopeful ending. Some might consider the fact that the earth being destroyed in order for Shinji to grow as a person as a cost too high to pay, but really the show was all about him in the first place.
> I'm going to watch some normal anime
Might I suggest the Rebuilds?
Think about that for a sec.
Why is Shinji now starting impacts? It's because some Kaworufans theorize he's "Steve", right?
So at the end, we get that he's being made Steve first, so he can make impacts rather than be Shinji.
Why is he Steve? So he can be put on the level of Kaworu.
It's sneaky, but it works, and even that atonement? Two impacts that even I who can't say I'm such a fan of Shinji's is really his fault.
Atonement, sin, they're all concepts related more to Kaworu and the pairing, more than of Shinji. Who chooses who should atone and who shouldn't? Sin is only sin in the eyes of someone, you know. It's a fundamentally non-fair concept.
No you're right, there is definitely a note of redemption in EoE's ending. Like the series as a whole, it's about picking up and moving on despite the pain, and living on the hope that things can get better even if they hurt now. It's just that the film as a whole is really, really dark and raw and it sugarcoats jack shit in getting its message across that, yes, life HURTS.
>Might I suggest the Rebuilds?
Yeah though I understand your meaning, the rebuilds are still ultimately made by Anno and are still branching off very closely to the fucked up series I just watched so while I will get to them, I shall postpone for today and watch some pleb tier/moefagshit tier anime.
>Thats gotta be the last time I watch an anime in the theater I heard from my friend that people watching the Madoka movie had it worse
If it's any consolation, just imagine the pain and suffering of anyone unfortunate to make the mistake of watching Monty Python and the Holy Grail in theaters.
I still hear horror stories about it.
>However it just seemed like nothing really happened this movie.
The really frustrating part is that a whole lot of fucking stuff happened in the movie.
But fuckall was explained, so it's hard to tell what was and wasn't important.
I can see why they cut the song. It implies there's way more between Asuka and Shinji than we're ever shown. Even if it is there in subtext(and I'm not saying it is) hearing the song when we've never actually been shown any of it would come across as forced and awkward. Maybe an earlier draft of EoE played up their relationship more.
That's the first time I've heard Monthy Python and the Holy Grail had something bad in the theatres going on, I've only watched it on home video.
I'm aware that Life of Brian inspired some religious controversy that was just recently "pardoned", but Monthy Python and the Holy Grail?
Was it just funny?
have some Rei /a/ drew up lately
I guess, I mean I don't think you're supposed to interpret the song as a LITERAL expression of Shinji and Asuka's relationship, any more than we're meant to interpret Komm, Susser Tod as an expression of Shinji and/or Asuka's mental state. It's metaphorical, but obviously relevant to their situation.
I assume he's talking about watching Holy Grail in a theater in modern times, when the audience is bound to be packed with nerds who have memorized every line and quote the movie incessantly even while they're watching it.
...oh well that's positively horrifying
Yeah, and I'm glad Anno did that. I'm glad he didn't sugarcoat shit. I'm glad he threw reality in our faces. It's good to see that for a change. I watch anime for escapism but It's nice to get a dose of reality once in a while. All the while, I dislike it. I dislike it because it brings me back to my past and floods me with all the fucked up memories. It makes me realize how shit life is. And while I'm not nearly as bad as I was before, it sinks me a bit deeper into my depressive thoughts. I wouldn't recommend this anime to anyone. I can't really describe it but it's like I'm watching my entire thought process during certain parts. It's like I'm reliving past moments and just sitting there saying "Yes. This is true" having no sympathy or feelings toward it. It's like I look at it and say "That is the past and I don't give a fuck anymore" I think because I had such a hard and stressful time dealing with it before that I don't want to do it again and just dismiss it
>So I don't know if I'm retarded but I don't know why everyone thought EoE was such a negative ending.
It's a bitter sweet ending.
I mean, sure, Shinji finally comes to terms with his life. But seriously. Look at this shit.
That's not a sun in the background as people look eagerly into the future to see what's in store, gleaming over the hill of a new day.
No, that's two kids staring at a giant fucking head in the middle of an ocean of blood. That's what their world is now. Any time the world as you know it comes to a screeching halt, that's not a happy ending.
This OST keeps playing through my head as I read the posts in this thread.
It's lyrics could be taken literally in the context of the scene where he's strangling her in Instrumentality which could cause some confusion. I'd agree it's probably meant to be metaphorical but could be taken literally too easily and that's why it was cut.
Imagine an entire theater singing "Knights of the round table".
Imagine an entire theater saying "NEET" over and over again.
Imagine there are at least 3, if not several more people in the audience who are loudly quoting every single line in the movie.
If you ever get the chance, listen to the commentary of the movie. They go over their personal experiences with their fans. Shit's horrifying, yo.
But I think the idea that Anno's trying to get across is that there is liberation in accepting the pain you bear - openly acknowledging it - and moving forward in spite of it, rather than "running away" through fantasies, or through repressing your memories, or through cherry-picking memories that prove what you want to believe about yourself and the world to the exclusion of reality. By trying to repress the pain in ways like these, you're essentially a slave to it. Only by accepting the pain, and spitting in its face and telling it that you're going to go on living in spite of it, can you truly be free.
Anno's a cynical guy, and sort of crazy. But I think his philosophy here is totally, totally right.
>entire theater singing "Knights of the round table"
That might actually be sort of fun. But god damn the rest sounds horrifying.
Shiro Sagisu did Magi?
Fuck, now I have to watch that.
So you dislike being reminded of depressing things and the reality of life? Isn't that just running away from things you don't like anon?
From what I understand, it ends up sounding a lot like this.
>an entire theater singing "Knights of the round table"
that sounds fucking awesome dude
reminds me that I need to see rocky horror again
> read in Rei's voice
"Shinji just do whatever you think it's best, and don't do it for anyone, do it for yourself".
"Oh, you did what you wanted? I HATE YOU NOW YOU LITTLE PIECE OF SHIT GET OUT OF MY SIGHT AND NEVER PILOT AN EVA AGAIN!"
Oh boy, why would we call her a cunt, right?
I might not have worded that properly. I accept and live with said harsh reality every day. My problem is actually not knowing anything other than it. What I dislike is reliving those past times. Reliving what I've already dealt with and continue to deal with. It's not that I'm running away from the reality, I'm trying to leave the past in the past. What has been done to stay as what's been done and over with.
When I say I wouldn't recommend this to anyone, I mean I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who's looking for an entertaining show. If someone wants some serious and real shit, I'd definitely give this over to them.
>What's wrong with running from things I don't don't like!?
when she said 'just do what you think is best' she meant 'don't be a fucking retard you fucking retard'
/a/ really doesn't know how to talk to girls
I guess that could still, in a sense be considered running away. Again, it's hard to explain. Watching the anime had a nice feel to it. It was nice and I enjoy thinking about it but there was just a lingering feeling of disgust. That feeling is what I don't like- yet do like at the same time. I think I'm going to leave it at that because the rest is just too ambiguous
Anyone watch Rocco from Mega64's EoE commentary?
I never knew the part about Arianne and her Komm Susser Tod dubstep remix
She's just putting on an image because she knows she's surrounded by crews and people who would want him for dead if it weren't for her being a commander.
Maybe it's nostalgic.
It's painful but it's a familiar pain.
There's comfort in familiarity.
I don't get it either, for NGE at least. Shinji is evangelion.
I swear to god Spencer's shit voice is one of the big reasons why Shinji had a huge hatebase in the west.
Is it disgust, or just discomfort? Eva gets under people's skin. That's the point, and that's what makes it so great. It's supposed to rattle you; that means it's doing its job. Yeah it's heavy shit (although not humorless - at least not until the end) but as someone who's struggled with severe depression for over half my life I actually find it really uplifting and life-affirming. It's like someone saying - and really meaning it - that they really understand your pain, but they've found the strength to go on and if they can do it, so can you. It makes you feel like you're, well, not alone.
I keep hearing people say this and keep seeing no proof of it, because people's responses to Shinji as a character don't seem to have any actual correlation with whether they watched the series dubbed or subbed.
Yeah I did, fun stuff. It's fun to hear two people who are obviously really into it talk about it and not the usual "wtf did I just watch what an emo".
Well, at least you perfectly understood NGE and EOE and got such a powerful reaction from it.
Not entirely related but something you may like:
>This is roughly the worldview for Neon Genesis Evangelion. This is a worldview drenched in a vision of pessimism. A worldview where the story starts only after any traces of optimism have been removed. And in that world, a 14-year-old boy shrinks from human contact. And he tries to live in a closed world where his behavior dooms him, and he has abandoned the attempt to understand himself. A cowardly young man who feels that his father has abandoned him, and so he has convinced himself that he is a completely unnecessary person, so much so that he cannot even commit suicide.
>And there is a 29-year-old woman who lives life so lightly as to barely allow the possibility of a human touch. She protects herself by having surface level relationships, and running away. Both are extremely afraid of being hurt. Both are unsuitable-lacking the positive attitude-for what people call heroes of an adventure. But in any case, they are the heroes of this story.
>They say, "To live is to change." I started this production with the wish that once the production complete, the world, and the heroes would change. That was my "true" desire. I tried to include everything of myself in Neon Genesis Evangelion-myself, a broken man who could do nothing for four years. A man who ran away for four years, one who was simply not dead. Then one thought. "You can't run away," came to me, and I restarted this production. It is a production where my only thought was to burn my feelings into film.
I guess moreso discomfort. It's like I shouldn't be watching it but I should. I want to. It's nice to come across something you've made it by but all the while it's like I shouldn't watch it because I feel like I'm falling back into something I once escaped. Maybe it's just a fear of falling into the past.
I don't think that poster is really right, I know people who've had the same reaction to Shinji and they watched it sub. I think the cultural factors are to blame.
Spencer's Shinji really is pretty annoying though. At least the original voice can sound cute.
I dunno, I really like Spencer's Shinji because I can totally buy him as an awkward, dorky teenager bottling up a truckload of repressed anger.
Yeah. I've read quite a bit into that. It's amazing how he was able to accurately put his experience into film. Simply amazing. I feel like I'm so close to Anno because I feel that I relate to him so well though at the same time I don't have a lot of empathy for him. I don't have a lot of empathy for him because I feel like this is something a lot of people go through and have to deal with it. It sucks, but that's the way it is and you have to make it through. It's like a test to see whether or not you're worthy of a better life. On another note, it's even harder to feel for someone who's sitting there feeling bad for themselves and do nothing but bitch, complain and sink deeper into despair. Though I don't think that's what Anno was doing, there are a lot of people out there who do that and I find it hard to show empathy to them
Not really thread relevant but I feel obligated to post this in any Eva thread:
>It's like someone saying - and really meaning it
This is the most important, you could tell they really poured their heart into it. Some depictions of it in fiction just don't resonate with me at all, or are shallow and inaccurate and just written for a short plot point, and are clearly written by someone outside of it. And then there's Evangelion which makes it the focal point of everything, while still being an exciting show to watch (which is important).
All I want in the world is for Rebuild to end, then finally have Tsurumaki and Anno to move on to new projects.
All that good directing is being fucking wasted.
So what if 3.0 made you feel this way on purpose? Like you're supposed to feel like there's no hope for the future, that what you once loved is now against you?
Think about when the series was airing. It was all good for the first 15 episodes, building Shinji up, giving him hope for the future. And you empathized with him the entire way. You understood his emptiness, his fear, his desire to be acknowledged and praised by the ones he cares for. And when he was getting better, it all goes back downhill. I'm sure that you just wanted Shinji to be happy. End of Evangelion ended up bringing everything to hell and back, and it changed Shinji for the better.
He was on that beach for a long time. He made graves for everyone. The nail that Shinji used to stick Misato's plus/cross necklace had begun rusting over. This boy, who had shied away from human contact because he was afraid of getting emotionally hurt, had just brought about the end of humanity. And it was right as he understood that he wanted to feel companionship, even if it did hurt him. So he wakes up one night to see Asuka lying next to him, despite the fact that she should be deader than dead. He sees what appears to be Rei floating over the blood-like lake. So he begins to strangle Asuka, unsure of if she's real or not. When she reacts and touches his face, he loosens his grip and breaks down in tears. This is actually meant to show his joy at realizing he's no longer alone, which is a major development in his character.
The point is that you're supposed to feel upset like Shinji is right now, and only then will you be able to reach a catharsis.
The rebuilds are missing something very important for me.
The original series gave me a intense feeling of depressiin, as if anno's depression was actually feelable.
EoE Broke the depression in the end and resembled hope and progress.
i just don't feel all this stuff in the rebuilds.
Yeah, but this is someone everyone figures. It's also a bit more about how you feel, it's also about what you can take from the experience.
There won't be any catharsis for Reifags for instance.
Hey OP, im the man child who was cumming for Kaworu, you didnt know shit about the movie lol, you and your friend bread/10 would not watch Deepness with you again, lol
You didnt get a sticker either. Mad brah?
There are at least 777 reasons why 3.0 was shit.
Smelling the madness of your post
Are you OP?
>You can (not) refund
Don't really get the hate for 3.0. I don't really think it fucked up anything that the decision to convey a whole new series' worth of material over the course of four movies or the bloated clusterfuckery of 2.0 hadn't already. If anything it was a step back in the right direction, given that it had a more focused plot and heavy atmosphere, like 1.0, that got lost in 2.0.
I mean it still doesn't hold a candle to the original series, but it's not exceptionally bad in any way that departs radically from the previous two films.
If they would have made the piano scenes a bit less pandering, gotten rid of the cat Unit 02, and let the pilots age, I think I would have really liked it to be honest.
also fix Rei.
I feel the same but /a/ will always find a way to make it seem like total unreedemable shit.
>all these fanboy tears
Anno is still playing with you poor fuckers
>Don't really get the hate for 3.0
I read the rest of your post, and it's because you neither get Evangelion, Rebuild, or good storytelling.
You'll have people coming and going day in day out explaining to you why the movie deserves hate or at least why they think it deserves hate. Don't play the "i dun get it" card, you should know by now.
At least your reasoning is moronic at best, heavy atmosphere, focused plot? It's like you never even watched NGE. 2.0 is more focused than it would have been had they gone straight adaptation style, and the first six episodes isn't exactly plot hea- oh who am I kidding. You don't know what you're talking about do you?
It's not finding a way, as in describing the movie as it is with no sugarcoating. Anno is playing with everyone, and it ended up making the movie irredeemable shit except to a select few who never expected a good movie to begin with.
You mean like the gratuitous Asuka crotch-shots or Mari jiggling in 2.0?
Also the best part of the movie for me was the revelation that piloting an Eva makes you developmentally stunted. META AS FUCK, ANNO.
What a compelling argument
Not him, but those are pandering&fanservice. The whole direction it took could be considered to be pandering as well.
Like you'd reply to a serious argument anyway, shitter.
Rei is basically in the same state as Yui, isn't she? She got absorbed by Unit 01 at the end of 2.0, right? If I'm not retarded and that's what happened, there's still some hope for Reifags.
Gendo's plan will actually work in 4.0 and Rei will come out of Unit 01 along with Yui, is what I'm saying.
Where's the catharsis in that?
yui doesn't seem to actually effect 01 in rebuild tho. All the scenes where it moves of its own volition aren't present in the rebuild fiilms.
You either don't get Eva or just have no clue about how competent storytelling works.
You may not get Reifags, or the peculiarities of Rei. That she's in there with Yui is already a big problem since it puts them on a hiearchy where Rei is lower. The clone, the offshoot, that's lesser. Worse, since Rei is in this predicament not exactly of her own will, which means she's after 3.0 a typical damsel in distress.
Saving Rei or getting her out isn't a good thing, it's actually going to make things worse. There isn't any time left to put back what Rei is missing, or to make up any new content that will actually matter for the character, much less solving the Rei Q issue. Any sudden BIG IMPROVEMENT is just for show, and I doubt even Reifags will take that seriously. It'll just be a magic quick fix through plot rather than character. Like a half-assed, half-hearted "apology" of sorts.
In the meantime, Rei's entire character is more or less neglected, the last you saw was poka-poka Rei which no longer has any place in Rebuild.
The final bit is >implying godhood
and would I care? No. Would Reifags be likely to care? Not in the slightest. What about you?
I'm one, and not samefag.
Don't make me take pictures of my screen you dipshit.
because Anno feels better irl, you've already been through MAX DEPRESSION so Rebuild is tame in comparison. maybe Eva newfags are feeling the sadness.
Why do you think Anno has something to do with this?
Rebuild is jew shit.
What the fuck were you expecting, faggot?
Mari's voice actor is amazing (and fucking bonkers)
"JUST FUCKING DIIIEEEE" etc
>From most recent 4.0 trailer in japan
>if I was supposed to just as confused as Shinji than god damnit Anno you got me real fucking good.
>Just one giant fucking filler episode?
>However it just seemed like nothing really happened this movie.
That's how I felt too. It's absolutely useless on it's own without 4.0.
The most ridiculous part of this movie was during the piano duet montage when right the fuck out of nowhere it cuts to fucking HORSES running through a field in majestic slow motion. The entire theater where I saw the movie cracked up at that part, probably because it was impossible not to think of the "Pleasure Town" scene form Anchorman:
Nice try. It's from some weird horse-racing cross-promotion.
Anno is trolling he knew that he could bring out eva themed toasters or buttplugs and still get loads of money for it.
Next movie Shinji has Shinji wake up and it's like a week after the Zeruel battle and has Asuka and Mari pilot the Evabuster complete with Fly High cover.
Thank god this thread was here. I've been marathoning NGE, I borrowed all of the dvd's from a friend. I'm too far in to stop now. Here's my dilemma: The dvd's containing episodes 21-26 are director's cut, meaning they have both the original and director's cut episodes on them. I've been watching the show as the originals all the way through. Do I watch the rest in director's cut or finish it normally? Either way, I'll be borrowing 1.0 and 2.0 after this.
We're talking about Shinji and Kaworu. Not straight guys involved. If they had been Fuyutsuki and Gendo, sure.
>2.22 ends with impact, left wondering where story will go
>they completely leave that cliffhanger for a dumb timeskip
>3.33 ends with impact again, only thing different from the start is that the world is fucked up a little more and Shinji is more depressed than at the beginning
Honestly I can't feel a lick of hype for the next one. Shinji, black Rei and Shikinami are boring as fuck. Kaworu was a non-character and ded. Misato is too old to get screentime anymore and Kaji is irrelevant.
Oh yes, it was brilliant! A post-modern work of art that gives deep insight into the hearts of men, as well as contemporary pop culture!
It's deep ironic take on fanservice is also a delight to behold!
No one outside some fujoshit thinks Shinji is gay. Besides, the homo pandering scenes where hilariously awful and cheesy which is why people laughed hard.
Only God knows i'm innocent!
No one is discussing with you because you got it pretty right.
8/10 anon would share my HDD with
These edits are getting more and more retarded and funny everyday
>tfw two years ago you still had faith in Anno and Rebuild
>tfw they just needed to build up the characters more and we'd be in for one hell of a 4.0
>tfw it could have been amazing in every possible way
>tfw I saw the poster
>tfw I saw the trailer
>tfw I realized
>tfw I saw the movie
>tfw faith lost
I sorta get why /a/ is freaking out about Rebuild, I just don't understand why they're only doing it after 3.0 and not either of the previous two films. If anything, 3.0 was an improvement.
I feel like that would be more dramatic if they gave him a character beyond "guy who appears out of nowhere and is gay for Shinji"
The tragic music just isn't enough, it feels so forced. it was funny though.
The two previous films were great.
>implying I don't have a fetish for this
You're only making my dick harder
3.33 has forced drama, shit characters, lots of stupidity with no explanation, homo pandering and has a timeskip. It's a formula for bashing here.
When is Anno announcing 5.0?
3.0 was the opposite of an improvement. It alone scuttled any chance Rebuild had to make for great characters, story and plot by the end.
You may say that since you're a fan, and found some things about 3.0 agreeable, like Kaworu being shipped to the MAX, Asuka being cool or whatever, but all in all you're just reacting to the superficial result. Those characters are all shallow and you know it. The plot is paper-thin, and there's no real attempt to develop it either.
/a/ can get hype about the two previous ones, since it's doing it's fair share in developing and establishing plot, setting and character. It goes somewhere, and it's not outright insulting to watch. Kind of like how NGE was for it's first half, meaning that if Rebuild was good so far, it could only get better.
What you think was an improvement (for some reason I don't even), wasn't.
The bitter truth you're left with is that thanks to 3.0, there's not even enough time left to make use of it's own characters properly, much less what it had been doing for two movies.
All you're left with is either a crazy laser battle show, and satisfaction depending on which characters you're cheering for.
It's bad to say you laughed at someone dying, but I laughed when Kaworu died too. I couldn't help it, the melodrama was over the top, and someone somewhere took it all seriously I bet.
1.0 was good, 2.0 was a colossal bloated mess that couldn't keep track of its own characters and subplots and watered down or altogether eliminated pretty much everything that made the original series great.
Because 1.0 and 2.0 was exactly what was needed for Rebuild to not be a piece of shit rehash.
1.0 sets the stage, same shit, few differences
2.0 moves on the stage into a new direction, amazing cliffhanger
Most of the good work is done in 2.0 by removing frivolous EVA parts and condensing everything so you can get onto some new stage eventually
...then 3.0 happens and it just hits the big reset button on everything and provides characters that are there more for plot than themselves, becoming more shallow than they were in 2.0.
>1.0 was good, 2.0 was a colossal bloated mess that couldn't keep track of its own characters and subplots and watered down or altogether eliminated pretty much everything that made the original series great.
I read that entire sentence and none of it made any logical sense whatsoever.
>2.0 was a colossal bloated mess that couldn't keep track of its own characters and subplots
Looks like it kept track of it's characters fine to me, not to mention it's subplots.
What exactly did it eliminate that made the original series great? If anything, it kept everything in and left a lot of space for new developments.
To be honest I don't think you know what you're talking about. If you're the same guy that says 3.0 was an improvement, then what the actual fuck? Did you actually watch NGE or did you begin with the Rebuilds?
this whole post is so passive aggressive, can you see that in retrospect?
Man not to be a douche, but that seems so far from reality to me that I'm sure you're either baiting for a response, or thinks the show is all about Asuka and Shinji or Kaworu and Shinji or something.
>picture of Rei Q
>"I...contribute nothing to the plot. Unless it is an order."
Got a chuckle out of me.
But yeah, agreed.
ANNO DOESN'T WORK ON REBUILD YOU FAGS STOP BEING SO NEW
Well he sure likes to take credit for it then.
Are you me?
>Evangelion: 3.0 You Can (Not) Redo...is a Japanese animated film directed by Hideaki Anno
Wow sure told me!
top kek review
who are you quoting?
They just use him as marionette so they sell more. Boss of Gainax said it himself.
Still makes him the lynchpin.
Yes, and I'm sure all those statements of intent and interviews and open letters and essays he's written about working on the tetralogy are all ghostwritten by Akiyuki Shinbo or something.
Rebuild is Shinbo-tier, the work of a hack.
What happened Anno? You used to be cool
INTO THE TRASH IT GOES
How can stating an opinion be considered passive aggressive?
I think you just used a buzzword because you don't know what the fuck you are talking about
No he means the tone of the post, which is basically a series of veiled insults against the dub
Not him, but try reading the post in your head as if it was in a sarcastic tone.
Because what he describes really is utterly retarded, it fits so well.
>I loved the way Asuka sounded when she went alll "Here we gooooooooooo"!
Same thing what happened to George Lucas.
No, that's not true, THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE!
Here we go again. Care to enter into the fray?
>Association tasked with saving the world.
>Consisting of the best of the best of all humanity's professionals.
>Recover the most important, mentally unstable, boy of the world.
>kek toplel let's spit on his face and kick his balls and let him loose nothing bad can happen right guys?
For a bunch of elite savior of the world, they sure are retarded.
Search your feelings, you KNOW it to be true!
Shinbo's works are better.
>I asked Anno-san about his high school days, and specifically how he did in his literature class. He recounts his high school days and how he often got into arguments with his literature teacher. When asked to write an essay one day, Anno purposefully wrote a terrible essay filled with grammar errors and with kanji specifically being written improperly as to give the appearance of illiteracy. This was supposed to be a commentary on how terrible the average high school essay was and how intellectual pursuits are being abandoned in modern society in favor of more superficial needs.
>Despite Anno's desperate cries of "B-but it was shit on purpose, it's social commentary", his teacher still gave him a failing grade.
It's a fact, Anon, and you must accept it. Do you understand me?
I went to the theaters with a group of friends and we soon learned that the theater was filled 2 other groups....a local anime club from a university and a small group of cosplayers who were dressed in plugsuits and uniforms(mostly Rei)
Judging from the meat sacks....it was about 20% normal looking people, 20% neck beards, 30% Ham Easts and the rest were cosplayers...
my group was 12 strong, including myself. We all watched the sub. 10 guys, 2 girls. When kaworu died we all bursted into laughter and got angry looked from Yaoi plushie landwahles.
>When kaworu died we all bursted into laughter and got angry looked from Yaoi plushie landwahles.
>bursting into laughter
I hate people who do that when watching a movie.
A giggle is fine but laughing out load is obnoxious as fuck.
I'd shame you for laughing, but I laughed too.
I think the movie deserves to be laughed at
>When kaworu died we all bursted into laughter and got angry looked from Yaoi plushie landwahles
Braver soul than I....I would have been afraid of being eaten.
> "I'm Maki Suzuhara!"
> mfw I laugh knowingly at this
> mfw I'm the only person in the theater who laughs at this
> mfw I am biggest Evafag in the theater
I know, I'm probably just being autistic, but it's just a big pet peeve of mine.
>What exactly did it eliminate that made the original series great
The extended character development.
No you're right, keep your trap shut in cinemas.
But if it's funny, it evokes a spontaneous reaction that's hard to control. If a movie is genuinely funny, then it's going to evoke laughs.
No one outside of some deluded waifufags who think Eva is a harem believe Shinji is straight.
>The extended character development.
You mean, 3.0 did that.
But her name is Sakura
I miss Toji
He's bisexual to me but that's doesn't excuse the shitty homoerotic scenes. If they did a good job with those scenes then it wouldn't be a problem.
>yfw neo-evafags are a thing now
Doesn't 2.0 do development as well? Not sure if I get what you're saying - not only does 1.0 and 2.0 make characters that develop and are ready to be developed further, they make some pretty darned drastic changes to force it as well. 3.0 pretty much ignored that however.
Extended character development, huh. If anything it sounds like it'd be in the latter half of Evangelion, and 2.0 is like, the first half? I'd have put my hopes on the second half where it does that the best.
His bisexuality is just an extension from his own insecurity that's why whoever makes intimal contact with him makes he blush.
No, 2.0 did it by rushing through their entire character arcs from the original series without the time and detail that was available there to properly establish them. 3.0 realizes how badly 2.0 had already screwed the pooch on this and wisely narrows the focus down to just a few characters that can actually be given at least a little bit of depth with only two more films to go and a project whose scope Anno and co. are probably realizing in retrospect would have been better suited to a TV or OVA series rather than a set of movies.
3.0 also restores a bit of the atmosphere of loneliness and dread from the original series that 2.0 more or less threw out the window.
Did they clap at the end too?
I was thinking it'd be funny if you added a laugh track to some select scenes of 3.33. With the english dub, perhaps.
Whoops I meant Sakura
Yes that's how unimportant a character she was
I miss Toji being an actual character and not just a guy who shows up for a few minutes and is never really developed. The same goes for the entire supporting cast, really.
So he's actually asexual.
>He's only bisexual because of reasons, he's not really bisexual!!!
Sure, it added that atmosphere but it didn't "wisely narrow" the focus down. It did a horrible job of this. It narrowed it down by gutting so many character arcs and it did a messy job gutting them
Why did 3.0 introduce a bunch of totally new characters who only show up in the first 20 minutes and each get like maybe two lines of non-technobabble dialogue?
>Sakura wasn't important
Without Sakura Touji wouldn't have hit Shinji in the playground and then became friends; and afterwards being selected as pilot for 03 with the consequence we all know.
Closeted fag pls go. Mari shoved her tits on his face and he reacted less to that than when Kaji came on him.
>No, 2.0 did it by rushing through their entire character arcs from the original series without the time and detail that was available there to properly establish them.
Meh, you're just misinformed. Their character arcs aren't even half-complete and some are all new. No argument.
3.0 restores nothing but a very superficial element you place far too much value in.
In case you haven't noticed Evangelion really digs Freudian psychology, which holds that everyone is innately bisexual.
>implying he was an actual character to begin with
At least he had more characterization than all the new characters in 3.0 and Mari put together
I don't get what the fuss is. Did people expect Shinji wasn't going to be punished for saving Rei disregarding the world? The timeskip was annoying, but that was coming.
I'm talking about Rebuild fool
Yes, she was a more important character in the one where you never actually saw her!
He not used to people getting close to him; that's why he thought about dating Kaji in NGE.
She kissed Asuka in the heat of the moment and he would kiss Kaworu in the same circumstances. He is cold-blooded enough to take those decisions
Although he loves Asuka and Asuka loves him
Yeah I'm going to call bullshit on that. To give you the easiest reason why, your reasoning pretty much validates the points others make against 3.33 here, that 3.33 just "gave up", instead of trying to make for something new.
Most importantly, the character arcs from NGE aren't complete, some haven't even begun yet, and some have actually been dropped. This was clear from 1.0 that already dropped an episode's worth of content and numerous important scenes. In 2.0 we get served one of two things, new character arcs, or reworked character arcs that change the characters themselves.
There is nothing "rushed" here, that's a bad feint of an argument you put up.
Regarding characters, you're wrong and as such also your argument. So what does 3.0 do then? Like mentioned earlier, it gives up and throws it all away, basically. It gives up on developing what was there in favor of replicating only the some of mood, but without what actually made the mood: the characters and established setting.
That's why 3.0 appears just as a forced return to some key plot points in episode 23 and 24.
On the contrary, without 2.0 being as it was, 3.0 would have been even more screwed in terms of both time and character - 2.0 makes it possible for them to seize the opportunity to develop the characters freshly, but they skipped that. Doing that kind of work is hard, you know.
3.0 doesn't restore any atmosphere, because the atmosphere you speak of was only present near the ending. It restores nothing, it makes the transition very poorly.
I seriously don't think you're arguing on any other basis but "muh kawoshin" or any other idiocy.
You're an idiot. Get lost.
What? Shinji was on the ground on a futon and Kaworu was on a bed, wide awake. Asuka was next to him on a futon, asleep.
You'd expect Shinji to go through some shit, but punishment, haha no. I get that fans would see him punished for going for a waifu though. Poor Shinji can't do anything without someone somewhere judging him.
who /shivers up their spine/ at the end of 2.22?
Is it /u/ time?
Oh fugg forgot to take off cruise control
Kidding, I suppose they'll get more importance in 4.0
pls post more
I question the moral grounds of anyone who expects Shinji to be punished. That's just taking the hate too fucking far, and it tells me the fanbase is unsalvageable.
This has nothing to do with "waifu". NGE always was about saying goodbye to the mother, the parasitic connection to the mother being self-destructive (for Asuka and Shinji) when they disregard the whole world only for this.
Shinji plunged to look for his mother's clone, claiming he didn't care for the world. In doing so, he inwardly became like his father, who was a negative figure of regression and not of development.
> gutting so many character arcs
Not making them the focus of this particular film doesn't mean that they were gutted. It means that this particular film was more focused than the last one.
Asuka and Rei's character arcs, at the very least, were absurdly forced and rushed in 2.0, and Mari hasn't even had a character arc to speak of so far. Toji, Kensuke and Ritsuko were pretty much dropped from having any real relevance to the plot beyond just existing at the periphery.
Yeah, that sounds like waifu-crap to me.
You don't fucking see any of the other members of NERV Int. and they carry out an important role, too. >>100288756
True, however I think that Shinji's "bisexuality" comes from insecurity, nothing deeper than that in his case.
That's because he loves Asuka
He loves Pen2. He's insecure because he wants to be a girl and Asuka has the body he desired to have.
You should know he isn't strong enough to take the first step.
ノット ディソ スレ アゲン
Asuka > Misato = Maya > Mari > Maki = Ritsuko > Emotionless Boring Plotdevice Doll that is only liked by Beta Japanese men who don't wish to have a meaningful life
No he's actually right though
I laughed a lot with this. I'm shit.
Looking at your post and reasoning, I'm fairly sure that it's waifu. Look at what you wrote for instance, and then how you wrote "people". Your expectations for punishment are solely based on an interpretation instead of them as characters. It's not uncommon, so don't be afraid to admit it, but seeing as most, especially evageeks don't particularly care for Rei primarily because they are into shipping and Asuka, which often causes them to dislike Rei and 2.0.
More so your interpretation more or less ignores the character/setting aspect of it, and if I may say so, is too dogmatic to hold much value other than one's opinion. Juxtapose the scenario in 2.0 with reality, and you'll see that the offered interpretation makes absolutely no sense, and even in-universe it's totally nonsensical.
To put it in simpler terms, you want Shinji to be punished for straying away from what you'd want him to do. Not for what he actually did and at what time, which is when viewed without bias fairly good all things considered.
It's waifu-crap. You can see it when he uses interpretation to justify what happened in the show. In the show, it makes no sense. But add interpretation, and anything can make sense.
No matter what happens.
I agree until you get to Misato.
Rei is my favorite character in NGE, but she's treated as plot device even in EoE because of Shinji's Oedipus issues metaphor. It was incredibly plain with all the overlapping images with Yui that Rei in Rebuild was again set up for this.
I'm not ignoring anything. You put a blinder of Anno's obvious themes and ideas. The departure with the Mother is something he always, for his own personal family drama, explored. Eva having Shinji's MOTHER'S SOUL should have been fucking obvious.
Shinji was punished because in terms of a coming of age, he regressed back to the womb to hug a mother substitute when Eva is about (partly) separation from those comfort zones and trip into the adult world. Hurtful, unpleasant adult world.
> but she's treated as a plot device even in EoE
You lost me here. EoE was actually a totally sensible resolution of her character arc.
I'm going to say stop at naming favorites, not that I believe you anyway. It's pointless, and highly doubtable since your argumentation basically reduces Rei's character to well, a plot-device and not a character.
You can counter with interpretation all you want, but it still means you're ignoring what happens in the show and for what reasons presented in the show.
In other words, you're second-guessing a japanese director you don't know, that is Evangelion for you isn't about Evangelion itself, it's solely about guessing what Anno wanted to say. Here's the trap everyone and you fall in by doing that: You automatically assume "Anno" is 100% correct. Even if the outcome was different, you'd be reaching the same conclusion of correctness, instead of starting at the bottom and analyzing it from scratch to see whether or not the pieces fit or not.
Anno's themes and ideas, they change with the wind depending on the argument.
As for expecting him to be punished, that's really shaky ground and could only happen if you actually wanted him to get punished. Since all you present is at best, hind-sight symbolism.
Where she, for no apparent reason, backstabs Gendo and, again for no apparent reason since she doesn't know him, gives a shit about Shinji? The last episodes of NGE, absolutely. But her role in EoE was absolutely deplorable. She was just a convenient apocalyptic maiden without real substance of her debate.
>Rei is my favorite character in NGE
Liar, liar, pants on fire. You don't claim it's your favorite and then second claim it's just a plot device.
Rei was always turned from character to blank plot device symbolism for Anno to enforce his agenda.
Read what I originally said. >>100288796
How has Anno not proved anything I said already? I can't believe people honestly thought Shinji's development wasn't regressive for his narrative standard and the story wouldn't backhand him. That's some delusion powers.
You can't say Rei is your favorite character and then say it was for no apparent reason. Did you not catch the bitterness mixed in with Rei's relation to "that man", Gendo? Especially the third?
You might not have caught on to it, but Rei does know Shinji, and Gendo. Rei remembers since she retains some of her memories, but everything changes once she wakes up as the third - it's an extremely traumatic experience, to know you've died and then come back, to not remember what happened, and to know you've been "replaced".
>Rei was always turned from character to blank plot device symbolism for Anno to enforce his agenda.
Not always, Rei gets a better deal than the rest in NGE, and not a too shabby one in EoE that retains her character.
If this is you: >>100289869
then I don't believe you either when you say Rei is your favourite, since it's hard to have a favourite and then miss that much of the character.
>How has Anno not proved anything I said already? I can't believe people honestly thought Shinji's development wasn't regressive for his narrative standard and the story wouldn't backhand him. That's some delusion powers.
He hasn't proved anything, and neither have you. Proof is a bit more tricky since it needs to prove regression taking into account every bit of the context, and then I mean real-context as presented. Metaphorical, is more or less up to interpretation.
Basically, if you want to be realistic about it, you and second-guessed Anno is flat wrong.
The story usually backhands Shinji as well as the others, but punishment? No, not really.
>Paying money to watch the shitbuilds
You got what you deserve.
I don't think turning expressionless again for a few episodes to finish out her character arc is really to be turned into a plot device. If anything, in NGE, Rei was found advocating the exact opposite of what you suggest she symbolizes, reality. Her dialogue is connected with truth and reality, whilst others can represent fantasy in NGE's dialogue.
I see the point people make, but I can't find myself seeing the symbolism being carried out well here, hence:
>I can't believe people honestly thought Shinji's development wasn't regressive for his narrative standard and the story wouldn't backhand him. That's some delusion powers.
If anything, it's more that they aren't brainwashed with said "agenda", which is less of an agenda but a mindset appropriated to justify everything Evangelion does as being correct. It's usual for this to happen eventually in cult-like groupings since it does away with critical thinking and lets the group focus more on perpetuating itself, bad or good.
So "people", the audience, who refer to the characters as characters with motivations, goals and so forth, will be at odds with this agenda of yours. On contrary it actually takes some delusion powers to actually expect what you suggest.
It has some very sad implications for Evangelion itself, and that should be clear:
The framework of symbolism that the agenda represents is mostly disconnected with the characters in the show. Which means that everything Evangelion spends time on, essentially means nothing in the end since the progression,outcome and overall meaning never changes. There's the interpretation of it, a desired interpretation that exists above the actual text, and now we're seeing an interpretation that actually affects the text directly. Doesn't that make everything pointless, since it doesn't back up the interpretation other than in possibly outcome?
Honestly I think a little bit of worldbuilding would have improved 3.0
I was curious if any pockets of humanity remained besides our cast of characters.
But we weren't really shown much so i must assume that everyone is dead.
Close, but this one makes me cry even more
At this point it doesn't matter much.
They could probably do some HOPE shit at the beginning/middle of 4.0 to show some of humanity survived, just as they get attacked by NERV to start final impact or some shit.
I mean shit writes itself basically, and it's boring.
2.0 was pretty fuckin bad mang. Not as bad as 3.0 because you'd have to try really hard to one up 3.0 in screwing up a series.
Remember, 2.0 is where we got Mari, who up until the crew of the giant ship in 3.0 was the most worthless character addition in Eva's universe. Asuka's character was COMPLETELY butchered, they shoved an entire series worth of development into a 30 second scene with her doll (that won't hold any meaning to a viewer unless they watched the original series), her elevator scene with Rei was reduced to a petty catfight over Shinji, and her conversation with Misato before she gets into Unit-03 seems to imply she had positive, life improving character developments when there was nothing really there in the 20 minutes of screentime she had in 2.0. Rei's dinner party could have been a good attempt at developing character relationships but it turned into fan-pandering with Asuka and Rei cooking to win Shinji's heart uguu~
But the single most retarded part was the end of 2.0. How the fuck did Shinji cause third impact out of nowhere? Because he listened to his heart? Because he felt he lost enough so he alpha'd up and decided what he wanted to protect? We don't fucking know. The movie went full shonen at the end, and we still have no justification as to why Shinji suddenly becomes so badass that he can cause apocalypses. It didn't seem to serve any purpose other than giving the audience a badass adrenaline rush scene and a cliffhanger ending.
Which as we all know 3.0 failed spectacularly to build off of.
Yeah I completely agree. Sure everything up to his instrumentality case is absolute horror but
we see that he(and others) improves as a character. That was the whole point of the show anyway.
He realizes that he could learn to love himself. That not everyone truly hates him and that its okay to reveal his feelings. Yes he knows there will be pain and nothing is forever but its still worth a try because at the time it was real.
I think a lot of people show too much focus on the real life scenes taking place earlier and they don't compare the progress from the beach to the kitchen scene for example.
Both of them came back. Both of them improved. They weren't able to get close earlier although they secretly wanted to because of their own problems. Everyone else that died can do the same.
And now we have the Rebuilds where Asuka so far had like 5 min of dialogue screen time total lol
What are you 4?
All things in consideration, take 1.0 into the calculations as well. You know that due to 1.0's changes, and how it cut stuff, Rebuild could never do a full remake. They could opt for new, after all which is worse, a rehash with cut stuff, or them doing something new and good? I say the rehash is worse, but easier to do.
I don't see Asuka's character as butchered, but renewed. Mari's addition remains the strongest character addition ever, they failed to make use of it. Same with Asuka's new scenes, but the catfight elevator scene was always a catfight with only one cat intent on fighting.
They aren't cooking to win his heart either, and this is why your criticism loses validity since you can't interpret down even the basics. They even spell it out for you, and contrary to what you suggest, it does succeed in developing their characters.
All I see is a lot of complaints that misrepresent what was actually done, and that's rather petty of you.
Regarding the impacts, it's a new factor that's set up as a cliff hanger. If this was regular Evangelion, they'd delve into it or have lots of commentary regarding it, which you saw didn't happen in 3.0. Even this just seems like knee-jerk reactions from you.
You know very well it's not some cooking contest to win his "heart", and you know damned well that it's not badassery that causes the impacts. You have the justification for Shinji becoming "badass", but you don't know exactly how it ties into starting impacts, much like how you're not sure why berserk can happen and how it happens.
Rei drops plenty of hints for you if you paid attention, that scene you mistakenly describe as being just a "catfight" helps you: "EVA is a mirror of your heart". Rei said that, and it mirrors Shinji's heart.
You waited on that long ass ticket line, I strolled right in with my online ticket and got a good seat.
This, the dub was infinitely better than the original. Disney should do EVA from here on out, because it's obvious the gooks can't do it right and there always have to be dub in order for people to enjoy it.
I can't fault 2.0 for doing something new, even if it did introduce Mari. If I'm to be objective, I have to acknowledge that Mari was the most developed in 2.0, as a character, just like everyone else was. I appreciate a new direction as long as it appears like they're doing constructive work, and simple not just pandering. At the end of the day, Evangelion has a lot of pandering, especially the original in the same timeslot 2.0 occupies, which means I can't really fault 2.0 for having it as well. What I can fault not 2.0 for but the entire Rebuild team, is not committing to the new direction they took.
I'd rather have the characters developed further and changed, rather than discarded.
>Because he felt he lost enough so he alpha'd up and decided what he wanted to protect? We don't fucking know.
Something like that. He realizes his absence did mess stuff up, and he wants to set things straight. He saw Rei get absorbed, and he does not like what he sees, so he wants to rescue Rei who Misato just prepped up the flags for earlier, in telling Shinji how she had prepared to bring together father and son as a surprise.
You DO know why Shinji reacts like that, it's really simple to put together. It's guilt, desire and renewed faith all in one.
So what was the real intention of the cooking ?
Rei was trying to help Shinji but I'm pretty sure Asuka did it at least partially to show affection to him.
But I agree that it helped with developing her character. She actually does something for someone else. She openly displays her feelings in a positive way. When she sees Rei's hand she also starts to think about other peoples feelings more.
Which leads to her offer for the test and talking to Misato since she realizes that doing these things is actually nice.
Still kinda sad that that's all we got from 3 movies. 3.0 is just her telling us that she mourned him, still called for his help and that at the end she comes back for him.
That doll though'
The doll could have significance, such as a changed backstory leading to a new past - perhaps it was a dear keepsake, the only thing she had left from her mother? There's a billion options but I find that Asuka fans are very inflexible when there's fear and insecurity regarding her relationship with Shinji.
It could still be touched on.
same here OP, at the dallas showing
>took a friend
>he's high so its all good
>black weebos starts making noise and screaming
>i think someone brought beer or some loud as cans
>lights go out,people start freaking out
>gay scenes, everyone laughing hard
>people talking in corner
>people grunting or cuming every time rei or asuka got screen time, it happened right behind me
>friend is no longer comfortable and tells me he is about to leave if it gets any worse
at least cosplayers were ok and there was some fine bitches
Oh hm well I'm not one of those.
From the way she reacts after she sees Rei's hand its definitely possible that her feelings are not that deep for him this time.
Still obviously a good friend but you can mourn, call and help them like she did in 3.0 too.
I can see 4.0 completely ignoring any sort of deeper bond between them. Just friends like the song tells us that plays when she gets absorbed.
Yeah I would like to know more about the doll and her past.
How was Mari developed at all? She's introduced as a badass, fun, borderline psycho adrenaline junky and she's never changed in that sense. We hardly ever get any look into her thoughts or feeilngs or even an explanation of who she actually is. She is the epitome of pandering.
Nobody wants a direct remake or adaptation of the original, because that'd be an even bigger cash grab than our current rebuild. Thing is, if you're gonna try something new you can't do a shitty job at it.
Take Asuka, whose positive development (as in, until she gets fucked up by Bardiel she seems to be in a pretty good spot) hardly matters to me because it was so easy and fast. She comes into the movie a cocky bitch as always but she's also pretty shy and shrinks into her gameboy in the face of social interaction. Why? We dunno. Guess she couldn't make friends being an Eva pilot and all. In the original, Asuka's character is pretty obviously a product of her childhood, which is revealed bit by bit as the show progresses. We care about that character because she suffered in the past and she's still suffering now as she tries to cope with it. We don't get any of that in 2.0 because well, Asuka hardly had any screen time.
So what did 2.0 do with Asuka's screentime? She comes in. Hates Rei because she's the 'favorite'. Has some nice fan service in Misato's apartment, then lays in bed and acknowledges that she's special and will always be alone. Why does she say that? We dunno. Best we can do is speculate that she really is special and thus didn't have any friends as a kid. The eighth angel comes and Asuka has a humbling experience, realizing she can't defeat the angels alone. I guess this is an example of the rebuild "developing in a new direction", because whereas the original Asuka would have brooded in her self-esteem and shrunk further in into her unhappiness, the new Asuka goes and tries to open up to Shinji. Why does she do this? We dunno. Maybe its cause she likes Shinji. Maybe this Asuka is more level-headed than the old Asuka (in which case, all we have is a more boring, ordinary character).
That seems to be the direction 2.0 was trying to take though. After the elevator scene, Asuka acknowledges that Rei had more cuts on her hand than her, realizing that Rei likes Shinji too and has put more dedication into him. So what does she do? Good-natured Asuka volunteers to pilot Unit 03 so Rei can have her dinner party, and she has a nice little conversation with Misato about how meeting friends was a good thing for her.
Why does Asuka suddenly become a good person? I can pull two interpretations out of this:
a) The Rebuild Asuka really is just a decent girl without a traumatic past that nurtured the borderline psycho personality traits the old Asuka had. In which case we just have a boring character.
b) The new Asuka came in a damaged (dunno how) and lonely character but by making friends she became a better person. In which case we just have a boring development.
>you know damned well that it's not badassery that causes the impacts.
Then what caused pseudo-third impact? In the original it made sense for Unit-01 to suddenly go berserk on Zeruel's ass because Unit-01 already did that in the first 2 episodes of the series. There is NO precedent for what Shinji did in 2.0, apart from Asuka nearly reviving a dead Unit-02 in EoE, and that simply justifies moving an Eva after it's ran out of power, not causing a third impact when it hasn't even achieved god-mode yet.
You can't just posit that the doll has significance when the movie hasn't shown any significance yet. And seeing as the doll is nowhere to be found in 3.0, I doubt it'll be touched on.
NO, but the one kowaru fan was going mad hard from like the beginning and was consistently making orgasmic level noises when the movie started and when space jesus had screen time. And for what? his head got popped hard than in the anime
>hen what caused pseudo-third impact?
Son, are you dense? Badassery itself does not start impacts. Ancient God machines do.
There was no precedent for when EVA01 goes berserk either, it's filled in later with plot and background. Is this your first fictional story, do you want to be spoonfed?
also, fine bitches you say?
3.0 makes me so mad.
I didn't even like the gay scenes, they were nowhere near homoerotic enough. Go hard or go home.
>She's introduced as a badass, fun, borderline psycho adrenaline junky and she's never changed in that sense. We hardly ever get any look into her thoughts or feeilngs or even an explanation of who she actually is. She is the epitome of pandering.
Developed as in she evolves from just new character to what you described her as. Not as much development or change per se, but it's more than 3.0.
Asuka's screentime isn't that important. Might hurt you, but that's the truth. If you want to cut the bullshit, you cut a lot of Asuka.
You're able to pull something out of it by reading your post, which is fine. Not satisfied? Well I wouldn't be satisfied with Asuka's introduction in NGE either. There's still 3.0- oh wait, that's right.
You might get just that. 4.0 is a good time for delving into pasts for Asuka.
>You can't just posit that the doll has significance when the movie hasn't shown any significance yet.
It has significance for Asuka in 2.0. Shot down. Go away.
>And seeing as the doll is nowhere to be found in 3.0, I doubt it'll be touched on.
A lot of things are nowhere to be found in 3.0, such as good characters, plot, story, etc...
Just because it's not in 3.0, doesn't mean it won't be in 4.0 in the form of flashbacks.
Wasn't it like the direct connection between EVA core + Angel core with Rei/Lilith Shinji ?
Combining the wisdom and life in _one form_ and then using the "key" or how they explained it in EoE. Or maybe that was just for instrumentality. Duh
In 3.0 they also intentionally merged the angel with mark 13 to start the impact. If I remember correctly.
I agree that its already supposed to have importance in 2.0. You just have to look deeper.
Like almost all the characters you have to compare it to her old NGE past. See the advance.
Still thats all just interpreting and guessing. Some real solid flashback would be nicer.
I'am also looking forward to the explanation why Shinji can't synch with EVA01 anymore.
>Still thats all just interpreting and guessing. Some real solid flashback would be nicer.
Which you will get in due time. It took until episode 22.
I mean damn, stop being a baby wanting answers NOW.
Well and Kawo died in 24...
Nevermind I can still wait for them to appear in 4.0. A sad flashback + explanation like that wouldn't have fit in 2.0 anyway. No time and the tone of the movie was different. It was too early.
I just hope that we will get those answers at all. That there is something about her mother that makes Asuka. Asuka
where were you sitting at?, I was sitting in the middle column close to the front at the right edge, there was a black weeboos in front and a kowaru cosplayer too. what were those bottle noises,
[spoiIer]You're doin it rong[/spoiIer]
If you were at the NY showing, that we me and my friend splitting a bottle of Honey jack daniels
op again, we were sitting like 3rd row from the front and in the middle. Pretty much next to the guy who said every one shut the fuck up
at least it's some nice german.
Compared to the trailers, it was pretty damn tame.
Hell, 3.0 may have been the least gay so far. Both the manga and the tv series beat it out.
no, I was at dallas showing, my friend was high I was hammered, but I think someone snuck in with beer bottles, but fuck they made so much noise
Dallas showing here. Good times.
>distant bottle drop
At least someone on Japan realized how full of shit were everyone on Rebuild and how unfair was Shinji's treatment
my friend was all like, "why doesn't shinji fuck rei, id tear that shit up, is he gay or something?" I didnt know what to tell him
"Gook" is a slur for Koreans, at least get your racism right 4chan
Its really fucking beautiful if you understand the German text in its language. All them fancy words. Poetry.
The worst thing is that Shinji at the end tried to do another impact. Yes he actually wanted to set things right but they don't know that.
Now they got legitimate proof that the betrayed them back there. Nothing to let them realize that they were in the wrong and Shinji is not really the guy that talks back.
I mean he tried desperately against all odds to fight back against injustice
This is the result
Ain't got nuthin on this
I actually kind of liked that we didn't really get to see anything outside of Shinji's perspective. Made the movie a lot more claustrophobic and tense and drove home his alienation from the rest of the world.
> for no apparent reason
Were you even paying attention? Can you not pick up on any plot point or character development that's not explicitly spelled out. Betraying Gendo is the climax of her entire character arc. The entire series was leading up to it.
Anno, what were you thinking. Nobody's going to buy that.
I once pissed in a bottle and titled it "Distillation of the Human No 1" for an intro to modern art class. Got a B+, apparently I should have chose a more culturally charged bottle. Whatever that means.
Wow I'm surprised this thread is still alive. In any case,
Do you even Eva mythology? Only reason Unit 01 could initiate third impact in EoE was because earlier it ate the S2 engine of Zeruel. Since Unit-01 was a child of Lilith and Zeruel was a child of adam, we had a merging of the two Seeds of Life which makes a border-line god. Nothing of the sort happened in 2.0, Shinji just got mad and Unit-01 blasted Zeruel's face in.
In the first episode when Unit-01 goes berserk, it's true that there is no precedent but the beginning of the series is a pretty good time to set a precedent, not the end of your second movie.
>If you want to cut the bullshit, you cut a lot of Asuka.
I highly doubt the makers of 2.0 wanted to cut the bullshit. Otherwise they wouldn't have put Mari in. How can you say Asuka's screentime isn't important? Is Misato's not important either? Rei? Either way, I'd argue Misato and Rei got shafted in the same way Asuka did.
>It has significance for Asuka in 2.0
Yeah, we can tell she keeps it around. She also wears her plugsuit head thingies all the time. I bet they're really important also.
>Just because it's not in 3.0, doesn't mean it won't be in 4.0 in the form of flashbacks.
True, but as many people have said 4.0 is gonna have to work backwards really fuckin hard to explain the shit 2.0 and 3.0 gave us.
There was a lot more to Asuka's development in NGE than flashbacks in episode 22. The series dropped hints very early on that Asuka had serious mommy and daddy issues. It's not like the series just presented Asuka the way she is until episode 22 and BAM FLASHBACK THERES YOUR EXPLANATION. That would be terrible character development.
It is true that Asuka and Misato and everyone else's screentime in Rebuild is drastically less important because Rebuild is and has been from the very first movie all about Shinji, so everyone else is reduced from fully fleshed-out character who feels like they could just as easily be starring in their own show to accessory to Shinji's development.
Uhm no. The movie focuses a lot on the two. Not just in the subtext. You get plainly stated from both that their was sth.
The song was created for EoE so the events of the series were in mind. They also knew how Air would be at that point. Asuka dead before any more interaction happened between the two.
The song could fit somewhat
BUT the original non adapted lyrics :
What did you want to do to her?
I wanted to kiss her.
But I was hurt.
She brought pain to my heart.
I hurt that girl's heart, as well.
I inflicted the greatest hurt upon her.
Because she wouldn't accept me.
I don't even accept myself.
I haven't since I felt the pain in my heart.
CHORUS: If that's so, why do you live?
If only I would die.
CHORUS: Die. Die. Die. Die.
Now these fit perfectly.
Notice the line about self hate and loving others. 100% like the movie.
This got pretty much put in the movie itself instead of just used as a song.
I definitely agree, that's one of the reasons I think 3.0 is not the only terrible Rebuild.
It could have fit perfectly if they hadn't basically thrown their relationship away in the last few episodes of the show and maybe had something similar to the manga ending with Shinji at the very least trying to save her. I always felt like the interpersonal relationships in NGE could have used a little more polish.
Instead we got Komm Süßer Tod which did not get changed too much in its adaptation
Starts directly after the kitchen scene with Asuka.
I know, I know I've let you down
But now through all the hurt & pain
It's time for me to respect
the ones you love
mean more than anything
what's done is done it feels so bad
what once was happy now is sad
I'll never love again
my world is ending
I wish that I could turn back time
cos now the guilt is all mine
can't live without
the trust from those you love
I know we can't forget the past
you can't forget love & pride
because of that, it's killing me inside
So with sadness in my heart
(I) feel the best thing I could do
is end it all
and leave forever
Very similar to the original of Everything. A more general representation of his feelings not just focused on events like the Kiss.
So with both originals going in a similar way they simply went with the far better adaptation
>Do you even Eva mythology?
You're a moron. You know the mythology has changed. Entire post of yours: INVALIDATED
Well also EYED is focused more on Shinji's shame/guilt about his relationship with Asuka, while KST is all about his anger at the world and hatred for himself. The suicidal lyrics also fit better during the Instrumentality sequence, since they resonate with both Shinji's inner torment and the manmade apocalypse he's unwittingly unleashing.
I remember this
It was fantastic
I'd agree with that. As the point in the series when we get to instrumentality I wouldn't say Asuka and Shinji's relationship is really important or central enough to the story to warrant being made the focus of the scene through the choice of song. KST fits much better with the state all the characters and especially Shinji are in at the time.
>I highly doubt the makers of 2.0 wanted to cut the bullshit. Otherwise they wouldn't have put Mari in.
One thing new, and they cut most of the BS from the original.
>Yeah, we can tell she keeps it around. She also wears her plugsuit head thingies all the time. I bet they're really important also.
...oh I get it. Dumb, butthurt Asukafag.
Nice job assuming that I assumed Rebuild mythology is the same as the old mythology. Of course the mythology changed otherwise there wouldn't be fucking beast mode and Shinji-PMS-induced third impacts.
If you're gonna change the mythology though, you should give a good reason for it and be consistent. If you just keep throwing in new things it's gonna be confusing.
For instance, in the first 2 episodes of NGE we didn't know jack shit about the series, so when Unit-01 went berserk it also served the purpose of telling us straight up that these robots aren't just robots. We don't know why the Eva can go berserk until later in the series when it's revealed that there's a mama bear soul inside of them, but it still lets us know what Evas can do. That way when Unit-01 fucks up Zeruel it's not some fucking deus ex machina that saves the day, it's an aspect of the world that was already revealed to us back in the beginning of the series as an obviously important point.
How did the Rebuilds handle this? Beginning of 1.0 they put in the same berserker scene. Beginning of 2.0 they put in beast mode. Well hurr I guess the only thing left to put in is third impact mode. The Rebuild literally gave us NO reason to believe Shinji can pull third impacts out of his ass other than the fact that he's the mc and third impact seems to be a big fucking deal.
Although since his relationship with Asuka is a huge part of his life and the reason for his despair at that point, it's reflected in the song. But the lyrics are also more vague and abstract, so the stuff about "letting you down" and so on can easily be applied more broadly to the series' theme of the perils of interpersonal relationships and failure of communication. Which, it's suggested, this moment represents for both Shinji individually and humanity as a whole.
Yeah we don't get much interaction between the two in the last episodes. I mean we get 22 for Asukas view but Shinjis side is left almost completely open until the movie. Just one weak attempt to look after her.
Could be because both are pretty much completely fucked later on.
Well him not trying isn't actually that bad for us to understand him.
He breaks down after the event in the hospital and constantly calls out only her name for the next minutes. He cares for her but he is simply too broken. "I did sth terrible to Asuka ... I just want to die"
That shows us his views too.
Similar to 22.
We get extremely important interaction between the two before instrumentality and the song starts.
Its just the tone is wrong.
With 22 - EoE in mind we don't look at simple stuff like a half hearted kiss. Its guilt and pain. Self hatred and rejection.
Thats what both songs wanted but only Komm delivered.
> cut most of the BS from the original
What BS? The character development? The world building? The establishment of a complex web of interpersonal relationships and backstories that made the characters feel like real people and not just Anime Characters?
Do we know that EYED was considered for use during the Instrumentality sequence? For a while I sort of figured that it was meant for the credits, but maybe scrapped because they decided to put the credits in the middle and not at the end (so instead we got a song about Rei).
What is this BS you speak of? Interesting, memorable characters outside of the MC?
My point still stands, because even if Asuka's characterization and whatever other "BS" you speak of was cut out for the sake of being BS, the creators of 2.0 would still be idiots because they put in fucking Mari, the living example of a bullshit character.
>Dumb, butthurt Asukafag.
Nice job resorting to ad hominem because you can't muster up the brainpower to counter my points.
It kept that for the most important characters, but cut swathes of filler content - there's no Jet Alone, and everything serves some purpose.
We have no clue what happened to Shinji during those 14 years.
For all we know he was responsible for third impact and he just doesn't remember.
You don't have any points. You just have butthurt. Hating on an unfinished character by 2.0 makes no sense; but by now sure, feel free.
I have to call it as I see it.
Yeah Asuka and Shinji's relationship is definitely important but there's just not enough there to say its the driving force or motivating factor behind any of whats happening. KST can be applied to pretty much the entire situation so it's really a better fit.
Honestly though I'd have preferred a stronger focus on Asuka and Shinji. To me it seems like the natural way to move character development along since they're so similar at their core but distinctly different in how they present themselves to the world. Not like anyone would complain if the series was full of Both of You, Dance Like You Want to Wins quality episodes.
KST has also heavy focus on love for others too as you can see in the posted lyrics. Its not just hatred
But I agree that its covers a wider angle and fits a bit better with the scenes during instrumentality.
Well the kitchen scene is what ultimately starts Instrumentality. It is the exact breaking point for him.
Its just that the scenes afterwards are more general showing people on the world etc. Komm Süßer Tod is better that way. Everything describes better what actually happens in the kitchen.
Komm Süßer Tod is a better description which has both.
Love Guilt and then also a lot of Pain. Everything just has 1 line for that
>Nice job assuming that I assumed Rebuild mythology is the same as the old mythology
You did that by making assumptions yourself. It changed, hence you can't say it doesn't make sense.
They don't have to supply a single reason to change anything, and you're not using logic but just sarcasm and thinly veiled butthurt. There's noone that's going to see you as anything but a butthurt asukafag if you continue like this.
They merely have to back up what they changed by some device, which by 3.0 they haven't so yeah it's not good. But by 2.0, you don't know that. The problem lies with 3.0.
I get you're mad because of Asuka, but tone it down. The characters in 2.0 feel like pretty real people to me, didn't you notice the sweet point about Rei developing, as well as Asuka developing?
It's less complex since there's less Ritsuko, but that was true already by 1.0.
Your expectations were wrong.
>There was a lot more to Asuka's development in NGE than flashbacks in episode 22. The series dropped hints very early on that Asuka had serious mommy and daddy issues. It's not like the series just presented Asuka the way she is until episode 22 and BAM FLASHBACK THERES YOUR EXPLANATION. That would be terrible character development.
Well you seem to get it, so your expectations and points about 2.0 seem completely irrelevant to me.
To make it simple for you, in a way you cannot deny:
Introduce a new character, or change development to freshen up the story and possibly deliver new themes!
Don't finish developing the characters or even try.
>everything serves some purpose.
I'm not even hating on Asuka you dumbfuck. I'm hating on 2.0's handling of her character.
Could you at least support your own points? Like your assertion that the doll has significance in 2.0? Because as far as I'm concerned, without the context of the original series, Asuka's doll in 2.0 has about as much significance as her plugsuit hairpieces.
"According to the Refrain of Evangelion booklet, Everything You've Ever Dreamed was considered as "one other possibility along with" Komm, Süsser Tod for the 3rd Impact through Instrumentality sequence."
I guess it was more intended to be for the actual kitchen scene than what comes after. Two songs would have been overkill
>Not like anyone would complain if the series was full of Both of You, Dance Like You Want to Wins quality episodes.
They are the worst episodes, and they are also the least missed.
>I'm not even hating on Asuka you dumbfuck. I'm hating on 2.0's handling of her character.
No, you're not hating on the handling of the character, you're just looking for an excuse through which to channel your butthurt.
I don't assert anything, because as of 2.0, much like the characterization in early NGE, it cannot be asserted to have any definable extra, canon meaning yet. In short, you're approaching this from the wrong angle and this is why your posts are extremely convoluted and self-contradictory, not to mention outright wrong at some places.
You're also wrong in making an assertion about the hairpieces vs doll, which can easily be proved just by looking at 2.0:
Asuka makes no personal connection or remarks with the hairclips, but with the doll.
You're so blinded by butthurt you can't even see simple things like these any more.
He got absorbed right at the end. Nothing happened to him in 14 years.
Still people have to realize that his farther revealed himself as a villain afterwards. Probably thought he was working with him. Didnt help that Gendo was always saying "exactly as planned"
Yeah KST was definitely the right choice and him not getting in the Eva fit better for the movie that Anno was making and it turned out fine. I'm just musing at what could have been.
The scene is the breaking point but really it didn't have to be Asuka that pushed him over the edge, you could construct a different scenario with Misato or even Rei if you had to that had the same end result. Asuka was important but not essential, which is why KST is the better choice.
As far as character development goes, it's one of the best.
>>everything serves some purpose.
So far, that has more or less been proven true, 1.0 + 2.0 is a far, far more effective story than NGE ever was, which was plagued by often irrelevant stuff as if it were to waste time.
Looking at even things like crowd reaction and content, it's a far superior pleaser.
Not saying Rebuild is better, because it's not.
>As far as character development goes, it's one of the best.
No, it's shit.
>As far as character development goes, it's one of the best.
You mean characterization, and it's not the best by far. It's actually outright bad in some places, and it's mostly your Asukafag speaking. Stop it.
> The characters in 2.0 feel like pretty real people to me, didn't you notice the sweet point about Rei developing, as well as Asuka developing?
You mean how Rei suddenly displays more emotion and uguu for Shinji behavior than she did in the entirety of the original series apropos of nothing? Or how Asuka suddenly has a shonen antihero turnaround and realizes that friendship and MC's dick are the coolest things ever after about 15 minutes of screentime? Yeah that's some grade-A character building.
> He got absorbed right at the end. Nothing happened to him in 14 years.
He magically teletransported from Geofront to stationary orbit
Then which ones were good? The episodes consisting entirely of flashbacks?
Please clarify for silly old me, because I don't get what the point of your post is.
And I don't agree that introducing a new character is a good idea, unless the character honestly serves some real, meaningful purpose. And you definitely don't wait until the second movie to introduce a new character because that just gives the character less time to prove themselves as a worthwhile character.
>you're not using logic but just sarcasm and thinly veiled butthurt.
Can you at least try to back up your accusations?
And can you try to at least understand what I'm arguing? I'll try to clarify. I'm arguing it's lame to introduce Shinji's ability to start third impacts halfway into a 4 movie series just so that the plot can move forward. I offer the counter-example of NGE, which introduced berserker mode in the first 2 episodes of the show to establish some facts with the viewers and also give time for berserker mode to be explained AND return in a way that is relevant to the plot.To me, NGE's handling of these plot devices made Shinji's fight with Zeruel much more enjoyable and meaningful.
>The characters in 2.0 feel like pretty real people to me
Never said they didn't feel real to me either. I even said earlier on that Asuka in 2.0 is like a more boring, ordinary version of old Asuka. I just think the characters in 2.0 are boring, watered down versions of their originals, which doesn't speak well about the movie.
>There's noone that's going to see you as anything but a butthurt asukafag if you continue like this.
Not sure why you think this is even a remotely relevant point to make on an anonymous board.
> Looking at even things like crowd reaction and content, it's a far superior pleaser.
Are you fucking serious? You're basically praising it for pandering more than the original.
Maybe the action is not the same as in many others, but it's crucial to Shinji and Asuka's relationship evolution.
I personally enjoyed it.
It is true though. 2.0 was at the time, one of the best things Rebuild could have done, because it made some important things very clear:
It wasn't just going to be HD-EVA with random stuff cut here and there. It wasn't going to be a rehash that would automatically be inferior and do nothing new but present the same in HD.
It did something new in introducing new concepts and characters, and laid the groundwork for them to be developed on par with the original, as far as it was possible.
To accomplish this, it cuts out some of the worst parts EVA has to offer, and concentrated on the most important things, in establishing old characters and transitioning them into new. Some things were lost, but to get something new, or a new direction, you need to cut something. Even the format would demand that, so it's no surprise given how 1.0 turned out.
The characters which they focus on remain complex at the same level that NGE has it using the same amount of screentime, and 2.0 takes an extra step in developing them in slightly different directions.
Now like NGE, it can't just stop there. NGE continued doing this right until the very end run, but Rebuild stops after the second movie! Imagine if Evangelion had stopped developing it's characters after episode 12 or 13. It never goes beyond the generic super robot anime it was. It doesn't even get to the introspection parts which 2.0 had, or even any of the darker stuff.
No Shinji's relationship with Asuka is pretty much central to EoE. It literally begins and ends with it.
Episode 14 is actually one of the best ones.
Yeah, exactly.... I enjoyed every episode of EVA, and I enjoyed the Rebuilds until 3.0.
>didn't you notice the sweet point about Rei developing
It seemed pretty forced, how from being the doll she was at the beginning suddenly tried to reconciliate Shinji and his father.
Not sure if sarcasm, if not, I agree
>What the hell did I just watch?
We Michal Bay+fan service now. 2 and 3 were pretty crap. Hope 4 pulls it's shit together, because right now other than better visuals, rebuild is looking pretty bad. They should have just done another full length series or at least 6 movies in all, just to properly develop characters n shit.
It's central because Shinji is down to basically no other options. It wouldn't take much to change that situation plot wise. I get that there's some things left unsaid that were suppose to infer, but even keeping that in mind it still doesn't come across as them really needing each other.
>is definitely important
>not enough to say its the driving force or motivating factor behind ANY of whats happening
I'd say if its important than it is obviously a part of the driving factor of what is happening.
The hospital, her death AND then the kitchen scene is somewhat why he changes from
helpless sad > depressed I don't want to do anything to EVERYONE HAS TO DIE
It is pretty much the last drop that lets him slip. The kitchen was the absolute last attempt at reaching out to Asuka. The only person that is similar to him. He wanted to help her and get helped too.
KST just covers also the point up until then. Misato, Rei and Kawo deaths for example or his parents.
Episode 14 is where shit gets real, with the flashbacks. Where the story and characters really begins to unfold. So the flashbacks, which in reality are events narrated by SEELE which lets you know where things are going.... they are good for plot.
Not exactly, because that needn't be because of pandering. It could be a pacing issue, or even poor quality. Pandering isn't exactly it, since it doesn't pander to everyone.
>sarcasm and thinly veiled butthurt.
>Can you at least try to back up your accusations?
>That way when Unit-01 fucks up Zeruel it's not some fucking deus ex machina that saves the day
There, a citation from you.
You're so mad you don't even know what Deus Ex Machina means.
>I'm arguing it's lame to introduce Shinji's ability to start third impacts halfway into a 4 movie series just so that the plot can move forward.
I'm arguing that it's not. I'm arguing it's one of the best moves they did, since it firmly asserts that it's new and makes for one hell of a cliffhanger. It happens at the end, so there is no problem, for it to be truly good it needs to be explored a bit.
>. I even said earlier on that Asuka in 2.0 is like a more boring, ordinary version of old Asuka.
To you maybe. I didn't find her boring. You'll perhaps be disappointed to know that today's Asuka is the most popular Asuka has been in the fanbase - she's not boring.
>Not sure why you think this is even a remotely relevant point to make on an anonymous board.
It's important because once you accept that, you can stop avoiding what really makes you angry. It's better to be honest.
I haven't actually watched the original series and neither has a friend.
Is it the sort of show you want to marathon with talkative homies?
He's got a reasonably high power level, if that helps.
It's one of the most natural things in 2.0, watch 1.0 and then 2.0 - not one person questions it before you tried to feint a point right now. That's a success.
>Not sure why you think this is even a remotely relevant point to make on an anonymous board.
Because he's not actually discussing with you, he's trying to make you out as a fool to the rest of the board by spinning your arguments as butthurt waifufag.
Not him, just jumping in on this
>I can't form a decent argument so I'll just call you an Asukafag
That episode isn't one of the best but it had some pretty important moments in it, like Asuka's Wall of Jericho comment to Shinji and her finding out that he tried to kiss her in her sleep. We find out pretty convincingly that Asuka wants Shinji and the two develop a level of closeness that sets them up for the bad part of the hedgehog's dilemma.
Also, how is the episode outright bad at some parts?
>irrelevant stuff as if it were to waste time.
Turning EVA into a fujo harem was gay
It actually begins with Kaworu, but that's another discussion for another time.
Their relationship is important but not really as much as it was featured, no. We still have plot and characters to consider, and then when you prioritize, you'll see that the only one that places too much importance on it, is you.
Shipping is poison. Let go.
The action, plot and story quality so on is sub-par, to say the least. It's actually down-right silly on a level even 1.0 or 2.0 doesn't reach, I'm not saying 3.0 because cat EVA. The moment where EVA was truly a super-robot show free of all hardships and weight of the world, were during those episodes.
>high power level
>hasn't watched EVA
also no, it's depressing as shit
>Is it the sort of show you want to marathon with talkative homies?
At some points, yes. At other times, if you're not paying attention, you're going to miss important plot points. Especially towards the last 2/3rds.
There are countless people I've talked to about the show where they claimed they understood it, but missed critical parts of the show like Rei being shinji's mother or Shinji's mother being the soul of the eva.
>>irrelevant stuff as if it were to waste time.
Jet Alone, for instance.
EVA was always gay.
Yeah its appropriate to call Asukafaggotry here since all you care about is the shipping relationship between the two. It's important to you, but there's more to EVA than your shipping fantasies. There's a whole world, and a huge cast of characters that act as more than foils.
You need to move on.
This. Good riddance to pleb western shit.
He IS a butthurt waifufag. We're missing the real issues regarding Rebuild's overall quality here, and comparing minute details in a remake that's difference is pointless.
We'll be stuck comparing frames and coloring at this point. That's just autistic.
I'd agree about episode 14. Flashbacks aren't inherently bad, but as far as characters go you can substitute interaction and inference from it in place of having to show exactly what happened.
I phrased that poorly. What I'm trying to get at is that Asuka wasn't the only one who could have filled that role of emotional catalyst for Shinji's downward spiral.
We did Madoka.
So, watch and then rewatch if I want to figure out what the fuck is going on?
I agree it was important to the Rebuilds to branch off from the original, because a direct remake would just be a cash-cow. It's just that 2.0 did a bad job of it (not as bad as 3.0, but still a bad job).
Introducing new concepts and new characters for the sake of introducing new things is not innately good. It has to be well executed.
Mari is not a good new character.
Beast mode has proven to be a new concept that serves no purpose other than to give us a good action scene.
What were the worst things EVA had to offer? Inconsistent animation comes to mind. What else?
2.0 does a terrible job of establishing old characters.
See >>100295896 and >>100295940
>The characters which they focus on remain complex at the same level that NGE has it
This guy gives a pretty good rundown of what went wrong with Misato and Asuka. Start at like 5:20 or so
I'm not criticizing Rebuild for being different, I'm criticizing Rebuild for doing a bad job of being different.
Do you even Eva? Shinji wants the D in every version.
Pretty much, yeah.
There's a lot of subtle points in the show that are a lot more obvious the second time around.
Also, be sure to watch End of Evangelion. It's mandatory.
The flashbacks are also removed from Rebuild. They too, even good, weren't important and one of the changes, and you might be starting to catch on, were to remove them and actually introduce them earlier in the overall schedule.
Instead of being introduced in what would-be 3.0, they are now present in 2.0 through SEELE's cryptic exhanges as well as Gendo's machinations.
Instead of focusing on Asuka only, consider the total of everything and how 2.0 actually makes it possible to do something entirely new, which was it purpose.
You can argue that it was a waste, but then you'd also have to argue that Rebuild should never have been made. Which I may agree on, but what's done is done. You can (not) undo either 1.0, 2.0 or 3.0.
Compared to how many shit Shinji did you Rei at NGE; Rebuild Rei's mind changes all of a sudden.
No. Asuka was a stand in for Shinji's inability to connect to people and sexual frustration. It's not a relationship.
I'm the guy you were calling an Asukafag and I don't give a shit about the ship. I'd just like it if some of the characters could have something beyond a superficial relationship. I'd say the same thing about Rei but that's a whole other load of shit because she has to die two thirds of the way through everything.
>It's just that 2.0 did a bad job of it (not as bad as 3.0, but still a bad job).
I disagree for all the aforementioned reasons. It keeps the tone of the original completely intact, and whether or not what they make of the new concepts is good, is also irrelevant.
2.0 needs to introduce and spark interest, to tie it with the plot and evne character - which you must agree that it succeeded in.
Just like in NGE, the things you see for what, 12-13 episodes, aren't touched on before later. Things that come later aren't touched on either, which is why most EVA fans leave from the experience confused and seek help in wiki's and others.
Beast mode was actually a legitimately interesting concept as introduced. Military exploitation of innate traits in EVA's - could even make commentary on humanity if they so wanted. The problem was in it's entirety that 2.0 did a lot of good, that wasn't made better and transformed into the EVA standard.
>Beast mode has proven to be a new concept that serves no purpose other than to give us a good action scene.
Even with that the beast mode is still based on the mythology and Eva technical specifications given on NGE; it's not such a bad work
>I'm the guy you were calling an Asukafag and I don't give a shit about the ship. I'd just like it if some of the characters could have something beyond a superficial relationship.
Well, for the record, in 2.0 they do. Even more clearly than before perhaps. Their relationship would normally, had they used 3.0 and 4.0 to finish it off, grown to a level both you and I find acceptable. To believe that the entirety of the quality should be present before the first half is even over, is completely illogical and irrational.
Rome wasn't built in a day, and when episode 12/13 was aired you had a bunch of generic characters except MAYBE Rei beacuse "oh so orginal".
They both love one each other and fruit of their love they had many beautiful children. And you cannot make me think otherwise.
Well but I say Asuka fits the best for that. She had a similar back story like him. The movie is constructed the way to put her in that place.
She was his last option. She embodies the combination of hatred and love through misunderstanding like Rei and Misato could never do. How would Misato or Rei bring him to kill them ?
She directly reflects the big parts from KST
Guilt about what he has done (Pain)
Never being able to love anyone anymore (Love)
All can go to hell (Anger)
>You're so mad you don't even know what Deus Ex Machina means.
From Merriam Webster: a character or thing that suddenly enters the story in a novel, play, movie, etc., and solves a problem that had previously seemed impossible to solve
>oh no, Zeruel beat all the evas and I ran out of power. This problem is impossible to solve
>DON'T WORRY THOUGH I CAN PULL THIRD IMPACTS OUT OF MY ASS AND THIS HAS NEVER BEEN IMPLIED BEFORE.
>firmly asserts that it's new
Weak reason to call something good. New for the sake of new is not good. Good new is good. Bad new is bad. I'm saying this example is a bad new.
But, I will concede that
>makes for one hell of a cliffhanger. It happens at the end, so there is no problem, for it to be truly good it needs to be explored a bit.
is a pretty valid point. This comes down to taste, personally my frustration that it was never foreshadowed overrides the positives of being a cliffhanger.
>today's Asuka is the most popular Asuka has been in the fanbase - she's not boring.
She's not boring because she's cute, tsundere and gives us pantyshots in 2.0. Also, in 3.0 she gets an eyepatch and a really nice looking hat.
Appreciating Shikinami over Soyru for these aesthetic reasons warrants usage of the term "Asukafag", even though I dislike that term and would rather call it having shallow taste.
You know, beast mode, impacts, the vatican treaty, the moon base, the various NERV installations, IPEA, it was all fucking fantastic. An expanded Evangelion world, potential for politics, more clear factional conflict within NERV/SEELE, I don't really know what more they could have asked for.
Beast Mode, that's what... a controlled berserk? Experimental feature? How would it work, why would it work, there's so much to answer.
If this was anything like the original EVA, 3.0 would be where we get flashbacks into NERV juxtaposed with the current tumultous situation, while developing the cast since everything seems to be tumbling down.
This would also solve any problem you'd have with 2.0 and 1.0.
It's a terribly terribly done Death & Rebirth movie, so yeah it's shit.
But if you compare Shinji's actions ,seriously or not, with the old series you will notice the "pro-activity" he has now.
Resuming and using shitty greentext examples :
>Shinji get in the Robot
>*Shinji gets in the Robot*
>"yeah what now?"
>Shinji lets take out the spears
>"Fuck you I don't need you I will do it"
He mans up more than in the series that's a fucking given, and It backfires everytime for shit and giggles
Oh fuck. I completely forgot about that episode.
Welp, I still maintain that Rebuild has a lot of pointless filler also.
What are the issues that regard Rebuild's overall quality?
Surface-level like-ability of the characters?
Nice action sequences?
Nobody's denying Rebuild has those. It's just that the original series had much more to offer than that, and the Rebuild's treatment of Eva's characters is frustrating to a lot of anons here.
>From Merriam Webster: a character or thing that suddenly enters the story in a novel, play, movie, etc., and solves a problem that had previously seemed impossible to solve
Which means Beast Mode isn't a Deus Ex Machinae, since it solves nothing as of yet, and secondly, it's neither a character or thing, it's a function of the already-introduced EVA02. It's like reading a mystery novel, and then calling the gun the coated man pulls out of his coat for a Deus Ex Machinae. Let's say, if Kaworu wasn't introduced in 1.0 or 2.0, but still intervened, he'd be a Deus Ex Machinae.
>New for the sake of new is not good.
I agree, but also since it's function, and what decides if it was good or not, is it's value as a cliffhanger and statement, means that the introduction was good. You can argue the continuation wasn't, but the introduction? Nope.
>She's not boring because she's cute, tsundere and gives us pantyshots in 2.0.
Yeah, which was also true for the original anime. Cute, tsundere, and pantyshots, you seem to be forgetting that she was literally introduced with a panty-flash. Then we go on to peeking her change, and so on.
>Also, in 3.0 she gets an eyepatch and a really nice looking hat.
She does. It seems the average Asuka fan isn't into deep characters, but more relationships with Shinji.
I actually like how everyone was moving along in 2.0 even if it was a little forced and it did seem like something might come of it. Obviously that didn't happen because The Master strikes again.
Don't misunderstand I wouldn't want everyone to show up and instantly be best buds. But I also don't want everyone to stall out when they hit that point where they might actually make a connection.
The problem is it doesn't feel like there's any love there, just some kind of dysfunctional co-dependency.
>Welp, I still maintain that Rebuild has a lot of pointless filler also.
Back at you:
>What are the issues that regard Rebuild's overall quality?
Those you point out aren't it, obviously, they contribute but they aren't enough.
I've given it some thought, and I've reached the conclusion that it doesn't try seriously enough from the start. Since 1.0, it's occupied with either being a shot-for-shot remake, and introducing plot devices and elements to later be useful comparatively early with NGE.
But even with this, you should be able to concede that they could make for a decent attempt still. It was three movies at first, then four. It'd be pretty hard, but they would have to cut something.
I can recognize that it's trying somewhat with the first and second movie, but the third one is where it halves to a stop. It doesn't try any more, it's gone full-time into being "social commentary", rather than anything else. Social commentary without sufficient backing in the characters, that does not work.
It breaks at the middle when 3.0 does not make the best out of what they had.
>Oh fuck. I completely forgot about that episode.
You forgot about Jet Alone? Man, that's harsh. He was cool, even if he's basically worthless in the grand scheme of things.
>It keeps the tone of the original completely intact
I disagree. NGE made it pretty clear early on that the show would be a personal one. It was almost unsettling how little the original series seemed to care about the larger-scale concerns, as it made only passing reference to things like people leaving the city in fear of the angel battles and international politics. 2.0 skimmed over personal character moments and focused more on the post-apocalyptic setting. Which in itself isn't a bad thing, this is a nice example of Rebuild trying to separate itself from the original. But 2.0 ultimately didn't offer anything really new or compelling, I mean I guess it was cool to see the children so amazed by sea-life and blue water but it's not something that really stuck with me.
It's cool that 2.0 introduced a bunch of new things but these really should have at least been hinted at back in 1.0. You can't just introduce new ideas and then throw all the responsibility and blame on your sequel for not building on them at all.
>It's cool that 2.0 introduced a bunch of new things but these really should have at least been hinted at back in 1.0
Why? To be fair, kaworu on the moon on lilith in the basement did signal a lot of things.
You can introduce new ideas as much as you'd like, but it's your responsibility to make sure they grow into something. Since EVA is a long story, you can blame the sequel and even the ending. Consider that NGE was all new for instance.
People did it for a full year when NGE introduced so much and left you with episode 26. It later made EoE.
The only thing is timing - introducing them in 2.0 is a good idea, even 1.0 - but 3.0, and towards the end, it becomes increasingly more difficult and even damaging to do so.
Uh, I was referring to Shinji's Third Impact as Deus ex Machina. Not Beast mode. Beast mode didn't solve any problem, as you said.
Asuka had a lot more to offer in the original series, I don't know how you can try to deny that. She was introduced as the cute, angry tsundere character but the show quickly went to work revealing important things like WHY she's like that and HOW these things cause her to suffer. These are the things that ultimately make Asuka memorable to me, even if her aesthetic properties are what initially drew me to her.
I agree that the Rebuilds never tried seriously to be as good as NGE was. What I've been arguing all this time is that 2.0 is when things really started going downhill.
>I disagree. NGE made it pretty clear early on that the show would be a personal one.
I think 2.0 and 1.0 established that as well. The Angel fights bottoms up in personal issues or introductions. It didn't make just passing thoughts of people leaving or being afraid, don't forget the scene at the shops or shelter comments.
2.0 did skim over a lot, and left a lot out moreso than 1.0 did. But the tone? It's more or less cheery, even a bit darker than the original. The sea-life and water, it's all red now in 3.0. If 3.0 was a better movie, maybe you and I would care more. It builds the world, 2.0, like NGE did in it's time.
The difference is, that NGE didn't stop.
>You can introduce new ideas as much as you'd like, but it's your responsibility to make sure they grow into something
This is what I'm saying. You are asserting that since NGE is a pretty long continuous series, it's okay to group all the releases into one entity and say the first 2 releases so far have been fine and the third one flopped on its responsibilities.
That might be okay with weekly released 25 minute long episodes. This obviously doesn't apply to the rebuilds. It's pretty lame in 2.0 to throw in ideas like beast mode and the vatican treaty out of absolutely nowhere and then leave them untouched with only the promise of a sequel to come in 2 years. If you're releasing a 4 film series over the span of over half a decade, each film needs to be able to stand on its own.
>suka had a lot more to offer in the original series, I don't know how you can try to deny that
Relax, I'm not denying it. I'd say every single character had more to offer in NGE, but when 2.0 came along, there was a chance you'd get a few to offer something more. Might not be your favourite, but that's that.
Shinji's Impact, isn't a deus ex either since it's also a function of the EVA. It's foreshadowed a little even. You need an entirely new element, like an alien species or something that's foreign to the setting. The EVA isn't, and it's even established as a thing that holds unknown functions they don't know of. It can't be called a deus ex machinae.
Aliens invading new york, for instance - they don't have to solve anything, could just as well end something.
Probably because both of them are dysfunctional. That's exactly why they can't interact with each other although they want to. They results are actually the exact opposite what you would think of a co dependency. They mostly hurt each other.
Instrumentality describes it good :
Shinji wants to reach out to her but she rejects him because he never even managed to love himself in the first place, only hurts her and she accuses him of only doing it for himself.
He understands that he can learn to love himself and that there will be pain but he accepts it because :
"At the time his feelings were Real" showing a picture of his friends including Asuka
When they wake up on the beach they try again. Even though there is pain. That is the story of Eva. Trying again although it actually hurts you.
But I can totally see your view even with this. Its just a different interpretation. Both completely valid.
Mari has her use, her character isn't over - it's not good, but it's not over. You don't see a mention of Jet Alone two thirds into the show. She's still there.
>I agree that the Rebuilds never tried seriously to be as good as NGE was. What I've been arguing all this time is that 2.0 is when things really started going downhill.
That's where you're wrong, since if it never tried, then it started going downhill with 1.0.
2.0 can be described as uphill climbing since that's the movie they hint at and make new stuff.
>It didn't make just passing thoughts of people leaving or being afraid, don't forget the scene at the shops or shelter comments.
But that's the point, that's all NGE did with those ideas. You're referring to when Shinji and Misato are shopping and they overhear two woman talking about their husbands wanting them to leave the city after the angel battle? Yeah, the series really didn't expand on that thought at all.
>The difference is, that NGE didn't stop.
I guess we find drastically different things important in NGE.
>That might be okay with weekly released 25 minute long episodes. This obviously doesn't apply to the rebuilds.
Because? You're not allowed to scapegoat 2.0 for something it didn't do here. It applies to the Rebuilds as well, being a clear four-parter where each and own must contribute.
As movies, not even 1.0 stands on it's own. This is especially noticeable with newcomers who didn't watch NGE who doesn't get a single thing, check out sfdebris and hear him talk as he watched both 1.0 and 2.0 for instance - 2.0 is where he finally gains confidence, and I'd say that's to the movie's credit.
>Yeah, the series really didn't expand on that thought at all.
It sets the mood however. Like in 2.0 it also sets the mood.
>I guess we find drastically different things important in NGE.
What do you mean? Everything in EVA is important to some degree, but some more than others. If you had to cut something, you would have to choose.
Well everyone gets evacuated or leaves later on which means no Hikari or Shinji friends.
They are left for themselves.
If Rebuild were to consist of movies that stood on it's own, 1.0 could not have been made the way it was, a mimic of episodes 1-6 with stuff cut here and there and added.
Rebuild can do smaller but important conclusions, like Rei and Shinji bonding in 1.0, then bonding some more in 2.0, and then Shinji losing everything by the end of 3.0. Neither of them stand on their own, because 1.0 does not explain itself nearly enough - take another mech movie - for 1.0 to stand on it's own, it would have to be more like Pacific Rim. You'd need to go behind the theory of the EVA's. You'd need to throw away the mystery-portion of Evangelion.
1.0 and 2.0 were making progress towards a whole, but were still only fully understandable by fans - it's like NGE in the beginning. 12 episodes in, you don't understand anything. But there's more to come.
After 3.0, I can't even say it's going to be as understandable as NGE was, it's more of a thing made for select members of the fanbase now.
>Mari has her use,
she kills an angel, separate and away from anyone else in the cast. This incident bears no significance on later events
Then she parachutes in on Shinji's face
and she replaces Asuka as Unit-02's pilot and fills her role of getting junked by Aereal... and then fills Kaji's role of convincing Shinji to pilot 01.
Welp, all of her 'usefulness' in 2.0 has been at the cost of other characters. That's depressing to think about.
>she kills an angel, separate and away from anyone else in the cast. This incident bears no significance on later events
It brings the Key of Nebuchadnezzar, still in play. It's also an introduction, much like the murder of Gaghiel happens away from everyone else and bears no significance on later events.
Mari is still there, and will presumably be there for her third movie.
That saved Asuka the humiliation though. She doenst have to go down the same way as NGE.
I'd agree and I'm glad we reached such a civil conclusion on this one. Seems like an uncommon occurrence in an Eva threads.