>Interview for 3D animation job>Studio is switching to 3DS 2018 for animation (Probably to save money)>Initially learned 3D on 3DS years ago but quickly switch to Maya and C4D like a big boy>Fire up 3DS, how bad can it be?>Garbage ancient UI>Finally get fucking scene set up >Rig is inheriting rotations, find out 3DS just "shows inherited values in it's non gimbal rotations".... k I use gimbal anyway>3DS shits artifacts everywhere and crashes if you delete too many key frames at once>Animation graph editor controls are god fucking awful archaic babby-Mac tier shit>Graph editor in general controls like driving a car made of peanut butterShould I even fucking stomach though this? All it is is animating a car side swiping a trash can, which I could bust out in a few hours in Maya at decent quality.Why would anyone animate in this horrendous outdated piece of shit? Is there something I'm missing? If I try to simply put the animation graph editor on my second monitor, I better not even change any of my camera view-ports or 3DS can't handle it and with fucking shit the bed and make giant screen artifacts.Sweet modeling tools I guess. Too bad they are all basically in Maya now.I'd like to get a new job but I don't even know if it's worth it if I'd have to slog through this crap. In my last job I was forced to use Maya... on a Mac. I'm having PTSD flash backs.
to my knowledge many people in the industry straight up refuse to use anything but 3ds and sketchup.for.. unknown reasons. really have no idea why, i even hear they reject people that use maya
>>573858Maybe for Arch Vis. In games and animation Maya is often utilized (as well as Max)
>doing 3D as a wagecucktsk tsk
>>573858>learn 3DS>know nothing but 3DS, don't care enough to look for better alternatives>start teaching 3D graphics classes>obviously teach only 3DS because it's the only program you knowAt least the professors I had didn't give a shit about what you were using as long as your results were quality. I felt bad for the people who knew nothing about 3D beforehand and got turned off by Max, though.
I hate 3ds and prefer mays but work in arch viz so is best program gor that. Mays suvjs for arch viz. I wish they would hurry up and merge the programs so we van gave the best of both so i can tear ofg a copy og my decent viewport and have nicer ui
>>573874They will NEVER merge the programs. The codebase is just too different and they've been developed independently for too long. Autodesk are fucking retards I can't believe they still have a monopoly on the industry. Maya fucking crashes all the time as well.
>>573903Yes merging the programs is never going to happen. 3ds is C#/Winforms and Maya is C++/Qt. If they continue to invest in improving Maya until it's simply better than 3ds in all regards it might slowly devour the 3ds userbase. This may happen in <10 years in which case any attempt to merge the programs would have been wasted.
>>574210In 10 years Maya and 3DS Max will be long dead because of Blender >Free shit has the same possibilities as shit that costs 1000+
3DS max is a pain to work with. Most game studios are switching to Maya anyway. I'd rather get kicked in the balls than using 3DS max ever again.
>>574212Why are blender fanboys so delusional? I use and love blender but this delusional community is making me sick. Blender will NEVER take over Maya. It's impossible, as Maya is teached in schools and everybody is using it. Blender will only become the industry standard when it will be widely used in 3d schools.
>>574241heyyyy then we just need to start learning it in school. 10 years is a long time in tech and its stupid to pretend you know whats going to happen.
>>574254Once again, it won't happen Blender has no customer support, this alone is a big no for game companies. And why would schools stop teaching Maya anyway?
>>574210They would have to give maya better cad compatibility and arch viz tools.
>>573854>C4D like a big boysure kid
>>573854Top softwares:1) Maya2) Max3) Modo4) Zbrush5) Microsoft Paint6) The other ones
>>574212Yeah.. I'm sure masters of the industry like WETA, ILM and Pixar are doing the switch as we speak..
>>574437blender has no customer support because the community develops the software by themselves.if you make a forum post about a problem in blender, it might reach the devs much faster than it would to autodesk. blender barely crashes
>>574212Blender offers nothing that isn't readily available in Maya. Literally not one single feature. Maya makes so many things so much easier. As usual, Blen tards delude themselves into thinking 'muh freeware' is somehow a selling point.
>>574469>Company invests a few million dollars in high profile game>uses Blender because "it's da future">Something goes wrong and the need customer support>Write their problem on blenderartists forum. The answer comes swiftly:>"Git gut feggit and watch more of that sweet Blender Guru tuts, you n00b">Problem solvedyeah, that will definitely happen with the Blender becoming industry standard and replacing Maya
>>574485>"Git gut feggit and watch more of that sweet Blender Guru tuts, you n00b"/thread
>>574485>he thinks big game studious are making calls all day for autodesk to fix their issues>he doesn't know that 3d software is comprised of plugins your technical artists can tweak
>>574488as opposed to autodesk, blender users don't have to wait months just for a patch or a fix because blender is so modular you can easily tweak the code of modifiers that break the program
>>574489kek, you can be damn sure that if you need customer service regarding a software issue, your IT department will be in touch with Autodesk, Adobe, or whoever
>>574485An artist at Epic does use Blender. Blender is used in Man in the High Castle. People from the Blender Foundation have coordinated with people working on the blender foundation films to find solutions / work arounds, many of which make their way into the official pipeline.A few million dollars is an extremely tiny budget, every indie game that gets successfully crowdfunded (that isn't a flat out scam like that black and white noir victorian murder mistory thing that only wanted $50,000) gets additional money from private investors and uses their crowdfunding success to do it.
>>574509Baby steps. If they do that for a while (years) with all kinds of productions they might get somewhere and Blender might be a good tool for Animation and VFX. atm you'll get nowhere with Blender alone unless you have Houdini to back it up.
>>574563Blender and Houdini have almost nothing to do with each other mate.
>>574437>Blender has no customer supportneither does Autodesk :^)
>>574485This. Blender itself is amazing, I used to hate it few years ago but now I really enjoy working in it. However, the blender community is ATROCIOUS (hear that in Trump's voice). Just a bunch of fanboys who spend their time spitting on autodesk software and jacking off to blender Guru.
I like 3ds max for animation with the CAT system. Modeling in it is ok but I prefer Maya or Blender for modeling because they are mode freeform. Haven't tried Maya's animation system, but the 3DS graph editor is a lot better than Blenders also the particle system is pretty nice. Just learn whatever you can because they all have their strengths and you might find that one workflow will work better for a project.
>>573854As a long 3ds max artist, i´d like to know of what the fuck are you crying about.Post some renders, stud. Let´s see your renders in max against your reders in Maya.
If you were an absolute beginner in 3dsmax, what would you do to learn as much as possible in one week?
>>574925Follow tutorials at 1.25x or 1.5x speed. You're lucky to be at the easiest part of the learning process.
>>574965Thinking of taking a week off and doing all of those chamferzone tuts. Good plan or no?
Modo fan reporting in.
>>574467I think in terms of UI Microsoft Paint would actually be above ZBrush.
>>575001Sounds like a decent plan. Doing multiple tutorials by a single author may limit you to learning only one specific workflow so if you start feeling like the tutorials become repetitive you should move on.
>>573874What's the best add-ons for arch viz?Right now I use Rhino & Maxwell but I'm thinking of switching because both programs aren't that supported and it's a pain any time I want to use a premade model of anything like lights, plants, etc.Rhino was just the standard in architecture school so I've always used it. I still love it but I could get more jobs if I learned 3DS as well.Is the standard renderer Vray? Anything else I'd need besides 3ds and vray?
>>575141For just arch viz learn 3ds and vray. If you need to you can pick up corona renderer easily if you know vray. Grant Warwick is good to listen to for paid tutes. Its stupid how unis only teach rhino when in the real world you will most likely use revit autocad and 3ds max and perhaps archicad
>>575147yeah, luckily I've used a lot of sketchup, autocad, and now revit for work so I've learned those programs outside of school.Rhino is used in school because you can generate really good 2D drawings from 3D models so your model is also how you get your CAD drawings. It's also a good drafting tool, I like it better than AutoCAD.However, I've had to turn down a few freelance offers cause I don't know 3DS. I'd like to start being able to do some really photorealistic renders. I do a lot of work for event design & trade show booths (video games etc) and rhino has worked fine for that.Pic related is an example of the kind of work I do with rhino/maxwell. A little bit of photoshop but I'm always very light on the photoshop.How much do you charge for arch viz work?
>>575149That looks good, but for photorealistic rendering you will need to work on your texturing, lighting and photoshop. The quickest way to learn would be to get a jov in an arch viz studio or at least an internship. You sjould have a portfolio strong enough for a junior position.Also get good architectural photo references and match as close as can- observe colors of lights and shadows etc.I understand that rhino is good for uni assignments but no architect is hoing to say' great, you know rhino! You're hired!' They should teacj you industry standard as well.I work in a studio as well as doing some freelance. How much i charge depends on clients and their needs- ie quality of final product etc. Its probably very different in different cities countries etc. Where are you from?
>>575151I'm from LA. I have an arch job that pays me $55k a year, I generally do about 25hrs a week for that job so it's a pretty awesome deal. I am the only guy in the office that does renderings, but 90% of my time is spent doing CAD drawings. We are now converting to Revit.I freelance on the side for a couple event companies and through a creative staffing agency, all renders. I charge $40/hr for that. I've made almost $8k since April just through the staffing agency. It's slowed down a bit recently though (probably because of summer) so I am looking to expand my horizons and get better.things like pic related are the kind of work I do mostly. They are quick turn around, easy money. I have lots of other stuff but the files are too big for 4chinWhat's your situation like?
>>575154I was similar to yours- worked for architect firm as 3d renderer/ modeller then got work i studio and learnt more in first few months than in 3 years working in architecture. You should start your own business - get more work and hire help etc. More money that way. However if you want to get better some time in a studio will really help.
>>575160yeah it would probably be better to have my own clients instead of going through a middle man.Most of the work I do is just a small part of the process though. These companies set up and plan the entire event, and they use me to visualize it. I only know that one aspect. as far as strictly arch viz goes, there's people (like you) that specialize in it more than I do, and I'm afraid tons of it is being outsourced to China. How do you deal with that?For my event work I need to work closely with client direction, so my work can't be taken away by someone that doesn't understand english and can't work really well with clients.Do you do strictly arch viz as your own business? I do need a way to make more money, it's expensive as fuck living here.
>>575162The quality isn't as good in china and even when it is they have different taste. Also the communication is a big factor.Set up a website and go and get clients. Network a lot, take any jobs and do a great job then as you get mote clients you can be more selective. It takes time tho.
>>575162I just do arch viz for studio abd freelance on the side for architects i have worked with and friends etc. I would like to startMy own business when i feel i have learnt enough and my skill is up with the best.
>>575165thanks, giving me some motivation. how do you find arch clients? I never see ads posted anywhere asking for arch renders. Do you just contact the firms directly?
>>575059thanksThese tuts just seem like a good place to start because they cover the whole pipeline. I actually want to learn it for Archviz stuff but I figured if I can model and texture an AKM I can do a house.>>575147>Its stupid how unis only teach rhinoYep.I think it's because of Grasshopper. The only reason Rhino is still alive. But in fact, Rhino is used a lot in the AEC industry - because of Grasshopper. Firms like BIG and Gensler have it in their pipeline and use it for concepts before moving to Revit and Archicad and the likes. And engineering firms use it for structural analysis. It's very powerful, but Rhino is just super outdated at this point. Here's an interesting video from the Substance Days at Gnomon, someone from Gensler talks about their use of Substance but also explains their pipeline a bit.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPMful-VoXADon't worry, you only have to watch the first 30 or so minutes.The real problem is that CAD software has an entirely different goal than CG software. CAD needs to be precise to produce things in the real world and conform to real world standards. Performance and looks are not that important. CG is the opposite. It does not have to be that accurate, it just needs to look good, and it does so by faking as much as it can. Just think about all the shit used to make CG look good. All the mapping, shaders, baking and all that jazz making 3D complicated is only for looks, and these CAD softwares are not tailored at all to produce content suitable for 3D/CG. That's why something like 3dsmax needs to bridge that gap.I run a small Archviz studio piggybacking on a succesful firm btw. And this is the exact thing we're struggling with, getting CAD data CG ready. And Rhino is just shit at this, but it's a decent CAD tool for early design stages and I guess thats why arch unis teach it over max. Also it's UI is much more similar to common 2D CAD software so the transition is easy.
>>575206Also, NURBS modeling is much more intuitive to architects than polymodeling or box modeling. We usually start with a blank piece of paper and sketch a bunch of lines until it resembles a building. Thats why Sketchup is so succesfull as well. It's basically the workflow architects learn and are acustomed too.There are some architects that sort of design in a box modeling way, starting with volumes and extruding stuff, but I'd say that generally it's not that intuitive of a workflow. At this point with rise of real time rendering, unis should at least teach the basics of CG tho.
>>575208My school had 1-unit classes for things like Maya and 3DS Max but I opted for workshops that focused on real-world items like model making, furniture making, etc.I don't regret it but I wish I knew grasshopper & CG better. I've been too lazy to learn since I graduated. I made myself some cool furniture at least.
>>574467hows animation in modo?
>>574466well at least using c4d you can get things done
>>574481Because it is. Because a program being free means broke highschool kids learn 3d with blender as their first and main software. And as the gap between blender and premium softwares close the tool for the job will be whatever you are more comfortable with.
>>576614Blender has been around since the late '90 and the grand canyon between it and proper software is still wide open. So, like, don't hold your breath for that.
>>575166>how do you find arch clients?Wondering this too
>>575166not sure but use this doc https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZXFalTQ0FMmZ09D5Fe1r_bMjWqWNX5_bzpjql_sVKJI/edit?usp=sharing
Is there a difference between versions of 3DS max, or is it pretty much like AutoCAD where it's been about the same for at least a decade?Reason I ask is I can either get 3DS 2018 'legally' by lying about being a student or I can torrent it, but might have to get an earlier version.What version are there the most cracked versions of Vray & other plug-ins? I want to get good at the program first before I ask my boss to buy it.We are switching to revit so by my understanding the 2 programs work with each other well. Meaning if I'm the only one that knows the program all renders will go through me.
>>574468WETA largely uses Zbrush, actually.
>>574481The reverse can be said.Every feature that Maya has, Blender probably has, and vice-versa.
>>576887How's that relevant to the discussion?
>>576959He thinks Zbrush and Maya do the same thing
>>576989Seems like it but I refuse to believe that
>>576888The reverse can be said but i call you someone who doesn't know shit or a fucking liar if you do so. Maya has a lot more features than Blender, the list of them would fill several pages.
>>577095but that's not true you faggot, do your research
>>577096I don't need no fucking research; i know and use both. Don't get so easy triggered, especially when you dealing with facts.
>>573854>>Garbage ancient UIYou mean an actual functional one with options rather than the current cancer of Sleek, Modern, Style oversubstance trash?
>>573854I have yet to find a single software that beats Max in enough ways to change.I've had to use Modo and Maya extensively and for everything they beat max in, they do 5 things worse.
>>576614>Because a program being free means broke highschool kids learn 3d with blender as their first and main software.No, it means they'll pirate Maya.
>>575001The Tim Bergholz AKM/Kukri/Mech are basically the single best use of a week of your time learning wise when it comes to tutorials.Stay the fuck away from most other tutorial sites, they tend to really blow.
>>576875There are changes that make newer versions worth it, especially improved UV tools from 2016 or 2017 as well as fixes to Maxscript that made it twice as slow in 2017
Why can't they all just copy each others features?
I'm trying to attach a few objects together and 3ds max suddenly just creates a duplicate on top of the object I try to attach. WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK EVEN3ds max never fails to amaze me with it's stupid bugs. I've been using tons of programs through life, and never ever ever did I come across something as bad as this piece of shit. Constant crashes, constant bugs, slow, ugly, it's the ultimate piece of shit of a software.
>>577227> I've been using tons of programs through lifeSaying this i think about you as a guy who already knows a bit about modelling and stuff and isn't a 20 year old who just made his first cube. Why exactly then are you using 3ds Max? For games studios use Maya + their engine for movies they use Maya and Houdini, 3ds max just isn't worth learning.
>>577227Never had this happen, maybe try using it properly.
>>577227>and never ever ever did I come across something as bad as this piece of shitkek, don't blame the software because you suck